HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 11:06 AM
For the record, I'm now even more confused as to why some people were mad at the Royals...
Seems like everyone is ok with celebrating, high fives, screaming...etc. it's the over the top bat flips, which i don't see from Kc as they don't even hit many homers.
Looking at a guy like Bautista vs. guys on the Royals, there's no comparison to their "dickiness" in my opinion.
Unless it was just simply that they beat the O's and got all the luck in the series?
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 11:07 AM
1) They did it against the Orioles
2) They just seemed really shitty about it
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 11:10 AM
1) They did it against the Orioles
2) They just seemed really shitty about it
Ok, fair enough.
No right or wrong, obviously, but seeing these "antics" from some of the Blue Jays to me is far worse than anything I've seen from the royals (besides Ventura and his lunacy earlier in the season, some of that was ridiculous)
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 11:53 AM
What Mack said... though I'd put a lot of distance between 1 and 2... 1 is clearly the driving factor at play here.
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 11:57 AM
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:01 PM
What Mack said... though I'd put a lot of distance between 1 and 2... 1 is clearly the driving factor at play here.
That's what I figured..Appreciate the honesty.
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:02 PM
I mean the reality is, I wouldn't necessarily like the Royals any more if they had been gentlemen about sweeping our asses last year.
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:06 PM
I mean the reality is, I wouldn't necessarily like the Royals any more if they had been gentlemen about sweeping our asses last year.
Exactly.
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:16 PM
I don't love encouraging them to settle things between the lines. I think we need less throwing at hitters, less spikes high slides, less brawls. You wouldn't encourage NFL players to "settle it on the field" and go for a block on the knees the next play if a guy's sack dance is deemed insulting to the QB or lineman.
Get rid of many of the unwritten rules, at least in terms of decorum, and you probably lose a lot of that.
Agree with this. I don't like the encouragement of more settling things between the lines.
I also don't have a problem with bat flips and the like so I wish players would just get over it.
Owner
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:27 PM
The entertainment angle is just unacceptable. You don't stoop that low just to try and get people to watch. Again, it's the last thing kids should be watching and emulating.
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:30 PM
Half-Member, Half-Amazing
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:32 PM
I really dislike Bautista, but I actually am okay with his moment. I like what I saw Joe Carter said- in the regular season that is some serious BS, but a huge homer in post season game 5? Totally cool with showing emotion and being boastful.
Owner
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:35 PM
Where does it end. You gonna let guys skip around the bag?? Ride their bat like a horse around the bases? Respect the game. Respect who came before you and how they played the game.
You let players be who they are as individuals. If a football player wants to celebrate a 10 yard reception in the 2nd preseason game, go for it. If JR House wants to stand and watch and the plate and celebrate that he's the Grapefruit League king... hooray for him. (I think both would be dumb, but the point is the players should act as who they are.)
If Bautista rips somebody's tits in a clinching Game 5, in an emotional inning and did what he does... that's how it goes. If he gets drilled next year (not at his head), that's also how it goes.
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:37 PM
You can't have it both ways Chris. You either accept it for what it is and all it becomes or you put your foot down. None of this, let's give in because it might make it more entertaining. That's weak. Kids watch these guys like hawks and do what they do. You can't be fine with this while advocating handling of business between the lines as teams see fit. Now kids are watching more and more players getting hit on purpose and benches clearing. And maybe it would be fine if there were more parents like Seth who sat down with their kids while watching and kept them in line but that's not happening enough either.
[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh2sWSVRrmo"]https://www.youtube....2sWSVRrmo[/url]
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:40 PM
He stared directly at the pitcher and essentially threw the bat at the Rangers dugout. If that's not disrespect I don't know what is. Do what Joe Carter did. Jump, scream, get on your bike and pull a Mike Schmidt while running to first. A lot of ways to show excitement without showing up the opponent.
I really dislike Bautista, but I actually am okay with his moment. I like what I saw Joe Carter said- in the regular season that is some serious BS, but a huge homer in post season game 5? Totally cool with showing emotion and being boastful.
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:45 PM
The individuality BS has gone to far. There is a way to express yourself while being respectful. Big problem with this country in general.You let players be who they are as individuals. If a football player wants to celebrate a 10 yard reception in the 2nd preseason game, go for it. If JR House wants to stand and watch and the plate and celebrate that he's the Grapefruit League king... hooray for him. (I think both would be dumb, but the point is the players should act as who they are.)
If Bautista rips somebody's tits in a clinching Game 5, in an emotional inning and did what he does... that's how it goes. If he gets drilled next year (not at his head), that's also how it goes.
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:46 PM
I firmly believe Bautista was not celebrating so much as provoking the Rangers. Firmly believe that. Evidenced by his antics during the misunderstanding between Dyson and Encarnacion, where he was the only Jay that has to be restrained because he was going after Dyson.
Dude's an animal, point blank. He's an asshole, he's obnoxious and he needs help.
Banned
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:51 PM
You can tell in when a player is being disrespectful. It's like all the crap Ortiz pulls. So much of it is clearly disrespectful of the opponent, the umpires, the game in general. That's different than doing something that can be obnoxious but not blatantly disrespectful.I firmly believe Bautista was not celebrating so much as provoking the Rangers. Firmly believe that. Evidenced by his antics during the misunderstanding between Dyson and Encarnacion, where he was the only Jay that has to be restrained because he was going after Dyson.
Dude's an animal, point blank. He's an asshole, he's obnoxious and he needs help.
HOF
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:51 PM
Where does it end. You gonna let guys skip around the bag?? Ride their bat like a horse around the bases? Respect the game. Respect who came before you and how they played the game.
Owner
Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:54 PM
You can't have it both ways Chris. You either accept it for what it is and all it becomes or you put your foot down. None of this, let's give in because it might make it more entertaining. That's weak. Kids watch these guys like hawks and do what they do. You can't be fine with this while advocating handling of business between the lines as teams see fit. Now kids are watching more and more players getting hit on purpose and benches clearing. And maybe it would be fine if there were more parents like Seth who sat down with their kids while watching and kept them in line but that's not happening enough either.
Those same kids who are ignoring the game in droves?
I'm not advocating certain behaviors. I'm suggesting that one of the reasons MLB does not seem to resonate with younger audiences is that there is a palatable lack of emotion to be seen. So, when we do see some emotion... even if we don't like the actions, I think that is a net positive for the game.
Again, the idea that it's better for MLB today that there are people who actively dislike Toronto vs. feeling nothing about them.
Why does the LLWS and CWS stand out every year? It's obviously not because the quality of play is better.
The product is different. It's not just because those kids and young adults are playing for free, representing their schools and hometowns... it's because the enthusiasm shown on the field makes for an entertaining product. In those instances, it's not about showing up the opponent... but it about showing team enthusiasm which would never be acceptable as kosher in a ML dugout.
I'm still with Barkley in the early '90s. I'm not with celebs being role models just because they are in the public eye.
I don't have kids... but if in theory I had a young (10-12 year old) impressionable kid, I might talk to him about Baustita's actions last night. I'd give my opinion on what the correct way to play the game is... and would tell the kid he shouldn't be looking to celebs to guide his actions. He's be responsible for making his own choices in life, and representing himself to others in the manner he wants.
I'd discuss with him, the idea of how do you want others to perceive you?
Bautista is an adult. He's aware of his actions. He should be allowed to be who he is, act how he wants, and people can judge him as they deem fit.
Some people suggested last night that head hunting would be an acceptable response to Bautista's actions. I think that is having it both ways. The idea that there is a classy, appropriate way to play the game, but throwing at someone's head is acceptable. IMO, head hunting is way different vs. throwing at the body (Of course, you run the risk of a pitch getting away when you throw at someone.).
But the idea that kids are going to see players playing the game 'incorrectly' and that is going to hurt their poor little impressionable minds means nothing to me.
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