Photo

More Personality Please


  • Please log in to reply
413 replies to this topic

#1 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:16 AM

I used to be very old school with my opinions on baseball.

I still like the guy that puts his head down, and just does his job....  but I think MLB would be well served by encouraging a culture of more personality. Or at-least not discouraging personality. Just the idea of letting players be themselves, and letting the game police itself.

 

I'm always going to dislike the guy that is barking over ball and strike call; but a guy wants to flip his bat? Okay.

 

A pitcher wants to stare down a batter? Fine. Just deal with it when a hitter takes you deep.

 

A batter wants to look at a pitcher ever going yard? Fine. Being more willing to deal with it, when that pitcher later drills you (below the shoulders). Also, if you are the pitcher, just worry about getting the out.

 

A Middle INF wants to make a throat slashing gesture? Fine... just be prepared for cleats high.

 

In the Spring and Summer... we see the College and Little League World Series...  how about the enthusiasm we see these teams have (which has zero to do with showing up the competition)? They aren't pros, but it is an entertaining brand of baseball, and stands in stark contrast with the Major League game.

 

Perhaps this is the best way to reach the youth which has generally turned away from baseball.

(OT, other rant... I'd also suggest addressing the myth that baseball players are lesser athletes. MLB players have more than immense skill, it takes tremendous physical talent. MLB players would fair better in other sports imo, vs. other sports players trying to play baseball. JMO.  Do admit there are some players who are at-least non-athlete looking. But MLB should do a better job of showcasing all of the different athletic things their players do.)

 

Of course pros in other leagues, and fans of other pro leagues also celebrate differently.. 

 

In Japan..."The truth is that the cheering in the stands is the mood maker and a way for the fans to feel attached to the game from far seats. For instance, each player has his own hitting march that is chanted by the fans from the time he steps in the batters box until the end of the bat. There is also a reward chant if the player gets on base or scores in a run. The chants are accompanied by trumpets, bugles, whistles, Japanese taiko drums, Western base-drums, flags, and banners. In addition, the fans' arsenal includes pre-game chants, opening player name calls, "Lucky seventh" inning fight song and balloons. After victories, the fans display their hitting marches, their bonsai cheer, and their prideful anthems."

 

 

In Caribbean Winter Leagues, there is an outpouring of emotion from players and fans alike. Of course at the Caribbean World Series level, you have country pride.

 

 

 

I started this talking about players and their actions, and got into crowds. Maybe they are separate topics, maybe they are mingled.

 

My sense is that more personality on the field, leads to more people caring / reacting in the stands. All leading to a more entertaining product on tv.

 

 

So... while I may have previously not been particularly fond of perceived antics of Joey Bats, Ortiz, Pedroia, Encarnacion, Moustakas / Gordon / Dyson / Cain....  I think I've come around to the idea of not discouraging their personalities.

 

If they have antics which make you dislike them as opposing fans, it's better for the game as a whole if you feel something when you see them.


  • SBTarheel and Mike in STL like this

#2 bnickle

bnickle

    Banned

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 38,177 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:22 AM

100% completely disagree. You can be pumped and show excitement without the BS these guys pull.


Specifically about baseball, people need to deal with the old school way it's still played. It's what makes it beautiful. The people that bitch about "old school" are the ones who never got baseball in the first place. So please stop watching.

#3 SBTarheel

SBTarheel

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,851 posts
  • LocationEldersburg, Md

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:22 AM

Amen, brother!

 

Let these guys celebrate and have fun. My goodness. 

 

Football players do a dance after every sack and reception over 15 yards. Our city went CRAZY every time Ray Lewis did his little thing every week. 


@beginthebegin71

#4 NewMarketSean

NewMarketSean

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,567 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:26 AM

I have no problem with it, but what happened last night in Toronto was an embarrassment all the way around. The fans, the celebrations...it all reek of classlessness to me. The NFL has always tried to tone down this kind of thing, baseball seems like the last resort where there is still some class. But that seems to be going away, just watch KC and Toronto this ALCS.

 

 

I do believe it's different on a world stage though, with countries playing other countries...you can't help but get wrapped up in that kind of thing. Maybe it's hypocritical, maybe not...I can't wait for the next WBC, though, and I want to go to some games in Cuba and the DR before I die.


  • You Play to Win the Game likes this
I never had friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?

#5 bnickle

bnickle

    Banned

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 38,177 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:29 AM

I can't believe someone can watch Bautista's antics and not only accept it, but encourage it. You should be ashamed.

#6 Chris B

Chris B

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 22,235 posts
  • LocationBaltimore, MD

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:30 AM

There's an abject difference between what Jose Bautista did yesterday and what Yo Cespedes did the night before (or two nights before) in regards to their bat flip.

 

I'm frankly a fan of how most of the Caribbean teams/players play instead of the humdrum go-about-it-as-a-job Americanized version of the game.

 

HOWEVER, Jose Bautista is a hypocrite through and through. The guy gets absolutely furious when Adam Jones does a bat flip and then goes about doing the same thing times 1000? Frankly, last night wasn't even a bat flip. It was a heave of wood; it was archaic, barbaric and with no grace. That was a total ego one-up, not even a real celebration. It was classless.

 

Compare that to Cespedes' bat flip was fine. Very casual, very non-chalant, not trying to stand up the opposing team. It was a celebration of his work, not mocking the pitcher or getting back at the umps from a prior call.


  • 1970 likes this

#7 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:31 AM

I can't believe someone can watch Bautista's antics and not only accept it, but encourage it. You should be ashamed.

 

Got zero problem with it.

 

Either does Rick Sutcliffe (as stated today on Mike & Mike)... he's certainly as old school as you get.



#8 SBTarheel

SBTarheel

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,851 posts
  • LocationEldersburg, Md

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:32 AM

Bautista is an ass, no question. But in general, the "outrage' over bat flips, and exuberant celebrations is absurd to me. 


  • 1970 likes this
@beginthebegin71

#9 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:32 AM

There's an abject difference between what Jose Bautista did yesterday and what Yo Cespedes did the night before (or two nights before) in regards to their bat flip.

 

I'm frankly a fan of how most of the Caribbean teams/players play instead of the humdrum go-about-it-as-a-job Americanized version of the game.

 

HOWEVER, Jose Bautista is a hypocrite through and through. The guy gets absolutely furious when Adam Jones does a bat flip and then goes about doing the same thing times 1000? Frankly, last night wasn't even a bat flip. It was a heave of wood; it was archaic, barbaric and with no grace. That was a total ego one-up, not even a real celebration. It was classless.

 

Compare that to Cespedes' bat flip was fine. Very casual, very non-chalant, not trying to stand up the opposing team. It was a celebration of his work, not mocking the pitcher or getting back at the umps from a prior call.

 

The hypocrisy is something that makes me dislike him... but not the particular act last night of heaving the bat. 



#10 Chris B

Chris B

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 22,235 posts
  • LocationBaltimore, MD

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:35 AM

But the problem is that that wasn't even a bat flip. The dude is an utter jackass who thinks everyone has to disagree with him.

 

For some reason my quote function isn't working but Patrick just posted about Bautista in the Blue Jays thread and it is absolutely 100% true.



#11 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:38 AM

But the problem is that that wasn't even a bat flip. The dude is an utter jackass who thinks everyone has to disagree with him.

 

For some reason my quote function isn't working but Patrick just posted about Bautista in the Blue Jays thread and it is absolutely 100% true.

 

I don't have a problem with disliking what Bautista did...  I'm mostly saying it just shouldn't be discouraged. That you disliking him is good for the game. And the game should be allowed to police itself.



#12 You Play to Win the Game

You Play to Win the Game

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 60,483 posts
  • LocationMaryland

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:44 AM

I agree with the point Stoner is trying to make, but don't like the timing as I hate Bautista.



#13 bnickle

bnickle

    Banned

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 38,177 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:49 AM

Stop watching then. Please. Baseball isn't the game for you.

#14 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:51 AM

Stop watching then. Please. Baseball isn't the game for you.

 

Why's that chief?   Baseball isn't limited to MLB....  and if you feel I shouldn't watch MLB, presumably you feel the same about Sutcliffe, Joe Carter, and Rob Dibble who have all said this morning they have no problem with it.



#15 bnickle

bnickle

    Banned

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 38,177 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:54 AM

Chief. Cute. Baseball is still the purest of the 4 major sports. You want to ruin that. I don't care what they think, nor do I deep down believe them. Especially, if they were sitting in the opposing dugout.


#dontgiveinonoldschool

#16 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 08:59 AM

Chief. Cute. I don't care what they think, nor do I deep down believe them. Especially, if they were sitting in the opposing dugout.

 

Ahh gotcha.  My take would be that Sutcliffe would drill someone (and he said as much). In '92, he was constantly standing up for the O's, pitching inside, and talking about how he disliked the AL game.

 

But he also made the point today that there is an entertainment factor, and the bigger thing is to not allow the hr in the first place.

 

Carter, maybe he's biased being a former Jay.

 

Dibble... he was another hot head, who would have thrown at someone.

 

Point stands, Sutcliffe and Dibble would have tried to police things themselves between the lines.

 

Further to that... you are 'now a huge KC fan' in your words for the ALCS. That's because the antics of Toronto have turned you off, but they have also made you 'care.'

 

It's better for the game that you are feeling something, vs. being ambivalent. 



#17 bnickle

bnickle

    Banned

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 38,177 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 09:03 AM

I'm watching either way. I don't need a rooting interest.

#18 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 60,830 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 09:13 AM

Chris are you advocating for people to be able to celebrate as they like or are you saying baseball should actively encourage creating "heels" like WWF?

 

I'm cool with most outward celebrations in baseball, and would like it if players in general were a bit more animated, but I do think there is a line where it goes from celebrating your success to showing up the opponent.  Bautista is constantly on the wrong side of that line, IMO. 


  • Chris B likes this

#19 SportsGuy

SportsGuy

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 91,979 posts
  • LocationBaltimore

Posted 15 October 2015 - 09:16 AM

The crying over celebrations in baseball is absurd.  This country is so uptight.

 

You can't fit a greased bibi up the asshole of this country.



#20 BSLChrisStoner

BSLChrisStoner

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 156,171 posts

Posted 15 October 2015 - 09:18 AM

I'm watching either way. I don't need a rooting interest.

 

You will have the exact same level of interest in the NLCS?

 

Let's say you do. Either way, you are a huge fan of baseball.

 

As a fan of baseball, you are aware that youth participation in the game continues to decrease. That even though the game is relatively healthy at the MLB level (large tv revenues, good attendance); that the game continues to dissipate overall in-terms of the National consciousness.

 

Anecdotally, I'm sure you share the same experience where you can talk football with anyone (everyone has interest), but find less people that enjoy baseball.

 

There are numerous reasons for the NFL's success. People like the contact. Attention spans are limited, and people can focus once a week. Gambling. Fantasy Football (more gambling) is bigger than Fantasy Baseball. The game is better on TV.

 

But getting past a Football vs. Baseball comparison, you are also aware of the gains of Basketball on Baseball Nationally, and how over the next 20-25 years that Soccer is also posed for exponential growth.

 

The key for growing the game of baseball is not continuing to have a product that solely appeals to their existing audience.... it's about reaching people who have not previously taken an active interest in the game. Baseball's audience is significantly older than the other major sports.

 

MLB has to find more ways to reach millennials. One way to do that, would be to not discourage enthusiasm which spokes passion, and creates a more entertaining product on TV.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users


Our Sponsors


 width=