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2024 Orioles General Talk


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#1 Mike in STL

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 07:04 AM

2024 time.

Sell the team. JA wont open up the wallet. I can’t fault Elias much when the handcuffs are on.

We’re stuck with Hyde, so you really need the players that makes managing easy.

We know they won’t do it but we know what they need. Some bats that you don’t platoon, exploited in a short series. Some high end pitchers. Snell and Nola I’d go after. Bullpen arms are easy to get at the deadline and you know what you’re getting at that point. Besides, Hall looks ready for higher leverage situations. Wonder if they can sprinkle the magic dust they did on Felix and Cano on Fuji. Wells should stay there instead of be in the rotation again.

Jackson Holliday, be there opening day.

Kjerstad in LF. I don’t see any LH OF bats on the market that aren’t platoon guys. If we get lucky and the Cubs don’t pick up Bellingers option, jump right on that. Maybe Cowser figures it out and challenges Mullins for PT.

Carlos Santana I’d target for 1B. Switch hitter, solid from both sides.

Snell/Nola, Bradish, GRod, Means, Kremer. I can live with that. Kremer doesn’t need to see action in the postseason.
Adley
Santana, Westburg, Gunnar, Holliday around the IF
Kjerstad, Mullins/Cowser (Bellinger), Santander in the OF.

Upgrade further at the deadline.

Bye Hays, Bye Mounty. Bye Frazier, Bye Gibson

Don’t expect any of this to happen.
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#2 Steve55

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 07:37 AM

2024 time.

Sell the team. JA wont open up the wallet. I can’t fault Elias much when the handcuffs are on.

We’re stuck with Hyde, so you really need the players that makes managing easy.

We know they won’t do it but we know what they need. Some bats that you don’t platoon, exploited in a short series. Some high end pitchers. Snell and Nola I’d go after. Bullpen arms are easy to get at the deadline and you know what you’re getting at that point. Besides, Hall looks ready for higher leverage situations. Wonder if they can sprinkle the magic dust they did on Felix and Cano on Fuji. Wells should stay there instead of be in the rotation again.

Jackson Holliday, be there opening day.

Kjerstad in LF. I don’t see any LH OF bats on the market that aren’t platoon guys. If we get lucky and the Cubs don’t pick up Bellingers option, jump right on that. Maybe Cowser figures it out and challenges Mullins for PT.

Carlos Santana I’d target for 1B. Switch hitter, solid from both sides.

Snell/Nola, Bradish, GRod, Means, Kremer. I can live with that. Kremer doesn’t need to see action in the postseason.
Adley
Santana, Westburg, Gunnar, Holliday around the IF
Kjerstad, Mullins/Cowser (Bellinger), Santander in the OF.

Upgrade further at the deadline.

Bye Hays, Bye Mounty. Bye Frazier, Bye Gibson

Don’t expect any of this to happen.

 

 

Philly not letting Nola go, although he's pitching well now he wasn't midseason. Cubs won't let Bellinger go either. Angelos doesn't want to spend big money, so trades are going to be needed.



#3 jamesdean

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 07:53 AM

Before the play-offs started, I was thinking to myself, "as young as this team is, are they going to be able to mentally take on the kind of pressure and National exposure that's part of post season baseball?"  To be honest, I thought they'd be able to handle it because of the fact that they WERE young and had been almost oblivious to the daily grind of being in a pennant race.  But now, as the ashes settle, I realize it was too big for them.  They just weren't ready for the limelight, from Hyde all the way down to the last player on the roster.  Texas basically steamrolled them like they were a team that lost 101 games, not the other way around.  

 

That said, I do think they have a lot to be proud about and I am appreciative of the fact that they managed to keep my interest and enthusiasm throughout the season which in of itself, is no small feat.  And now that it's over, I won't watch a single second of any baseball game, including the World Series.  Could care less.  I feel bad for those of you who have invested so much emotionally, went to games all summer and dreamed so hard for the ultimate prize and to finally end 40 years of futility.  But that will subside in time and it's a bright future with this team and will look forward to next season being just as exciting. 


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#4 bmore_ken

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 08:07 AM

Before the play-offs started, I was thinking to myself, "as young as this team is, are they going to be able to mentally take on the kind of pressure and National exposure that's part of post season baseball?"  To be honest, I thought they'd be able to handle it because of the fact that they WERE young and had been almost oblivious to the daily grind of being in a pennant race.  But now, as the ashes settle, I realize it was too big for them.  They just weren't ready for the limelight, from Hyde all the way down to the last player on the roster.  Texas basically steamrolled them like they were a team that lost 101 games, not the other way around.  

 

That said, I do think they have a lot to be proud about and I am appreciative of the fact that they managed to keep my interest and enthusiasm throughout the season which in of itself, is no small feat.  And now that it's over, I won't watch a single second of any baseball game, including the World Series.  Could care less.  I feel bad for those of you who have invested so much emotionally, went to games all summer and dreamed so hard for the ultimate prize and to finally end 40 years of futility.  But that will subside in time and it's a bright future with this team and will look forward to next season being just as exciting. 

Personally I enjoyed the season. Once I finally bought in that it wasn't a mirage. I'm not even completely upset that Texas bounced them from the playoffs. As someone who was around to watch the 70's glory days, the Pittsburgh heartbreak and the Ynot season, it was a pleasure to see my team in the playoffs again, The only thing that really bothers me is this could have been a different outcome if the team hadn't ignored the main need of this team the last offseason and last two  trade deadlines. We all know what that is and you can blame it on whoever you want. I just hope this taught someone a lesson who has the power to fix it. I have no faith that they will, but I do have hope. 


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#5 SonicAttack

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 08:47 AM

Great regular season, 101 wins - WOW!  Junk playoffs sweep, losing Means hurt a lot, but the O's SPs overall are suspect.  Bradish was tremendous and looks like a true #1 or 2 SP.   Rodriguez has all the talent, he needs to re-fine it and be consistent, if he can then he is another #1 or 2 SP.  As he is now, GRod is a #3-4 SP. 

The dark horse was Means, he was starting to look like a solid #3 or better, but now with recurring L elbow pain - could need another TJ.  Gibson and Kremer, meh #5's all the way.  The O's need to sign (meaning payroll of at least $100 mil)  some strong SP, but the most I see ownership willing to pay for would be a Tommy Milone or Rich Hill. 

I really like Kenta Maeda and he could be w/i the O's budget.  Blake Snell, Julio Urias and/or Jordan Montgomery, not happening. 

 

For RP, I like Reynado Lopez and Phil Maton and they might be w/i O's budget. 

 

For non-pitchers, start the youth movement, opening day with Gunnar, Westburg, Ortiz, Mayo, Kjertstad, Cowser, maybe even Stowers and Holiday if they have a strong Spring. 



#6 Steve55

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 09:41 AM

Great regular season, 101 wins - WOW!  Junk playoffs sweep, losing Means hurt a lot, but the O's SPs overall are suspect.  Bradish was tremendous and looks like a true #1 or 2 SP.   Rodriguez has all the talent, he needs to re-fine it and be consistent, if he can then he is another #1 or 2 SP.  As he is now, GRod is a #3-4 SP. 

The dark horse was Means, he was starting to look like a solid #3 or better, but now with recurring L elbow pain - could need another TJ.  Gibson and Kremer, meh #5's all the way.  The O's need to sign (meaning payroll of at least $100 mil)  some strong SP, but the most I see ownership willing to pay for would be a Tommy Milone or Rich Hill. 

I really like Kenta Maeda and he could be w/i the O's budget.  Blake Snell, Julio Urias and/or Jordan Montgomery, not happening. 

 

For RP, I like Reynado Lopez and Phil Maton and they might be w/i O's budget. 

 

For non-pitchers, start the youth movement, opening day with Gunnar, Westburg, Ortiz, Mayo, Kjertstad, Cowser, maybe even Stowers and Holiday if they have a strong Spring. 

 

 

They are not going to spend on a multi yr FA pitcher. They need to identify a few yr controllable type they can trade for like Minn did with Lopez. Maybe not one where another team will ask for Holiday.


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#7 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 09:57 AM

They need to decide whether Wells and/or Hall is going to be a starter next year.  If they both start, then a rotation of Bradish, Rodriguez, Wells, Kremer, and Hall is pretty good on paper.  But if you move both to the rotation, it really weakens the bullpen.  They might decide to make Wells the closer next year.



#8 Mackus

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:01 AM

They need to decide whether Wells and/or Hall is going to be a starter next year.  If they both start, then a rotation of Bradish, Rodriguez, Wells, Kremer, and Hall is pretty good on paper.  But if you move both to the rotation, it really weakens the bullpen.  They might decide to make Wells the closer next year.

 

Hall is a reliever forever now.  He won't start any more games.  

 

I don't expect them to do anything to address the rotation, but it'll be a terrible decision.  They have the resources and the dire need to add a really good SP.  Not a one-year deal or guy you can acquire for an irrelevant prospect.  Could make the argument they need two of them.


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#9 mweb08

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:06 AM

They need to decide whether Wells and/or Hall is going to be a starter next year. If they both start, then a rotation of Bradish, Rodriguez, Wells, Kremer, and Hall is pretty good on paper. But if you move both to the rotation, it really weakens the bullpen. They might decide to make Wells the closer next year.

I don't think that's a good rotation on paper. Kremer is fine as a backend guy, but Wells can't be depended on in the rotation imo and like Mackus said, Hall is likely just a reliever at this point (I did like what I saw from him this series out of the pen).

Means hopefully is in the rotation next year, but even with him I really want to see a legit SP added that can be slotted toward the top of the rotation, preferably a lefty.
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#10 russsnyder

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:12 AM

I agree with Mack that Hall is no longer a starter. I think that having him throwing 98 out of the pen fits their BP needs. I also prefer Wells out of the pen at this point as well, He's effective and I think you can manage his workload better. I think Web makes a good point about acquiring an anchor to bolster the starting rotation. Do it via trade or free agency. The window is open on this club, however, it doesn't take a lot for it to close.
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#11 NewMarketSean

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:14 AM

  • Blake Snell, Padres
  • Marcus Stroman, Cubs ($21 million player option)
  • Aaron Nola, Phillies
  • Yoshinobu Yamamoto, NPB
  • Clayton Kershaw, Dodgers
  • Eduardo Rodriguez, Tigers (player opt-out available)
  • Sonny Gray, Twins
  • Hyun Jin Ryu, Blue Jays
  • Charlie Morton, Braves ($20 million club option)
  • Jordan Montgomery, Rangers
  • Kyle Hendricks, Cubs ($16 million club option)
  • Alex Cobb, Giants ($10 million club option)
  • Mike Clevinger, White Sox ($12 million mutual option)
  • Michael Wacha, Padres ($16 million mutual option)
  • Wade Miley, Brewers ($10 million mutual option)
  • Seth Lugo, Padres ($7.5 million player option)
  • Martín Pérez, Rangers
  • Lance Lynn, Dodgers ($18 million club option)
  • Lucas Giolito, Guardians
  • Kenta Maeda, Twins
  • Michael Lorenzen, Phillies
  • Tyler Mahle, Twins

No excuse for this team to not sign at least one of those guys.


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#12 Mackus

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:19 AM

No excuse for this team to not sign at least one of those guys.

 

I'd accept them trading for someone better than anyone on this list as a valid excuse.  But agree, no valid excuse to not add a front-of-rotation, if not top-of-rotation, starting pitcher. 

 

Angelos not authorizing the expense because he's cheap and/or Elias being unwilling to sacrifice the prospect cost because he's always thinking long are likely excuses, just are not valid ones, IMO.


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#13 BaltBird 24

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:24 AM

Bradish, Rodriguez, and Kremer should be locks for the rotation. Means as well, though we'll see what his "elbow pain" was all about. There aren't really any SP prospects beating down the door unless you count McDermott.

Guys like Wells and Hall should be strictly destined to the BP.

#14 SonicAttack

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:27 AM

  • Blake Snell, Padres
  • Marcus Stroman, Cubs ($21 million player option)
  • Aaron Nola, Phillies
  • Yoshinobu Yamamoto, NPB
  • Clayton Kershaw, Dodgers
  • Eduardo Rodriguez, Tigers (player opt-out available)
  • Sonny Gray, Twins
  • Hyun Jin Ryu, Blue Jays
  • Charlie Morton, Braves ($20 million club option)
  • Jordan Montgomery, Rangers
  • Kyle Hendricks, Cubs ($16 million club option)
  • Alex Cobb, Giants ($10 million club option)
  • Mike Clevinger, White Sox ($12 million mutual option)
  • Michael Wacha, Padres ($16 million mutual option)
  • Wade Miley, Brewers ($10 million mutual option)
  • Seth Lugo, Padres ($7.5 million player option)
  • Martín Pérez, Rangers
  • Lance Lynn, Dodgers ($18 million club option)
  • Lucas Giolito, Guardians
  • Kenta Maeda, Twins
  • Michael Lorenzen, Phillies
  • Tyler Mahle, Twins

No excuse for this team to not sign at least one of those guys.

 Like I said prior, Kenta Maeda would be a good get, and possibly fit the O's budget.  I see the O's going for a Dallas Keuchel type unfortunately, hope ownership proves me wrong. 



#15 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:34 AM

On paper they can cover the roster internally and still be an 85 win team without huge injuries. Again, on paper. They will add but what will they add. I think you have to expect more Givens and Gibson type players. The only thing that kinda has me guessing is how many spots do they plan to open for the guys on the cusp at AAA and what do they do with the excess talent. To me that cant be ignored. You cant just send all of Norby, Cowser, Holliday, Mayo, Kjerstad back for a year at AAA. Even a fringe guy like Stowers should be given more of a look somewhere at the MLB level

#16 CantonJester

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:40 AM

Bradish, Rodriguez, and Kremer should be locks for the rotation. Means as well, though we'll see what his "elbow pain" was all about. There aren't really any SP prospects beating down the door unless you count McDermott.

Guys like Wells and Hall should be strictly destined to the BP.

 

I get that Kremer’s under team control over the next several seasons, but until he develops an out pitch and cuts his 4.51 FIP down significantly, he should not be viewed as anything other than a back of the rotation arm. Maybe he can just focus on a couple pitches and his future lies in the pen (if he can gain better control of them). 


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#17 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:40 AM

Lot of crapping on Mullins and Rutschman which is insane but whatever. People gonna be emotional. Up the middle guys are so damn important. I dont think its understood how hard it is to find legit defensive CFs that can give you any type of offense. Same at C. Elias has plenty of ways to go with the position players but the up the middle guys of Rutsch, Gunnar, and Ced are must keeps. For me, and I cant believe Im saying this vs where Ive been in the past, Santander is damn near a keeper as well. Hes a switchy with power from both sides. Thats also rare. You keep him and let him walk at the end of '23 or trade him if the '23 season isnt going as planned. Think it would be unwise to force a trade of him this offseason feeling like you need to get something in return before he hits FA.

#18 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:46 AM

Like the prospects of Wells and Hall as full time RP. Ideally they help cover the loss of Felix. Dont even mess with either as a SP. You got 3 guys locked in with Bradish, GRod, and Means. Realistically Kremer is locked in too. Irvin will be back. 1st yr arb guy. The will add a SP through FA or trade to replace Gibson. We all know it should be a upper end guy but likely to be a back end guy. Adding a proven back end arm will go long way too. It can be a Robertson or a Kimbrel. Ideally its Hader but again thats unrealistic. Just get someone to start at the back end and work from there. Maybe Hall or Wells eventually take the spot. But dont go into the season putting that pressure on either guy.

#19 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 10:51 AM


I get that Kremer’s under team control over the next several seasons, but until he develops an out pitch and cuts his 4.51 FIP down significantly, he should not be viewed as anything other than a back of the rotation arm. Maybe he can just focus on a couple pitches and his future lies in the pen (if he can gain better control of them).

Didnt even get in my final dig that we threw one of the 5 worst SP in an elimination game of the ALDS. SMH. In all seriousness you go to his Savant page. Its still filled with a lot of blue. His xERA of 4.96 was in the 21 percentile. ×BAA was in the 16%. Smoke and mirrors 5th SP at best. It shouldnt surprise anyone if Irvin is the better SP in '24.

#20 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 11:00 AM

Didnt even get in my final dig that we threw one of the 5 worst SP in an elimination game of the ALDS. SMH. In all seriousness you go to his Savant page. Its still filled with a lot of blue. His xERA of 4.96 was in the 21 percentile. ×BAA was in the 16%. Smoke and mirrors 5th SP at best. It shouldnt surprise anyone if Irvin is the better SP in '24.

 

Kremer was going to have to start an elimination game, though, just a question of whether it was game 3 or 4.  The Means injury killed them.






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