127 replies to this topic

[Mike in STL]

As a follow up, my mom ended up watching the game Sunday. Not letting something she may not agree with ruin her fandom.

[SBTarheel]

Full disclosure, I didn't watch one second of the Bengals/Browns game last night, so I'm only getting my info from twitter, but I read that no one kneeled last night, but everyone locked arms at midfield during the anthem, and people are still complaining that it was "too political". 

 

is this true? And if so, it's becoming abundantly clear that many people's "anger" has zero to do with any flags or songs. 

[JeremyStrain]

This has been refuted so many times that I don't even know if it's worth the effort anymore.

The problem is that it’s really impossible to prove. We really don’t know if he would have gone to another team and totally sucked and played himself out the league or if he would have rebounded and played like he did some previous years in SF.

It’s an easy point to say he deserved a chance to show it. His resume is infinitely better than a lot of guys playing especially the back ups, but there’s always that little doubt. And with him getting blacklisted and then not accepting the couple token offers he got, it cements his legacy as not being terrible. Where if he came back there’s a chance he may have. Even if he were to come back now it’s easy to say of course he won’t be as good after not playing for years through no fault of his own.

I mean it’s the risk in a way Brady is making now. He wants to show he can win on his own it’s not just BB. But maybe he should have done that with more gas in the tank. Not taking that risk will always the what if factor but better than playing and sucking right?

[JeremyStrain]

Full disclosure, I didn't watch one second of the Bengals/Browns game last night, so I'm only getting my info from twitter, but I read that no one kneeled last night, but everyone locked arms at midfield during the anthem, and people are still complaining that it was "too political".

is this true? And if so, it's becoming abundantly clear that many people's "anger" has zero to do with any flags or songs.

Oh I think we all know that already but racists like to hide their real beliefs and justify their outrage. The unfortunate part is there are some genuine non racist people who really do get pulled into the flag/armed services fight by making it about that and then hiding.

[Old Man]

This has been refuted so many times that I don't even know if it's worth the effort anymore.

If he had talent, he would still be playing.

 

He doesnt need the money between Nike and the lawsuit money from the NFL he is set.

 

Not every team has 2 good QBs, and there is a legit need for QBs, hell, even the Ravens brought RG3 in for a look, 2 seasons ago.

 

He is playing the poor little me, martyr card. IMO

[The Epic]

The problem is that it’s really impossible to prove. We really don’t know if he would have gone to another team and totally sucked and played himself out the league or if he would have rebounded and played like he did some previous years in SF.

It’s an easy point to say he deserved a chance to show it. His resume is infinitely better than a lot of guys playing especially the back ups, but there’s always that little doubt. And with him getting blacklisted and then not accepting the couple token offers he got, it cements his legacy as not being terrible. Where if he came back there’s a chance he may have. Even if he were to come back now it’s easy to say of course he won’t be as good after not playing for years through no fault of his own.

I mean it’s the risk in a way Brady is making now. He wants to show he can win on his own it’s not just BB. But maybe he should have done that with more gas in the tank. Not taking that risk will always the what if factor but better than playing and sucking right?

 

Well there's three parts here.

 

1) He was doing this as some sort of martyrdom. His actions post-NFL have proven that to be incredibly false. There's nothing to discuss here.

 

2) He wasn't good enough to get the opportunity to suck. The QBs that have gone through the league since his departure have proven that to be incredibly false. Nobody...at all...thinks that Kap is worse than the worst backup in the NFL, from 2017 to now; the list of people that were "called up" to start at QB for various teams in 2017/2018 would have been hilarious if it wasn't so blatant.

 

Also, nobody asked, but I'll post this Kap video by SB Nation because I love it anyway. 

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=1I0cUTXwr-k

 

Do I think he'd be great upon his return? I really don't know. Do I think he'd be a valid backup option at worst? Absolutely.

 

3) He's "not worth the trouble/circus." That's entirely debatable, but other polarizing figures in this league have made their ways back to the NFL (with varying amounts of success) and people just...stopped caring. The NFL continues to make money in spite of itself. It becomes a fabric of the league and things just move on as they always have. I hate continuously making Michael Vick an example here (for several reasons), but people were sure that the Eagles would lose fans, and the Steelers after that...none of that happened to any strong extent. The NFL just kept printing money. 

[The Epic]

https://www.theplaye...acial-injustice

 

Matt Stafford has entered the chat.

[SBTarheel]

https://www.theplaye...acial-injustice

 

Matt Stafford has entered the chat.

Fantastic. So good to see things like this.

[JeremyStrain]

Well there's three parts here.

 

1) He was doing this as some sort of martyrdom. His actions post-NFL have proven that to be incredibly false. There's nothing to discuss here.

 

2) He wasn't good enough to get the opportunity to suck. The QBs that have gone through the league since his departure have proven that to be incredibly false. Nobody...at all...thinks that Kap is worse than the worst backup in the NFL, from 2017 to now; the list of people that were "called up" to start at QB for various teams in 2017/2018 would have been hilarious if it wasn't so blatant.

 

Also, nobody asked, but I'll post this Kap video by SB Nation because I love it anyway. 

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=1I0cUTXwr-k

 

Do I think he'd be great upon his return? I really don't know. Do I think he'd be a valid backup option at worst? Absolutely.

 

3) He's "not worth the trouble/circus." That's entirely debatable, but other polarizing figures in this league have made their ways back to the NFL (with varying amounts of success) and people just...stopped caring. The NFL continues to make money in spite of itself. It becomes a fabric of the league and things just move on as they always have. I hate continuously making Michael Vick an example here (for several reasons), but people were sure that the Eagles would lose fans, and the Steelers after that...none of that happened to any strong extent. The NFL just kept printing money. 

I mean I didn't disagree with any of that...you kinda killed all the general points people make.

 

All I'm saying is that we don't KNOW. And the only way we could EVER know is if he had been given a chance and in fact played. Either side can sit here now and say "oh he would have been a SB caliber QB, or a decent QB or whatever (I'm pretty sure he'd have been better than most of what my team trotted out there)" or "he would have been terrible and out of the league within a year and then no one would care what he said".

 

I think he could have been any of those things. Honestly the NFL is tricky like that. One team and system can make a guy look like a legit NFL QB. Then another could be such a bad fit they look like Mark Sanchez. Individual talent only means so much in this league. We will just always have to speculate and wonder because the way it played out, we didn't get a chance to find out for sure. There's always going to be an asterisk because of that.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Well there's three parts here.

1) He was doing this as some sort of martyrdom. His actions post-NFL have proven that to be incredibly false. There's nothing to discuss here.

2) He wasn't good enough to get the opportunity to suck. The QBs that have gone through the league since his departure have proven that to be incredibly false. Nobody...at all...thinks that Kap is worse than the worst backup in the NFL, from 2017 to now; the list of people that were "called up" to start at QB for various teams in 2017/2018 would have been hilarious if it wasn't so blatant.

Also, nobody asked, but I'll post this Kap video by SB Nation because I love it anyway.

https://www.youtube....h?v=1I0cUTXwr-k

Do I think he'd be great upon his return? I really don't know. Do I think he'd be a valid backup option at worst? Absolutely.

3) He's "not worth the trouble/circus." That's entirely debatable, but other polarizing figures in this league have made their ways back to the NFL (with varying amounts of success) and people just...stopped caring. The NFL continues to make money in spite of itself. It becomes a fabric of the league and things just move on as they always have. I hate continuously making Michael Vick an example here (for several reasons), but people were sure that the Eagles would lose fans, and the Steelers after that...none of that happened to any strong extent. The NFL just kept printing money.

Please watch this video. Just do it.

[Nigel Tufnel]

But didn't the Redskins basically go dig up a couple of corpses to play QB at the end of 2018?  Hard to believe that Kap wouldn't have been an improvement.

[mweb08]

We don't know how he would have played.

We do know that he was immensely qualified for and very deserving of getting a job.

[Old Man]

We don't know how he would have played.

We do know that he was immensely qualified for and very deserving of getting a job.

They why didnt he allow himself a chance to show case his talent and get signed. Teams are always trying out people, especially at the QB position.

[Old Man]

But didn't the Redskins basically go dig up a couple of corpses to play QB at the end of 2018?  Hard to believe that Kap wouldn't have been an improvement.

Most teams have walkon try outs throughout the season, show up and throw the football and run a few dash, and do that silly thing with stepping through the tires on the ground to show your agileness.

[The Epic]

But didn't the Redskins basically go dig up a couple of corpses to play QB at the end of 2018?  Hard to believe that Kap wouldn't have been an improvement.

 

There's an article that actually housed all of the starts by "other" QBs in 2017 and 2018 but I can't remember the site. 

 

I just remember that it was bad. Like, bad bad.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Most teams have walkon try outs throughout the season, show up and throw the football and run a few dash, and do that silly thing with stepping through the tires on the ground to show your agileness.

 

Any of those teams invite Kap to try out?  And Josh Johnson (hadn't thrown an NFL pass since 2011) and the buttfumble guy (he buttfumbled) didn't just get tryouts, they started games for a team trying to make the playoffs.

[You Play to Win the Game]

We don't know how he would have played.

We do know that he was immensely qualified for and very deserving of getting a job.

We don't know how he would have played in the same way that we technically don't KNOW how Tom Brady will play every year.

[mweb08]

They why didnt he allow himself a chance to show case his talent and get signed. Teams are always trying out people, especially at the QB position.

I'm talking about in the off-season directly after his last year. In that off-season, he should have been flat out offered contracts if teams weren't out on him due to his protest.

[JeremyStrain]

But didn't the Redskins basically go dig up a couple of corpses to play QB at the end of 2018?  Hard to believe that Kap wouldn't have been an improvement.

Yeah, hence my dig at Sanchez. There was rumors that they'd be the ones to actually sign him, and that they were talking, but it never got to the lets have him in to work out stage or anything.

 

I've got little doubt he was better than whatever we were throwing out there that year, and wanted to see it happen. It's just so much unknown.

 

Like Mike said, what we DO know is that he SHOULD have been given a shot. We don't know what numbers were being offered. If he would have accepted anything that wasn't full on starter salary (a lot of these garbage back up guys will sign for $1m or whatever for a shot to show they should be around and turn that into a couple year backup deal. I mean FItpatrick has made a whole career out of that), or if anyone would have risked the NFL ire to actually sign him. THEN there's the unknown on the field. We all saw what the NFL did to WAS and DAL when they followed the rules they were allowed to contractually vs. what the NFL told them to do behind closed doors. The fact they got away with that BS tells you these old white rich a-holes can do whatever they want and no one is going to stop them because NFL is big money.

[mweb08]

We don't know how he would have played in the same way that we technically don't KNOW how Tom Brady will play every year.

Yeah, sure. I'm just pushing back on this we couldn't know thought.

We know without question that he was worthy of a job. That he wasn't offered one is the issue, not speculation on how well he would have played.