627 replies to this topic

[BSLRoseKatz]

If the org places this much weight on prospects in Spring Training who did well in AAA then Jordan Westburg makes the OD roster. If he doesn't, then we should probably be honest about how much they care about the small samples that exist in ST. 

[NewMarketSean]

Selling my GRod stock.

 

Don't let him open CDs or sneeze.

[BSLMikeLowe]

I'm curious to see how they handle him early in Norfolk. Is he back to 3 inning starts for a while?

 

I originally posted this in the ST thread. Here's the conundrum as I see it.

 

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On one hand, you can much more easily manage his innings at Norfolk to pace him for a full season.

 

On the other hand, his biggest issue in ST seemed to be going through the order the second time, something you probably aren't going to have him do very much in Norfolk if you are really managing his innings. (not to mention he's pretty much proven himself at the AAA level)

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Of course its about the service time though he wasnt great in ST and hes not stretched out. I dont get what you guys are mad about. At max he wouldve thrown 5 innings over 3 starts before the extra year of service time kicks in. If hes the 5th guy I know Phelan said he would be needed next Wed but when would he be needed after that. I havent looked st the schedule. I doubt we play 5 straight after that. And tbh the 5 innings each time over those 3 outings are unlikely. He likely is hitting his pitch count before 5 innings. They have 5 guys on the ML roster who have had some small success starting. Yes, Bradish, Kremer, and Wells deserve it over him. If we were out here trying to sell Watkins or Zimmermann as the 5th guy over him youd have more of an argumemt

[BSLRoseKatz]

We missed the playoffs by 3 games after going 7-14 in April, every game counts the same in the standings and pulling service time crap instead of taking a roster of your actual 26 best players to Fenway further signals they aren't serious about winning this year 

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Yeah 12-15 innings at most. And you aint convincing anyone he is likely better than Wells starting those 12-15 innings. Doesnt add up. Some idea that these innings he starts over Wells is some difference maker.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Yeah 12-15 innings at most. And you aint convincing anyone he is likely better than Wells starting those 12-15 innings. Doesnt add up. Some idea that these innings he starts over Wells is some difference maker.

I generally agree here (those 12-15 innings not better than Wells 12-15 innings)... but wanted them both on the roster.
With one available in relief. 

But whatever.  Decision has been made. 

I hope Rodriguez is limited to about 7 starts at AAA and up in Mid May.

 

Something like first 5 outings of 3 innings each... 6th outing 4 innings, 7th outing 5 innings. 

 

That's 24 innings... giving him +/- 126 innings in the Majors this year.

[BSLRoseKatz]

There's nothing stopping them from giving them both innings in a piggyback setup or otherwise using Wells out of the bullpen for multiple innings, etc. The trickle down from no Grayson isn't Wells starting, it's giving someone who'll probably be a worse pitcher bullpen innings, etc.

 

I'll have to see who exactly is in the OD bullpen but I am confident it'd look better with Grayson SP, Wells long relief and mystery reliever in AAA than what we'll actually get.   

[You Play to Win the Game]

Guys it’s fine. We’ll all be grateful we missed the playoffs again by a couple games when we finally go for it in 2041. Just be patient.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Guys it’s fine. We’ll all be grateful we missed the playoffs again by a couple games when we finally go for it in 2041. Just be patient.

 

In the meantime, the new draft lottery will provide all the excitement we need. All hail ping-pong balls!

[BSLRoseKatz]

In the meantime, the new draft lottery will provide all the excitement we need. All hail ping-pong balls!

 

You have to question the wisdom of the front office for building a team that won 83 games when the Pirates wisely built a team designed to acquire LSU stud Dylan Crews (currently has a 1.645 OPS playing in the SEC) 

[TwentyThirtyFive]

There's nothing stopping them from giving them both innings in a piggyback setup or otherwise using Wells out of the bullpen for multiple innings, etc. The trickle down from no Grayson isn't Wells starting, it's giving someone who'll probably be a worse pitcher bullpen innings, etc.

I'll have to see who exactly is in the OD bullpen but I am confident it'd look better with Grayson SP, Wells long relief and mystery reliever in AAA than what we'll actually get.

The innings hes gonna throw between now and the service time date will have mimimal impact. Or better put, his impact on the roster over that time would have minimal impact

[BSLMikeLowe]

You have to question the wisdom of the front office for building a team that won 83 games when the Pirates wisely built a team designed to acquire LSU stud Dylan Crews (currently has a 1.645 OPS playing in the SEC) 

 

I'll not hear such blasphemy! We have a .4% chance of getting the #1 pick for the 3rd time in 5 years. Believe!

[BSLRoseKatz]

You can tell a decision is going well when other prospects are publicly expressing their displeasure with it 

 

[mdrunning]

We missed the playoffs by 3 games after going 7-14 in April, every game counts the same in the standings and pulling service time crap instead of taking a roster of your actual 26 best players to Fenway further signals they aren't serious about winning this year 

I agree, but the trouble is, Grayson wasn't one of the five best starters in spring training. The Orioles didn't demote him, he essentially demoted himself. Of course, the counter-argument would be that he doesn't have anything left to prove in the minors and it would be better to let him iron out his problems at the major-league level.

 

I don't think service time was the primary motivation, although I'm sure it factored in. In an ideal world, Grayson would have forced the Orioles' hand with a solid spring and come North with the team. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

I agree, but the trouble is, Grayson wasn't one of the five best starters in spring training. The Orioles didn't demote him, he essentially demoted himself. Of course, the counter-argument would be that he doesn't have anything left to prove in the minors and it would be better to let him iron out his problems at the major-league level.

I don't think service time was the primary motivation, although I'm sure it factored in. In an ideal world, Grayson would have forced the Orioles' hand with a solid spring and come North with the team.

No he didn’t. Did Westburg demote himself too?

Should we go through the spring stats league wide and circle all the vets who have demoted themselves this spring?

[Mackus]

Something like first 5 outings of 3 innings each... 6th outing 4 innings, 7th outing 5 innings. 

 

That's 24 innings... giving him +/- 126 innings in the Majors this year.

 

Don't have anything to back this up, but I would argue that innings accumulated in 3-inning limited outings might not burn off any of his 150 or whatever limit he's gonna have for this year.  Or at least not at a one-to-one reduction.  So for the path you describe, maybe that only burns off 10-15 innings and he can still go 135-140 in MLB.

 

They'll never say publicly but I'd love to hear the approach of the Orioles (and other teams) on this.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Don't have anything to back this up, but I would argue that innings accumulated in 3-inning limited outings might not burn off any of his 150 or whatever limit he's gonna have for this year. Or at least not at a one-to-one reduction. So for the path you describe, maybe that only burns off 10-15 innings and he can still go 135-140 in MLB.

They'll never say publicly but I'd love to hear the approach of the Orioles (and other teams) on this.

This could be the case. I dont think there are hard and fast innings limits anyway. I.mean I think there is a hard number they wont go over but I think the window on the innings cap could be 30 innings wide. Lets just say 130-160 for example. Depending on how he looks and feels, velocity and other statcast data, how many high stress innings he threw, etc

[mdrunning]

No he didn’t. Did Westburg demote himself too?

Should we go through the spring stats league wide and circle all the vets who have demoted themselves this spring?

I'd say Grayson most certainly did, particularly when he struggled with his command. Ten earned runs, I believe, in his last 11 spring training innings. Once he's an established Major Leaguer, nobody will give a damn about his spring training stats, but for a rookie, that's about all anyone has to go on. Generally speaking, power pitchers tend to have a bit rougher time in spring training than control pitchers.

 

Westburg is in a pretty crowded room right now, and there are several guys like Frazier and Mateo who do not have minor league options. I always wondered if the Frazier signing was in anticipation of a trade that didn't/hasn't happened.

[BaltBird 24]

Frazier should've never been signed to begin with. He's a much, much more expensive version of Vavra.