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2024 Orioles General Talk


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#3421 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 10:03 AM

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#3422 Mackus

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 10:48 AM

https://x.com/MLBdre...3541853/photo/1

 

A guy who could improve a mediocre secondary so that it gets AAA hitters to whiff is exactly what this team needed at the deadline.  Good job by Elias.

 

Even if Rogers makes the All-Star team next year this will still have been a bad trade.  Help was needed immediately and he botched it as badly as you can botch a thing.  Go get Rogers as a project as the third guy you add.  He can't have been one of two SP acquired.  It'll never be anything less than stupid.


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#3423 makoman

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 10:50 AM

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Hopefully he can contribute next year. Both things can be true: the trade could still be ok for the future but was awful as a deadline deal. Would have been better as an offseason target like Irvin, do something else at the deadline more likely to help now. 


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#3424 Mackus

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:00 AM

Norby having a great debut in Miami doesn't change or worsen my opinion of the trade.  The negative aspect is entirely about Rogers' current abilities as a SP.  Fedde hasn't been great, but he's got a mid-4's ERA over 8 starts in St Louis.  Flaherty has been great for the Dodgers.  I think either guy could've been acquired for roughly the same we gave up to get Rogers, so we don't need to only compare to exotic ideas like ponying up Holliday and Basallo for Skubal.  Quality arms were available at a reasonable cost, and Elias chose Rogers instead.

 

I don't know how much difference it'd have made in the standings to have acquired either of those guys instead of Rogers.  We lost 3 of the 4 starts Rogers made before he got demoted, hard to know which games to look at as the "2nd trade acquisition" spots since he got sent down.  Possible offense would be crapping the bed badly enough for the quality of the SP to make no difference.



#3425 makoman

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:07 AM

Norby having a great debut in Miami doesn't change or worsen my opinion of the trade.  The negative aspect is entirely about Rogers' current abilities as a SP.  Fedde hasn't been great, but he's got a mid-4's ERA over 8 starts in St Louis.  Flaherty has been great for the Dodgers.  I think either guy could've been acquired for roughly the same we gave up to get Rogers, so we don't need to only compare to exotic ideas like ponying up Holliday and Basallo for Skubal.  Quality arms were available at a reasonable cost, and Elias chose a Rogers instead.

 

I don't know how much difference it'd have made in the standings to have acquired either of those guys instead of Rogers.  We lost 3 of the 4 starts Rogers made before he got demoted, hard to know which games to look at as the "2nd trade acquisition" spots since he got sent down.  Possible offense would be crapping the bed badly enough for the quality of the SP to make no difference.

Pitching has been mostly fine since the deadline, 4.5 r/g. Depends what they actually did--a better pitcher in place of Povich would have been an upgrade, but if it was in place of Suarez probably a downgrade. I also still think it's possible that Flaherty wasn't really someone they wanted due to last year. Fedde was always the question for me.



#3426 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:08 AM

Dont get me talking this dumb ass trade. It just makes my BP go up.....lol



#3427 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:38 AM

I mean you can look at Rogers analytics and hate the trade. You certainly are allowed to have liked other targets more.  But lets not look at him like he was a straight reclamation project. His results leading into the trade were enough that you could have him expected to help down the stretch



#3428 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:42 AM


I mean you can look at Rogers analytics and hate the trade. You certainly are allowed to have liked other targets more. But lets not look at him like he was a straight reclamation project. His results leading into the trade were enough that you could have him expected to help down the stretch


What are you drinking? Kinda early buy I might try it....lol

#3429 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 11:46 AM

What are you drinking? Kinda early buy I might try it....lol

Facts are facts. GO look at his numbers  in June and July



#3430 Mackus

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 12:01 PM


I mean you can look at Rogers analytics and hate the trade. You certainly are allowed to have liked other targets more. But lets not look at him like he was a straight reclamation project. His results leading into the trade were enough that you could have him expected to help down the stretch

To be so bad he had to be demoted was unexpected although not impossible to ponder. But he was not expected to help much if at all. He's worse than Kremer. #5 starters often have months where the ERA is closer to 10 than 4, they are volatile. I did and probably still do think Rogers is a real SP albeit in the Jordan Lyles zero upside, back-end model. But he's just barely within that borderline. He was an unacceptable addition the minute the trade was made. He's been even worse than those low expectations, but really bad is always a possibility when you're adding such a fringe pitcher.

#3431 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 12:09 PM

Im not dying on a Rogers hill but I at least understood the trade from a short and long term perspective when it was made. I didnt like it, and said as much, but I understood it.

#3432 Slidemaster

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 12:14 PM

Rogers pitching like Fedde or Flaherty is not the difference between the Orioles being good and the Orioles being the Orioles.

#3433 jamesdean

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 01:09 PM

Orioles starting pitching has been pretty solid, minus a few clunkers.  The bullpen has its limitations obviously with no real closer other than maybe, Cano.  Their lackluster play has been courtesy of the offense time and time again.  At this point, there's not much you can do and even if you add Westburg back to the line-up, I doubt that jump starts the whole offense.  If they manage to hang on and make the play-offs, it's going to come down to the pitching to save the day.  



#3434 Mackus

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 01:28 PM

Won't go so far as to say I think the offense will turn a switch and hit well on the postseason, but I know that they can. The last month or so has been utterly incomprehensible to me in terms of the entire offense falling off a cliff. Not quite everyone ice cold, but as close to that as is practical. I think it's well below the true talent level, and that's the thing that gives me some fleeting hope for October.

#3435 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 03:34 PM

Mike Elias provided injury updates:
 
Grayson Rodriguez: “Time and calendar is not exactly our friend here.” TBD on return.
Ryan Mountcastle is in FL for rehab and could join Norfolk this week for games.
Jordan Westburg is hitting BP; expected back before season end. Urías too.
 
 
 
Danny Coulombe will pitch tomorrow in a rehab start now that Norfolk’s game today was rained out


#3436 makoman

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 03:59 PM

That's annoying about Grayson. I get that it's getting a little late to make sure a starter is fully stretched out after missing that much time. Maybe he can be a bullpen weapon and Burnes, Eflin, Suarez is a good enough top 3. Lord knows we could use another bullpen weapon.



#3437 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 04:15 PM

Running out of daylight so to speak. Need all the help back we can get.



#3438 BobPhelan

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 05:24 PM

Hopefully GRod can at least help out of the bullpen.

#3439 85Knight

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 06:34 PM

Hopefully GRod can at least help out of the bullpen.


At this point that's probably the most we can hope for. That could be a helluva weapon though.

#3440 makoman

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Posted 17 September 2024 - 06:46 PM

At this point that's probably the most we can hope for. That could be a helluva weapon though.

Yeah the playoffs are a different animal. It's no surprise if a starter gets pulled in like the 3rd because he starts to waiver, you can't just throw a playoff game. If there's trouble and you can turn to Grayson to shut down innings 3-7 that's a huge deal.

 

None of it matters if we can't hit though. 






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