3637 replies to this topic

[CantonJester]

One other factor was Sutcliffe.  He had established a culture in '92 that carried over into '93...  that they might not be the best (Toronto), but they weren't going to be pushed around. 

 

Last year, after yet another 10 pitch AB where Kremer failed to finish off a hitter, Ben McDonald mentioned how Sutcliffe pulled him aside and asked him a question about whether or not he wanted to be liked or have success as a big league pitcher. He then told him he needed to take back the inside part of the plate, because in doing so the batter gives up the outside part. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

I watched a couple of the Griffey Jr AB’s from that game. Gunnar has a similar swing and eerily similar way of just violently attacking the baseball. Lightning quick to the ball.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Would you trade Holliday for 1.5 yrs of Kyle Tucker? I dont know if Hou will sell and even if they do they may not move Tucker but it's reasonable that they could. Deal would prob have to be expanded but just those two being the main parts would you do it.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Yes. I think it would max our chances this year and next while not killing the future.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Would you trade Holliday for 1.5 yrs of Kyle Tucker? I dont know if Hou will sell and even if they do they may not move Tucker but it's reasonable that they could. Deal would prob have to be expanded but just those two being the main parts would you do it.

No.

[Hooded Viper]

Holliday is untouchable to me at this point.

[Slidemaster]

Would you trade Holliday for 1.5 yrs of Kyle Tucker? I dont know if Hou will sell and even if they do they may not move Tucker but it's reasonable that they could. Deal would prob have to be expanded but just those two being the main parts would you do it.

Absolutely not, nor do I think it would take Holliday to buy 1.5 years of Kyle Tucker.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Holliday is losing some luster for me. Now,  I think he's going to be a good big leaguer but I'm not sure his ceiling is super high. Of course, this could end up being thrown back at me in the future. I called Gunnar a solid reg. I was wrong. The thing is I really don't see superstar type upside with Jackson though. So I dont have him off limits right now. I'm not sure Tucker  for 1.5 years is enough either but Im trying to find someone who could be reasonably available at this deadline. He was the top player I came up with. I'd be leery trading Jackson for any pitcher. There are certainly guys playing in MLB who I'd trade him for but none of them are reasonably available. 

[Mackus]

A swap for one of the Pirates young stud pitchers might be the only thing that makes sense to me. Can't imagine it happening.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Holliday is losing some luster for me. Now, I think he's going to be a good big leaguer but I'm not sure his ceiling is super high. Of course, this could end up being thrown back at me in the future. I called Gunnar a solid reg. I was wrong. The thing is I really don't see superstar type upside with Jackson though. So I dont have him off limits right now. I'm not sure Tucker for 1.5 years is enough either but Im trying to find someone who could be reasonably available at this deadline. He was the top player I came up with. I'd be leery trading Jackson for any pitcher. There are certainly guys playing in MLB who I'd trade him for but none of them are reasonably available.

Tell me more. Why?

[jamesdean]

I would never trade Holliday for a pitcher unless he was young, proved himself to be dominant at the major league level and without a history of arm problems. Its just too risky in today's game. If you're going to trade him, I'd prefer a big bat and someone who has a solid OBP. Aren't too many of them left but that's what it would take for me.

[CantonJester]

I'd trade Holliday for Elly De La Cruz in a heartbeat. 

 

Cincy would hangup the phone though. 

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Tell me more. Why?

Obviously his situation gave him a huge leg up on other HS grads coming into the draft. I think that experience and baseball smarts/instincts have carried over into pro ball and helped him really hit the ground running. And that isnt to take away from the year he had last year at 19. He's doing well in AAA this year at 20  It's impressive. DOnt think it's shade in that way. It's just the lack of upside or a special tool. The arm isn't great. I dont think the power is gonna be plus. He's 5'11 and right now at least he doesn't lift the ball enough. More gap power.  Speed and defense just typically declines at a younger age. And he seems good in both categories but nothing special. He's clearly a good athlete in general but not a special one. So where is the potential for a special tool. His contact. His bat. THats the one tool that could be special. I'm positive he's gonna have a good approach in the Show. He will take his walks. He wont strike out. He will end up being a "professional hitter".  But I feel like for him to be a reg All Star type guy he's gotta hit on the hit tool. It's just putting pressure on that one tool to be special. If he ends up being a .290/390/. 460 2B then you've got your special talent but its a really thin line to .260/340/420 good reg territory. Im leaning closer to the latter. 

[Slidemaster]

I'd consider Holliday for 2.5 years of Skubal.

I don't know if I'd do it, but I'd consider it at least.

[BobPhelan]

Obviously his situation gave him a huge leg up on other HS grads coming into the draft. I think that experience and baseball smarts/instincts have carried over into pro ball and helped him really hit the ground running. And that isnt to take away from the year he had last year at 19. He's doing well in AAA this year at 20  It's impressive. DOnt think it's shade in that way. It's just the lack of upside or a special tool. The arm isn't great. I dont think the power is gonna be plus. He's 5'11 and right now at least he doesn't lift the ball enough. More gap power.  Speed and defense just typically declines at a younger age. And he seems good in both categories but nothing special. He's clearly a good athlete in general but not a special one. So where is the potential for a special tool. His contact. His bat. THats the one tool that could be special. I'm positive he's gonna have a good approach in the Show. He will take his walks. He wont strike out. He will end up being a "professional hitter".  But I feel like for him to be a reg All Star type guy he's gotta hit on the hit tool. It's just putting pressure on that one tool to be special. If he ends up being a .290/390/. 460 2B then you've got your special talent but its a really thin line to .260/340/420 good reg territory. Im leaning closer to the latter. 

 

The hit tool + plate discipline is his special tool. And the power is going to be better than people think. Gunnar struggled to lift the ball coming up through the system as well. 

[jamesdean]

Holliday is hardly lighting it up at AAA right now.  He got into some bad habits during his abysmal stay with the Orioles and it's taking him some time to get out of them.  The best thing he has going for him is his age with room to grow as a hitter.  Unless he gets wicked hot at some point, I'd prefer he just stay at Norfolk for the duration of the season and get some seasoning.  

[DuffMan]

Rewatching a couple of thoughts.

1. Mussina went too high at Hassleman. Bosio threw behind two Os players but I will at least give him that he threw behind them low. Both were at the hip and below. Moose hit Hassleman in the shoulder area. Hassleman may not have charged if it wasnt that high.


2. For the longest time they showed angles where you couldnt see Cal running into the mix. He always talked about this being the closest the streak came to ending so I was trying to spot him in particular. Finally, after the game was over they showed an angle where you see him get there and get caught up in the wave.

Mussina's control was so good, he probably put it right where he wanted to.

 

Wild that he didn't even get thrown out of that game though.

[Slidemaster]

I doubt they make him available, but has anyone seen Jeremiah Estrada of the Padres pitch?

Dude is ridiculous. Averaging almost 15 k/9 and has a microscopic WHIP and ERA. Hitters have no chance. And they have him in a setup role.

That's the kind of guy I want to rely on and would pay up for.

[Mackus]

3 straight bad outings for Akin, including two terrible ones. He's got an option, might be time to use it.

[You Play to Win the Game]

3 straight bad outings for Akin, including two terrible ones. He's got an option, might be time to use it.

#45 is distracted from the goings ons in the ice box of a courtroom in NYC. Get him out of here.

Bullpen needs a lot of work.