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#861 Mike B

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Posted 02 December 2020 - 09:44 PM

I think Westbrook is a good fit for this fan base, I think they'll embrace him. He will take shots away from Beal, so they'll have to figure that out. I like getting rid of Wall. I do not like giving up a 1st round pick. At all.

I have a suspicion that Ted tired of Wall, but the team continues to be happy with tread water.  The problem is they are doing it in the shallow end.


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#862 BSLMikeLowe

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Posted 02 December 2020 - 11:09 PM

Should make them more watchable in the present, and the money/years is pretty much a wash. Not conveying the pick until 2023 isn't bad either, though that would depend on how well-protected it is.



#863 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 07:30 AM

The Ringer: Instant Reactions to the Rockets Trading Russell Westbrook to the Wizards for John Wall



#864 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 07:33 AM

CBS Sports: Russell Westbrook trade grades: Rockets deal All-Star guard to Wizards for John Wall, first-round pick
https://www.cbssport...rst-round-pick/



#865 JeremyStrain

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 08:38 AM

I like the trade. The real question mark is Walls health. This type of injury, the knee then the achiles can slow point guards down to the point of career over. Especially for a guy that relied on speed.

If you are concerned he won’t be the same player when he comes back you have to trade him for something. This wasn’t a salary dump as salaries are almost the same but you got a guy that while he can be a headache can carry a team. The same was said about Kobe at one point. For Russ, maturity is the question and how he can mesh with Beal. He needs a team that isn’t loaded with superstars, he needs to be a big focal point which he will be here. Neal will give him a little space cause you can’t forget about him while clamping down on Russ.

If those two can play off each other high and they can get some more development from the role players and you g guys down low, with Betrans able to drop some extra range, this team will spread teams and can be dangerous.

Defense as always here is going to be interesting to watch but for the first time since Weber and Howard I think I’m starting to have hope again.
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#866 Mike B

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 11:31 AM

I like the trade. The real question mark is Walls health. This type of injury, the knee then the achiles can slow point guards down to the point of career over. Especially for a guy that relied on speed.

If you are concerned he won’t be the same player when he comes back you have to trade him for something. This wasn’t a salary dump as salaries are almost the same but you got a guy that while he can be a headache can carry a team. The same was said about Kobe at one point. For Russ, maturity is the question and how he can mesh with Beal. He needs a team that isn’t loaded with superstars, he needs to be a big focal point which he will be here. Neal will give him a little space cause you can’t forget about him while clamping down on Russ.

If those two can play off each other high and they can get some more development from the role players and you g guys down low, with Betrans able to drop some extra range, this team will spread teams and can be dangerous.

Defense as always here is going to be interesting to watch but for the first time since Weber and Howard I think I’m starting to have hope again.

I have always looked at Russ as a stat chaser.  I still feel like this is a 35 win team, but it will be interesting.  


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#867 JeremyStrain

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 01:02 PM

I have always looked at Russ as a stat chaser.  I still feel like this is a 35 win team, but it will be interesting.  


Yeah, won't argue that. But I DO think that stat chasers can work on certain teams and builds. They sure as hell don't work on super teams. You gotta spread the ball to 3 players and people get their butts hurt and cry about not getting enough. This was the problem in OKC, you had him AND Harden who HAD to have the ball go through them 40 times a game, and you had Durant who the offense should run through. When they traded Harden I had the biggest WHAT??? Face ever, but it wasn't about trading him, it was about freeing up balls for the other two, the problem was two fold, one that Russ and Durant didn't really like each other that much, and Durant was going to FA no matter what, and two that the return they got was the wrong one. They needed some solid role players to fill in. Had they traded Russ first, for a playmaking, pass first PG, and a good defensive 3, they would have won a title for sure.

 

Can you imagine if they had dealt Russ for Tony Parker and Kawai in 2012? I don't think anyone beats them.


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#868 Mike B

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 01:22 PM


Yeah, won't argue that. But I DO think that stat chasers can work on certain teams and builds. They sure as hell don't work on super teams. You gotta spread the ball to 3 players and people get their butts hurt and cry about not getting enough. This was the problem in OKC, you had him AND Harden who HAD to have the ball go through them 40 times a game, and you had Durant who the offense should run through. When they traded Harden I had the biggest WHAT??? Face ever, but it wasn't about trading him, it was about freeing up balls for the other two, the problem was two fold, one that Russ and Durant didn't really like each other that much, and Durant was going to FA no matter what, and two that the return they got was the wrong one. They needed some solid role players to fill in. Had they traded Russ first, for a playmaking, pass first PG, and a good defensive 3, they would have won a title for sure.

 

Can you imagine if they had dealt Russ for Tony Parker and Kawai in 2012? I don't think anyone beats them.

Good post.   Maybe I will be wrong, but my gut tells me Russ and Beal will be a pairing that causes issues.


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#869 JeremyStrain

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 01:43 PM

Good post.   Maybe I will be wrong, but my gut tells me Russ and Beal will be a pairing that causes issues.


Could be, I've got a little worry about it myself. I think for me the tiebreaker is Wall's health. I think he's going to come back, and either face nagging injuries or just not be anywhere near the max level player he was. For a chance to get a guy that is worth the contract but a headache, it's worth the gamble. You might always be able to deal Russ later for something else you know?

 

But a big part of me really thinks he's happy here, and will be able to coexist with Beal. The other guys on the roster are supporting guys, they aren't looking to be the star, they are looking to help the team win. The x-factor is the rookie we just picked up. If he ends up being what they say, good defense on the wing, good shooter, can create offense, they could be real trouble for a weak East. It's going to come down to defense and rebounding.


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#870 Mike B

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 03:12 PM


Could be, I've got a little worry about it myself. I think for me the tiebreaker is Wall's health. I think he's going to come back, and either face nagging injuries or just not be anywhere near the max level player he was. For a chance to get a guy that is worth the contract but a headache, it's worth the gamble. You might always be able to deal Russ later for something else you know?

 

But a big part of me really thinks he's happy here, and will be able to coexist with Beal. The other guys on the roster are supporting guys, they aren't looking to be the star, they are looking to help the team win. The x-factor is the rookie we just picked up. If he ends up being what they say, good defense on the wing, good shooter, can create offense, they could be real trouble for a weak East. It's going to come down to defense and rebounding.

I admit, I am looking forward to seeing them play.  I am kind of a border line fan.  I grew up on the Baltimore Bullets, and made the transition to the team over the years.  I went to about 8-10 games when they were in Cap Center but do not like going into DC, so it for me is mostly a TV thing now.  I used to watch every game, but now it is a more casual thing.   I look forward to seeing Russ and Beal play together, but was also anxious to see how Beal does.


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#871 JeremyStrain

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 03:18 PM

I admit, I am looking forward to seeing them play.  I am kind of a border line fan.  I grew up on the Baltimore Bullets, and made the transition to the team over the years.  I went to about 8-10 games when they were in Cap Center but do not like going into DC, so it for me is mostly a TV thing now.  I used to watch every game, but now it is a more casual thing.   I look forward to seeing Russ and Beal play together, but was also anxious to see how Beal does.


I'm a beat down fan. I used to see them a few times a year at the Cap Center, and even though we have season tix to the Caps, I don't like going down there for the Wiz. I think I've seen two Wiz games there in my life. One was ON the court the game before Jordan came back to the Bulls, and the other was free tix a few years ago.

 

But My grandfather lived next door to Rex Chapman for a few years, and I visited enough I was on a first name basis with him. Then he sold Chris Weber his house when he left, and I played horse with him a couple times. I was a HUGE fan back then, and I was really crushed when they botched that chance. You were set at front court, but a couple of stupid draft picks in a row, and trading for Rod Strickland as the answer at PG just weren't the right moves, and then trading Chris for Mitch Ritchmond was the end times basically.


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#872 mweb08

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 06:20 PM

ESPN Stats & Info
Over the last five seasons, 78 players have attempted at least 2,000 jumpers.

John Wall ranks 77th in effective field goal percentage among that group.

Russell Westbrook ranks 78th. https://t.co/hPQvyr0KxA
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#873 JeremyStrain

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Posted 03 December 2020 - 06:35 PM

ESPN Stats & Info
Over the last five seasons, 78 players have attempted at least 2,000 jumpers.

John Wall ranks 77th in effective field goal percentage among that group.

Russell Westbrook ranks 78th. https://t.co/hPQvyr0KxA


Oof.
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#874 Mike B

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Posted 04 December 2020 - 04:42 PM

Oof.

 

ESPN Stats & Info
Over the last five seasons, 78 players have attempted at least 2,000 jumpers.

John Wall ranks 77th in effective field goal percentage among that group.

Russell Westbrook ranks 78th. https://t.co/hPQvyr0KxA

Well that seems fair.   :eek:

 

Both seem to miss a lot of layups too


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#875 mweb08

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Posted 04 December 2020 - 06:08 PM

I am very skeptical of Russ being a winning basketball player at this point of his career. He'll get his points, assists, and rebounds, but the efficiency likely won't be good, the defense likely won't be good, and the teamwork likely won't be good. 

 

I'd rather have Wall if he's basically what he once was, but that's unlikely.

 

So this is just a meh deal to me. Trading one bad contract of a player that can't afford to lose much athletically but likely has for another bad contract of a player that can't afford to lose much athletically and is currently losing it. 



#876 B00E00N00

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Posted 05 December 2020 - 12:15 AM

As others have said, this is just a lateral move in getting Westbrook's bad contract.  And of course this all stems back to Ernie's horrible decision to give Wall a 4 Year $169 Million contract.  Yep boys, Ernie's fingers prints are still on this organization and running strong.  Way to go Ernie!



#877 JeremyStrain

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Posted 05 December 2020 - 10:59 AM

I am very skeptical of Russ being a winning basketball player at this point of his career. He'll get his points, assists, and rebounds, but the efficiency likely won't be good, the defense likely won't be good, and the teamwork likely won't be good. 

 

I'd rather have Wall if he's basically what he once was, but that's unlikely.

 

So this is just a meh deal to me. Trading one bad contract of a player that can't afford to lose much athletically but likely has for another bad contract of a player that can't afford to lose much athletically and is currently losing it. 


Don't really disagree with you.

 

I really lean that Wall is a much different player if he can even stay on the court this year, and in that sense trading him for ANYTHING now, even a lateral move is good in the sense that when people see in a couple weeks he's not the same you would be stuck with that contract for 3 more years.

 

I think we are short enough feature players that Russ can have 50-60 touches a game and it doesn't hurt us a lot. Now that might change if the new kid develops (and if he's not the one that tested positive this week) into a scoring threat. But I don't know how much ball is left for others after Russ, Beal and Betrans get the ball, and that leaves exactly zero inside game. So I really hope Rui leads the league in rebounds this year.


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#878 Mike B

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Posted 07 December 2020 - 11:52 AM

Nice touch by the Wizards thanking Wall.

https://www.nbcsport...mpact-community


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#879 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 15 December 2020 - 08:43 AM

The Ringer: The Wizards Have Two Star Guards and … the Wrong Supporting Cast



#880 Mike B

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Posted 28 December 2020 - 12:38 PM

I try not to make decisions about a team after a few games, but the Wizards have the look of a bad team.  Defensively atrocious.


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