523 replies to this topic

[BSLChrisStoner]

ESPN+: Still-too-early 2022 MLB All-Stars: AL and NL roster predictions

https://www.espn.com...ter-predictions

[BSLChrisStoner]

CBS Sports: MLB Power Rankings: Yankees are still the clear number one, and the best mid-June team seen in a decade

https://www.cbssport...en-in-a-decade/

[Pedro Cerrano]

My soul isn’t prepared for a 115 win Yankee championship team.

[BSLChrisStoner]

My soul isn’t prepared for a 115 win Yankee championship team.

How about a 115 win Yankee team that gets bounced early from the postseason?

[Slidemaster]

Honestly, when the Orioles aren't contending, I don't care who wins it.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Still won’t change the fact that they’ve wasted billions of dollars in failures of teams the past decade. Eventually, you buy enough, it’ll work. Hopefully they get bounced early.

[Pedro Cerrano]

How about a 115 win Yankee team that gets bounced early from the postseason?

Sign me up.

[Mike B]

How about a 115 win Yankee team that gets bounced early from the postseason?

I think the first part is becoming more likely by the day.  Their pitching is excellent, the second part possible but less likely.

[BSLChrisStoner]

FanGraphs: Who is the AL's Most Irreplaceable Player in 2022?

[Slidemaster]

After watching him hit two homers and drive in 8, and then watching him embarrass the Royals to the tune of 13 KS over 8 shutout innings on consecutive nights. I don't know that I've ever seen a better all-around baseball player than Shohei Ohtani.

Holy crap. He is truly a generational player. If he stays healthy I don't see how he doesn't go down as an all-time great.

[Mike B]

After watching him hit two homers and drive in 8, and then watching him embarrass the Royals to the tune of 13 KS over 8 shutout innings on consecutive nights. I don't know that I've ever seen a better all-around baseball player than Shohei Ohtani.

Holy crap. He is truly a generational player. If he stays healthy I don't see how he doesn't go down as an all-time great.

He really is the modern day Babe Ruth.

[Slidemaster]

He really is the modern day Babe Ruth.

It's so absurd that if he continues this we're talking top 5? Top 3? If he ends his career with 2500ish hits, 450ish home runs, and 150-200 wins with the supporting peripherals to go with it, who can be called a demonstrably better overall player other than poasibly the babe himself?

I suppose you could just use WAR to compare him to others, but I actually don't even know if that's fair to use with him, as his true value is even higher given that he opens up another spot on the roster due to being able to fill starting positions in the lineup as well as as a pitcher by himself. I don't know if statistics have caught up with how to measure his real value.

[mweb08]

It's so absurd that if he continues this we're talking top 5? Top 3? If he ends his career with 2500ish hits, 450ish home runs, and 150-200 wins with the supporting peripherals to go with it, who can be called a demonstrably better overall player other than poasibly the babe himself?

I suppose you could just use WAR to compare him to others, but I actually don't even know if that's fair to use with him, as his true value is even higher given that he opens up another spot on the roster due to being able to fill starting positions in the lineup as well as as a pitcher by himself. I don't know if statistics have caught up with how to measure his real value.

That extra roster spot is nice, but I don't think it greatly changes his value. It should generally lead to an extra spot for as reliever or a specialist like a platoon bat or a speed and/or defense guy.

In all likelihood imo, his teammate will go down as the better all-time player.

This goes to show how little individual players impact success in MLB; the Angels have two transcendent players, yet they aren't even good.

[Mackus]

That extra roster spot is nice, but I don't think it greatly changes his value.

 

Wouldn't greatly change his value, but it does make him even more valuable.  Maybe like a 1 WAR bonus?  0.5?  Agree that its a back-of-the-roster type guy that the team gets to add, but that still could help quite a bit.  The O's tried to effectively add this extra roster spot under Buck when they had a lot of relievers with a lot of options and would shuttle them around frequently when they could.

 

I'm not sure how I'd try to quantify it, but I do think his value is greater than the sum of his WAR as a pitcher and WAR as a hitter.

 

I don't know if he'll ever match 2021 though.  If he does, wow.  Last year was insane.  He was top-5 amongst hitters in wOBA+ and top-20 amongst all pitchers (100+ IP) in ERA-.  Very similar to what Gerrit Cole and Aaron Judge combined to do for the Yankees (except Cole had 50 more IP which is significant).

[mweb08]

Wouldn't greatly change his value, but it does make him even more valuable. Maybe like a 1 WAR bonus? 0.5? Agree that its a back-of-the-roster type guy that the team gets to add, but that still could help quite a bit. The O's tried to effectively add this extra roster spot under Buck when they had a lot of relievers with a lot of options and would shuttle them around frequently when they could.

I'm not sure how I'd try to quantify it, but I do think his value is greater than the sum of his WAR as a pitcher and WAR as a hitter.

I don't know if he'll ever match 2021 though. If he does, wow. Last year was insane. He was top-5 amongst hitters in wOBA+ and top-20 amongst all pitchers (100+ IP) in ERA-. Very similar to what Gerrit Cole and Aaron Judge combined to do for the Yankees (except Cole had 50 more IP which is significant).

I agree it has value. .5 seems about right without deep analysis.

Note that when Buck and DD were doing it there were only 25 roster spots which made that extra spot a little more valuable.

[mweb08]

A huge impediment to Ohtani becoming a top 5 player (or even close to it) is that he didn't have an all-time great type of season until his age 26 season.

[Mackus]

A huge impediment to Ohtani becoming a top 5 player (or even close to it) is that he didn't have an all-time great type of season until his age 26 season.

 

Agree.  He's behind in the counting stats on both sides because he was a bit late to the show (at least compared to most legends) plus he lost an nearly a full early season at the plate and two on the mound.  He only had 50 career innings pitched prior to last season and still only has 250.  He'll be able to make up ground at about 2X the rate though with his dual skills.  No idea if he'll struggle early from one side or the other and convert to full-time at the other, literally nobody else to compare him to so who knows.  It'll be fun to watch.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

He will flame out as he hits 30. At least on one side. Likely pitching.

[BSLChrisStoner]

https://forum.baltim...0-shohei-otani/

[BSLChrisStoner]

FanGraphs: Who Is the NL's Most Irreplaceable Player in 2022?