412 replies to this topic

[BSLChrisStoner]

Not a lot of talk about the defense. They certainly weren't bad, but they weren't great either. A touchdown and 4 FG attempts is fine, but with no turnovers forced, we needed more.

Run game and defense was the recipe for victory. Run game did damage but wasn't called on enough. Defense certainly showed up, but wasn't dominant even though ultimately 13 points allowed is a very good result.

The defense did step up and make a really big stop after the Robinson fumble. To push that drive backwards and force a punt kept the game alive at that point.

Think it's difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from the defense.  They're good.  They're not elite. They did their job. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

Think it's difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from the defense. They're good. They're not elite. They did their job.

Is it difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from Lamar?

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Is it difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from Lamar?

He hasnt played in 3 games

 

 

The offense was slowing down a bit with Lamar. I believe we were still top 6 or 7 in offense efficiency rankings through the Jags game. Or in other words the last Lamar game.   Still 5th overall in DVOA entering this week even with the Den and Pitt Huntley stinkers. We've never once been as bad this season as you've thought we've been all season. You throw around the word mediocrity a lot but there really has been nothing to back that up until the last 3 weeks. And we've somehow won 2 of those 3. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

He hasnt played in 3 games

When he says the defense is good, not elite, I assume he’s talking about the body of work, just as I am with my question. Just seems like some double standards exist.

[Mackus]

Think it's difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from the defense. They're good. They're not elite. They did their job.

Agree they did their job, but I think we needed to get more from them to win a road game with Huntley at QB though. Especially against an offense that is in some state of disarray with Watson at QB.

Big ask, I agree. But to win with a backup QB someone else has to pick up the slack. They more or less did that the past two weeks, save for the late TD drive for Pittsburgh.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

He hasnt played in 3 games

 

 

The offense was slowing down a bit with Lamar. I believe we were still top 6 or 7 in offense efficiency rankings through the Jags game. Or in other words the last Lamar game.   Still 5th overall in DVOA entering this week even with the Den and Pitt Huntley stinkers. We've never once been as bad this season as you've thought we've been all season. You throw around the word mediocrity a lot but there really has been nothing to back that up until the last 3 weeks. And we've somehow won 2 of those 3. 

Hell, we were still 6th in offensive DVOA after last week. SO I know we had to be through the Jags game. That Den game was an offensive mess and Pitt wasnt great either

[You Play to Win the Game]

Yeah it’s a mediocre offense, I don’t give a damn what you say. I watch all the games. Even if you disagree with that, they certainly aren’t elite, and that can’t be debated. They’ve struggled through a last place schedule. Have had very little consistency. DVOA can blow me where the pampers is.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Yeah it’s a mediocre offense, I don’t give a damn what you say. I watch all the games.

Eyes lie. It hasnt always been pretty or consistent but its been efficient You have a passing bias. Which is fine but it skews your view of overall offense. Now, I'll also say we havent been an explosive offense which also probably leads you and others to think we've been mediocre but I will take an efficient offense all day over looking the prettiest

[You Play to Win the Game]

Eyes lie. It hasnt always been pretty or consistent but its been efficient You have a passing bias. Which is fine but it skews your view of overall offense. Now, I'll also say we havent been an explosive offense which also probably leads you and others to think we've been mediocre but I will take an efficient offense all day over looking the prettiest

No it isn’t a passing bias at all. Not even close. Points scored is the only metric that matters at the end of the games. It’s an offense constantly riddled with miscues and mistakes but because they at least move the ball, DVOA loves them.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Is it difficult / borderline unfair to ask for more from Lamar?

I don't get the point. 

The defense has become a Top 10 unit.   They're not an elite group though, they have limitations.

Over their last 6 games, they've held 4 opponents to 14 points or less.  They are doing their job. 


Re: Jackson... 

 

When you are the focal point of the team, there is always going to be more asked of you.
Some complaints some people make with him are reasonable.  Some complaints some people make with him are over-the-top for me. 

[Slidemaster]

I like Lamar. I think Lamar is a very good quarterback. I also think Lamar still thinks his value is that of the MVP all-Pro that he was 3 years ago, and won't come down off of that.

As a result, I think he's going to be a very good QB for someone else next year.

You simply can't give him 250+ guaranteed after missing time two years in a row and failing to reach the dizzying heights he did 3 years ago, especially with very little playoff success on his resume.

I'd re-sign him for 230ish with 160ish guaranteed. I'd probably even do it with 180ish guaranteed. But I think not giving him a fully guaranteed deal is a hill that DeCosta and Bisciotti will die on, and I think Lamar will demand it or not play.

It's going to get ugly.

[jamesdean]

The past two years have been pretty similar for the offense. After lighting it up for the first quarter of the season, it was all downhill with or without Lamar.

[Mike in STL]

You dont know whos at fault. Surely its not 100% either way but you want to put the disarray and penalties on the coaching staff at a very high rate and you arent qualified to do that. Not because you're sitting at home but because you dont know that the calls are coming in late and that is the reason for the disarray. If you can prove thats the main culprit then by all means.


And whats late anyway?? Its a 40 sec playclock usually. Lets say our players regularly take more time than most teams to get everything communicated and lined up. Is it on the coaches to now rush in plays because the players cant get ready in time. Is rushing in a playcall just to avoid a potential penalty a net gain if its not an ideal playcall

Harbaugh has said Roman is slow with the play calls. If you ever pay attention.

https://ebonybird.co...ay-calling/amp/

[Mackus]

You dont know whos at fault. Surely its not 100% either way but you want to put the disarray and penalties on the coaching staff at a very high rate and you arent qualified to do that. Not because you're sitting at home but because you dont know that the calls are coming in late and that is the reason for the disarray. If you can prove thats the main culprit then by all means.

Sure I do, it's ultimately the coaching staff's fault in either case. Whether the problem is that the OC is delivering the plays late or that the players are lolly gagging, the coaches have the responsibility to get it fixed. If it happened rarely we could blame the QB, but this often it's a procedural thing. Fix the process that's causing the problem. Pre-snap stuff always boils down to coaching, either something they are causing directly or something they are unable to get corrected. The Ravens playclock management is undisciplined.

And whats late anyway?? Its a 40 sec playclock usually. Lets say our players regularly take more time than most teams to get everything communicated and lined up. Is it on the coaches to now rush in plays because the players cant get ready in time. Is rushing in a playcall just to avoid a potential penalty a net gain if its not an ideal playcall

Late is if the clock influences the alignment, motion, or timing of the snap. If the players have to rush to get the snap off in time or go so far as to not be able to get it off and draw a penalty. If it's not smooth, its late. You can be smooth and still snap it at 1, so its not as simple as just how much time is left on average.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I would imagine Gus and JKD are still on a snap count. They probably didn’t feel great about how many touches JKD got against Pittsburgh.

[Biggsy]

I would imagine Gus and JKD are still on a snap count. They probably didn’t feel great about how many touches JKD got against Pittsburgh.

That's actually a good point. Which to me, makes me curious why they would not have Drake active. If you know both are on limited snaps, and you should have a run heavy game plan vs a bad run defense. Why would you not be prepared for that?

[russsnyder]

Sure I do, it's ultimately the coaching staff's fault in either case. Whether the problem is that the OC is delivering the plays late or that the players are lolly gagging, the coaches have the responsibility to get it fixed. If it happened rarely we could blame the QB, but this often it's a procedural thing. Fix the process that's causing the problem. Pre-snap stuff always boils down to coaching, either something they are causing directly or something they are unable to get corrected. The Ravens playclock management is undisciplined.

Late is if the clock influences the alignment, motion, or timing of the snap. If the players have to rush to get the snap off in time or go so far as to not be able to get it off and draw a penalty. If it's not smooth, its late. You can be smooth and still snap it at 1, so its not as simple as just how much time is left on average.

This is a really good post.

The Ravens were beaten in every aspect of the game yesterday. I think it's fair to say that they were outcoached as well.

There really is no excuse for a team to have a delay of game after a timeout or to seem rushed at the line of scrimmage when it's crunch time and it's 4th and four.

The Ravens really weren't that competitive yesterday. Beyond disappointing.

[jamesdean]

That's actually a good point. Which to me, makes me curious why they would not have Drake active. If you know both are on limited snaps, and you should have a run heavy game plan vs a bad run defense. Why would you not be prepared for that?

Or what about Justice Hill?  Use everyone if they're active.  Sorry, it's a little late in the season for players to be on snap counts. Either they're ready to play or they aren't.  Do you really think another 10 rushes for both Dobbins and Edwards would mean anything to them physically?  I think it's a lame excuse not to run the ball if that is the case. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

I think it’s reasonable for Gus and JKD to be on snap counts. I think the right play right now is doing everything you can to have the team as full strength as possible come January. If that is the case, maybe I’m wrong and they will actually have a chance. It’s definitely our best chance. But you also have to make the playoffs first.

[jamesdean]

I think it’s reasonable for Gus and JKD to be on snap counts. I think the right play right now is doing everything you can to have the team as full strength as possible come January. If that is the case, maybe I’m wrong and they will actually have a chance. It’s definitely our best chance. But you also have to make the playoffs first.

That was my point. If limiting their game action costs you games and you miss the playoffs, then you might as well just put them on injured reserve and wait until next year. You have to get there first.