783 replies to this topic

[You Play to Win the Game]

Because there isnt a who. You pray that whoever you draft isnt

There are solid QB’s you can win with all over the league. This isn’t the early ‘00s anymore where 5 teams have a QB and the rest of the league wishes they did. It isn’t as hard as it used to be. Colleges are have been going full NFL pass heavy for over a decade now and more guys are ready for the league, the schemes, etc. I mean, Lamar wasn’t even on the radar coming out, yet the assumption is that we can’t find another QB. That isn’t logical.

[Mackus]

Nah they didnt dominate. Wasnt that drive helped by a Oweh penalty on what was about to be 3rd and 5. Now I will say we were shooting ourselves in the foot all day but it didnt kill us til the end

 

 

12-play, 75-yard TD drive

Turnover on 5 plays

3-play, 13-yard TD drive

Turnover on 2 plays

 

14-0 by points, 95 to 7 by yards, forced quick turnovers on both defensive possessions

 

Whether the Giants did it to the Ravens or the Ravens did it to themselves seems irrelevant.  I've got no trouble saying that the end of that game (not the entire 4th quarter, as the Ravens had an earlier TD drive) was dominated by the Giants.  Switch was flipped, IMO.  Ravens were cruising and then everything went off the rails.  Not as dramatically as against the Dolphins, but equally as dramatically as against the Bengals.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

There are solid QB’s you can win with all over the league. This isn’t the early ‘00s anymore where 5 teams have a QB and the rest of the league wishes they did. It isn’t as hard as it used to be. Colleges are have been going full NFL pass heavy for over a decade now and more guys are ready for the league, the schemes, etc. I mean, Lamar wasn’t even on the radar coming out, yet the assumption is that we can’t find another QB. That isn’t logical.

No I already said it might work. Ill repeat, the odds of being mediocre or poor are much higher going with the next guy then paying Lamar. That is what is logical

[You Play to Win the Game]

No I already said it might work. Ill repeat, the odds of being mediocre or poor are much higher going with the next guy then paying Lamar. That is what is logical

They already are mediocre. And when they aren’t, they lose early in the playoffs. Exciting stuff.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

12-play, 75-yard TD drive

Turnover on 5 plays

3-play, 13-yard TD drive

Turnover on 2 plays

 

14-0 by points, 95 to 7 by yards, forced quick turnovers on both defensive possessions

 

Whether the Giants did it to the Ravens or the Ravens did it to themselves seems irrelevant.  I've got no trouble saying that the end of that game (not the entire 4th quarter, as the Ravens had an earlier TD drive) was dominated by the Giants.  Switch was flipped, IMO.  Ravens were cruising and then everything went off the rails.  Not as dramatically as against the Dolphins, but equally as dramatically as against the Bengals.

What Im trying to say is that even at the end when the Giants dominated, IM fine using that description, it was mostly because of what we did to ourselves not what they did to us

[TwentyThirtyFive]

They already are mediocre. And when they aren’t, they lose early in the playoffs. Exciting stuff.

So with the odds being higher to be mediocre and definitely higher to be poor vs staying with Lamar that makes it better how?

[You Play to Win the Game]

So with the odds being higher to be mediocre and definitely higher to be poor vs Lamar that makes it better how?

I disagree with the conclusion. It’s a 46 man active roster on game days. The Ravens are great at building a complete team that isn’t fully contingent on all world QB play. But let’s keep chasing the unicorn.

[jamesdean]

I usually hate to make sweeping statements only 6 games into a season but perhaps the organization has to assess whether they want an electric quarterback like Lamar who can do wonderous things with a football in his hands(usually running with it) but seems to crumble in the face of adversity with disturbing regularity or a quarterback who doesn't have his athletic gifts but is fundamentally sound, won't make mistakes at crunch time, plays smart and knows how to take an opponent out at the end?  I think it's a legitimate question, especially with the kind of money that will be at stake signing him.  I've said it before and I'll say it again....this is a pivotal year for both Lamar and the organization.    

[Slidemaster]

I disagree with the conclusion. It’s a 46 man active roster on game days. The Ravens are great at building a complete team that isn’t fully contingent on all world QB play. But let’s keep chasing the unicorn.

It is baffling to me the idea that they MUST have Lamar to win. Nobody else has Lamar, and there are plenty of good teams out there.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

The Ravens havent found a really good difference making player in the draft in forever other than Andrews. THeyve  been drafting and signing JAGS in FA and you think they can build a championship roster around a lesser talent??

[Slidemaster]

I usually hate to make sweeping statements only 6 games into a season but perhaps the organization has to assess whether they want an electric quarterback like Lamar who can do wonderous things with a football in his hands(usually running with it) but seems to crumble in the face of adversity with disturbing regularity or a quarterback who doesn't have his athletic gifts but is fundamentally sound, won't make mistakes at crunch time, plays smart and knows how to take an opponent out at the end? I think it's a legitimate question, especially with the kind of money that will be at stake signing him. I've said it before and I'll say it again....this is a pivotal year for both Lamar and the organization.

With the understanding that they are in other ways not comparable, Lamar almost reminds me of Tony Romo in the sense that he is a very talented player capable of amazing things, who seems to find ways to lose when the moment is biggest.

Now someone will say "Slide said Lamar is the same as Romo!" No, I didn't.

[Mackus]

The Ravens havent found a really good difference making player in the draft in forever other than Andrews. THeyve  been drafting and signing JAGS in FA and you think they can build a championship roster around a lesser talent??

 

If they don't fix that particular problem it doesn't really matter what they do at QB.  I'll roll the dice with Lamar still, but he needs help and the Ravens haven't been doing a good job of finding enough of it lately.  Gotta hope they do a better job of that moving forward (would also need to hope that if you trade Lamar for a bunch of #1s). 

 

The future outlook of the team relies on a lot more than the decision at quarterback.  I still think the clearest path involves Lamar even at top dollar.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

If they don't fix that particular problem it doesn't really matter what they do at QB.  I'll roll the dice with Lamar still, but he needs help and the Ravens haven't been doing a good job of finding enough of it lately.  Gotta hope they do a better job of that moving forward (would also need to hope that if you trade Lamar for a bunch of #1s). 

 

The future outlook of the team relies on a lot more than the decision at quarterback.  I still think the clearest path involves Lamar even at top dollar.

I believe this roster this year is capable of winning the SB with Lamar. Like a real chance. Not the odds on fav or 2nd odds on fav but they have a real shot. A lesser QB, the kind RIcker wants, would have no shot with this roster this year. So let this be the baseline. Yeah we need to do better finding and developing talent but if this is the baseline then we can win with a QB like Lamar not someone lesser.

[jamesdean]

With the understanding that they are in other ways not comparable, Lamar almost reminds me of Tony Romo in the sense that he is a very talented player capable of amazing things, who seems to find ways to lose when the moment is biggest.

Now someone will say "Slide said Lamar is the same as Romo!" No, I didn't.

And why has Brady won so many rings?  It can't be his natural, physical gifts.  Otherwise, he wouldn't have been drafted in the 6th round. He's a winner because of his incredible dedication, his fierce intelligence, being able to put a team on his back when it matters most and for the most part, is a deadly accurate passer.  My point being, having wonderous natural ability doesn't always translate into success at the highest level.  What irks me to distraction is I don't think Lamar himself or the team are taking full, consistent advantage of his gifts.    

[TwentyThirtyFive]

With the understanding that they are in other ways not comparable, Lamar almost reminds me of Matthew Stafford in the sense that he is a very talented player capable of amazing things, who seems to find ways to lose when the moment is biggest.

Now someone will say "Slide said Lamar is the same as Romo!" No, I didn't.

I corrected that for you because that wouldve been said this time last year but then you know things happened. Again its the stupidest argument in the book that this particular guy who is good but hasnt won a ring cant win one. Rodgers is a 3 time MVP and IMO the most talented QB to ever play the position. He won 1. He got to 1. 

[Slidemaster]

I corrected that for you because that wouldve been said this time last year but then you know things happened. Again its the stupidest argument in the book that this particular guy who is good but hasnt won a ring cant win one. Rodgers is a 3 time MVP and IMO the most talented QB to ever play the position. He won 1. He got to 1.

Again, you continue to put words in my mouth.

I said he, to this point, seems to crumble more often than not when the moment is biggest. I never said he could never win a SB.

However, if you want to make the Stafford argument that's fine. Stafford needed one of the most talented rosters in recent memory to win last year, and this year looks positively ordinary. How are they going to build the roster that LA has with Lamar taking 20+% of the cap?

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Again, you continue to put words in my mouth.

I said he, to this point, seems to crumble more often than not when the moment is biggest. I never said he could never win a SB.

Is obvious what you are implying.. You want to move on from him because of it so you didnt say we cant win with him but thats your point. Argue in good faith dude

[Slidemaster]

Is obvious what you are implying.. You want to move on from him because of it so you didnt say we cant win with him but thats your point. Argue in good faith dude

I literally said like 3 posts ago I wasn't ready to throw in the towel on him. My argument has always been that they shouldn't offer a franchise-crippling deal to him because they feel as though there is no other option.

Your incorrect perception of what my words mean is not my problem.

Argue in good faith dude.

[Mackus]

There are solid QB’s you can win with all over the league. This isn’t the early ‘00s anymore where 5 teams have a QB and the rest of the league wishes they did. It isn’t as hard as it used to be. Colleges are have been going full NFL pass heavy for over a decade now and more guys are ready for the league, the schemes, etc. I mean, Lamar wasn’t even on the radar coming out, yet the assumption is that we can’t find another QB. That isn’t logical.

 

Its really hard to find a QB, even now.  Its not impossible, but it is hard.  And if you don't have one, you can't do anything.   Shouldn't be an assumption that we can't find one, but have to weigh how hard it is to find one against how hard it is to win when so much of your cap is going to a star QB. 

 

I'm rolling with Lamar and trying to find talent to put around him with 75-85% of the cap left to spend.  Its not a great situation, but I like that better than no QB, a couple extra early picks, and the full cap to invest.  If you find a good QB with one of those picks you're better off, and way better off if you find a great QB who'll be cheap for a while.  But I still think Lamar is a great QB, and I'll take that locked in at top dollar over the gamble.  If you think Lamar is merely an ok or good QB, then I understand being more inclined to the move on.  I don't care at all about a "can't win the big one" or "always chokes" perception.  I don't think that's real, but I won't try to change anyone's mind who thinks that way.  I still think he's the most likely path to a championship over the next 5-10 years, because he'll keep you in the mix more often than not.

[Slidemaster]

Its really hard to find a QB, even now. Its not impossible, but it is hard. And if you don't have one, you can't do anything. Shouldn't be an assumption that we can't find one, but have to weigh how hard it is to find one against how hard it is to win when so much of your cap is going to a star QB.

I'm rolling with Lamar and trying to find talent to put around him with 75-85% of the cap left to spend. Its not a great situation, but I like that better than no QB, a couple extra early picks, and the full cap to invest. If you find a good QB with one of those picks you're better off, and way better off if you find a great QB who'll be cheap for a while. But I still think Lamar is a great QB, and I'll take that locked in at top dollar over the gamble. If you think Lamar is merely an ok or good QB, then I understand being more inclined to the move on. I don't care at all about a "can't win the big one" or "always chokes" perception. I don't think that's real, but I won't try to change anyone's mind who thinks that way. I still think he's the most likely path to a championship over the next 5-10 years, because he'll keep you in the mix more often than not.

How many teams have won a superbowl while fielding a roster that included a QB on a megadeal?