172 replies to this topic

[You Play to Win the Game]

There is plenty of truth here. When Flacco wins these next two games, there will be a lot of talk about the 'maturation' of his game. When in-truth he will be the same guy he's been for years. A guy with one of the most talented arms in the league... a guy with flaws... a guy you can win it all with.

I agree. He deserves to be rewarded with a championship, because he's good enough. Those around him on offense have let him down too many times, but right now are playing sound football.

[mweb08]

It certainly isn't changing my analysis. I've always said Flacco is a great QB when he's protected. He had a great game last night, regardless of the result, IMO.

The line playing great certainly helps Flacco a lot with his deficiencies (reading blitzes and not fumbling). It's why football is the ultimate team game.

Outside of getting one of the true elite's, having a guy like Flacco who can play extremely well when those around him do is really all you can ask for.

Eh, if that ball is picked you probably wouldn't have been as enthusiastic about his play. Or if Smith didn't make a really good TD catch at the end of the 1st half. Or if the Broncos player got his feet in on that pick in OT that would have likely sealed the game. I do think he played quite well, but the results could have easily been a lot less flattering for him and I think most people's analysis would change based on that.

BTW, I'm guilty of this too.

[mweb08]

There is plenty of truth here. When Flacco wins these next two games, there will be a lot of talk about the 'maturation' of his game. When in-truth he will be the same guy he's been for years. A guy with one of the most talented arms in the league... a guy with flaws... a guy you can win it all with.

Lots of confidence there.

Yeah, sure, him and 15 or so other guys that can win it all under the right circumstances.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Eh, if that ball is picked you probably wouldn't have been as enthusiastic about his play. Or if Smith didn't make a really good TD catch at the end of the 1st half. Or if the Broncos player got his feet in on that pick in OT that would have likely sealed the game. I do think he played quite well, but the results could have easily been a lot less flattering for him and I think most people's analysis would change based on that.

BTW, I'm guilty of this too.

I said when it was 35-28 with 40 seconds left, and I thought the game was over, that this wasn't on Flacco and he played a great, great game. You can't give credit to Smith on that TD without giving some to Flacco, that was a beautiful ball, and he and Smith have worked on that play down the sideline a lot this year.

Your general point about how some fans analyze QB performance is valid, but I'm not one of the people you're talking about.

[SportsGuy]

The greatest QB of our generation, Brady, saw his team go 11-5 WITHOUT him.

In other words, perhaps someone as great as Brady is, has help do to the system he is in.

Montana...same could be said.

End of the day, all players and coaches are great because of what is going own around them.

Now, some need less..some need more. But they all need help. They all need plays to help them.

Football is a game of inches and so often, you can pick out a ton of plays, in every game, where it's a just miss or a shoulda, woulda, coulda. I see no reason to harp on that.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Lots of confidence there.
Yeah, sure, him and 15 or so other guys that can win it all under the right circumstances.

Yeah, 15 is probably the number of QBs I believe are capable of winning a title.

The NFL, and the coverage of the NFL, is week to week. People get worked up on the numbers, without a lot of discussion of the schemes they are working in, the surrounding talent, etc. There are only a couple of guys of that regardless of schemes, regardless of who they are playing with; are capable of really elevating everyone on their own.

I agree Joe isn't quite that guy.... but he's one of the reasons the Ravens have consistently won since he's been here. He's not just along for the ride, he is a large part of the success.

[You Play to Win the Game]

The greatest QB of our generation, Brady, saw his team go 11-5 WITHOUT him.

In other words, perhaps someone as great as Brady is, has help do to the system he is in.

Montana...same could be said.

End of the day, all players and coaches are great because of what is going own around them.

Now, some need less..some need more. But they all need help. They all need plays to help them.

Football is a game of inches and so often, you can pick out a ton of plays, in every game, where it's a just miss or a shoulda, woulda, coulda. I see no reason to harp on that.

Good post. I agree completely.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Yeah, 15 is probably the number of QBs I believe are capable of winning a title.

The NFL, and the coverage of the NFL, is week to week. People get worked up on the numbers, without a lot of discussion of the schemes they are working in, the surrounding talent, etc. There are only a couple of guys of that regardless of schemes, regardless of who they are playing with; are capable of really elevating everyone on their own.

I agree Joe isn't quite that guy.... but he's one of the reasons the Ravens have consistently won since he's been here. He's not just along for the ride, he is a large part of the success.

Good post, well said.

Speaking of the coverage in the NFL, Marshall Faulk is looking really good right about now. He is one of the very few guys who spoke consistently about things around Flacco that needed to change/improve. He was right, and some of the things he talked about have changed, and we're seeing the result.

[bnickle]

SO name the 15. My guess is people will throw guys like Schaub and Dalton in that mix and I'm not buying that. I think both are exposed in playoff situations. The great thing about Joe is you don;t have to worry about whether he can win on the road, you don;t have to worry about him not being able to perform in certain conditions, you don;t have to worry about teams taking something away from him because he can make every throw on the field. Some Qbs get exposed around playoff time. Clearly, Joe isn;t one of those guys. Yes, he still has flaws and that doesn;t make him the best QB in the league. I think there is about 10 QBs that can win it all and he is one of them.

[SportsGuy]

Joe is clearly a guy who can win a title.

[BSLChrisStoner]

SO name the 15. My guess is people will throw guys like Schaub and Dalton in that mix and I'm not buying that. I think both are exposed in playoff situations. The great thing about Joe is you don;t have to worry about whether he can win on the road, you don;t have to worry about him not being able to perform in certain conditions, you don;t have to worry about teams taking something away from him because he can make every throw on the field. Some Qbs get exposed around playoff time. Clearly, Joe isn;t one of those guys. Yes, he still has flaws and that doesn;t make him the best QB in the league. I think there is about 10 QBs that can win it all and he is one of them.

Without really thinking about it, I came up with 20 guys I think you can win a Super Bowl with.

1) Rodgers
2) Brady
3) P. Manning
4) Roethlisberger
5) Brees
6) E.Manning
7) Flacco
8) Luck
9) Cutler
10) Ryan
11) Stafford
12) Romo
13) Dalton
14) Wilson
15) Newton
16) Kaepernick
17) Rivers
18) Schaub
19) Freeman
20) Bradford

[You Play to Win the Game]

You have to include Alex Smith, too. If it weren't for their KR's 2 fumbles last year, he may have won it all. And now he's a backup. Just goes to illustrate further the concept that it's the ultimate team sport.

[mweb08]

You have to include Alex Smith, too. If it weren't for their KR's 2 fumbles last year, he may have won it all. And now he's a backup. Just goes to illustrate further the concept that it's the ultimate team sport.

Yep.

It is the ultimate team sport which is why you are right in that the analysis of Joe (or any QB) revolving around him not winning a SB or winning one is lazy.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Yep.

It is the ultimate team sport which is why you are right in that the analysis of Joe (or any QB) revolving around him not winning a SB or winning one is lazy.

Right. There will never be a better example of this than Dan Marino, IMO.

[mweb08]

Without really thinking about it, I came up with 20 guys I think you can win a Super Bowl with.

1) Rodgers
2) Brady
3) P. Manning
4) Roethlisberger
5) Brees
6) E.Manning
7) Flacco
8) Luck
9) Cutler
10) Ryan
11) Stafford
12) Romo
13) Dalton
14) Wilson
15) Newton
16) Kaepernick
17) Rivers
18) Schaub
19) Freeman
20) Bradford

While with a fantastic team, it would be possible for any of those guys to win, I would leave off a few such as Dalton, Bradford, and Freeman. Some others are very borderline as well. I would include Smith, though and a healthy Griffin.

BTW, even Mark Sanchez was very close to being in a SB!

[You Play to Win the Game]

While with a fantastic team, it would be possible for any of those guys to win, I would leave off a few such as Dalton, Bradford, and Freeman. Some others are very borderline as well. I would include Smith, though and a healthy Griffin.

BTW, even Mark Sanchez was very close to being in a SB!

Ugh, OK... I think it's time to stop talking about this.

[BSLChrisStoner]

While with a fantastic team, it would be possible for any of those guys to win, I would leave off a few such as Dalton, Bradford, and Freeman. Some others are very borderline as well. I would include Smith, though and a healthy Griffin.

BTW, even Mark Sanchez was very close to being in a SB!

RG3 was an inadvertent oversight. I think you and Ricker make fine points about Smith, and Sanchez.

Getting back to Flacco.. there aren't many QB's I'd rather have over the next 5 years or so.

[mweb08]

RG3 was an inadvertent oversight. I think you and Ricker make fine points about Smith, and Sanchez.

Getting back to Flacco.. there aren't many QB's I'd rather have over the next 5 years or so.

How many?

I think it would be interesting to evaluate that. Of course seeing what Joe does in his next one or potentially two games (along with what Kaepernick and Ryan do) will possibly change things.

[mweb08]

Ugh, OK... I think it's time to stop talking about this.

Haha. I think it does show that this talk of you can win a SB with so and so is not the best of descriptions or debates. A lot of guys can win if they have amazing circumstances.

[PD24]

Without really thinking about it, I came up with 20 guys I think you can win a Super Bowl with.

1) Rodgers
2) Brady
3) P. Manning
4) Roethlisberger
5) Brees
6) E.Manning
7) Flacco
8) Luck
9) Cutler
10) Ryan
11) Stafford
12) Romo
13) Dalton
14) Wilson
15) Newton
16) Kaepernick
17) Rivers
18) Schaub
19) Freeman
20) Bradford

Wow! My list is much, much shorter.

Bradford has done nothing to show he can win a championship. Same with Freeman. Neither has made the playoffs. I'm not a believer in Cam. Stafford has never won a playoff game. Romo has been the reason his teams don't get to the playoffs and loses playoff games, much less be someone that can win a SB. Dalton? Come on.

Rivers couldn't as he is playing now. If he goes back to his previous form he could.

Cutler has won 1 playoff game in his career with some very decent and good teams, plus a top defense. But, I'll begrudgingly put him at the bottom of my list since I think he has the talent to do it.

I'd say:

1) Brady
2) Rodgers
3) Manning
4) Manning
5) Brees
6) Ben
7) Flacco
8) RG3
9) Luck
10) WIlson
11) Kap
12) Cutler