102 replies to this topic

[Mackus]

31-16 in '23 doesn't need any help from the '22 W-L record to validate their position.    

 

I think that having played well last season certainly bolsters belief in the legitimacy of this year's hot start.  How could it not?  

[weird-O]

And by the way, we are now 30% in. Still a long ways to go but 30% doesnt qualify as "out of the gate" either.


But Ill be the first to tell anyone that the mediocre to poor stretch is coming. It happens to nearly every team every year. So ken and others will have their moment to do their thing. That will be fun.

So Ken is the one whose rooting for them to lose? I'm piecing this together, since you seem shy about actually naming names. Anyone else in the Jeep with him?

[weird-O]

I think that having played well last season certainly bolsters belief in the legitimacy of this year's hot start.  How could it not?  

I'm not sure how else to say this. I AGREE. Does that help if I shout it?

 

Or, they are a good team, even if they took a nose dive to close out '22. 

 

Apparently, I'm the new Pollyanna  

[TwentyThirtyFive]

So Ken is the one whose rooting for them to lose? I'm piecing this together, since you seem shy about actually naming names. Anyone else in the Jeep with him?

There are a lot of miserable fans who revel in being Randy Quaid's character in Major League.

[bmore_ken]

Like I posted, pointing out that they turned a corner last season is a fun fact. But the way people beat that drum around here, is more than just a little over the top. As for the pretender aspect of it, your GM said they were pretenders last season. You can't get much more of a competent opinion than that one. The O's are 31-16, isn't that good enough to stand on it's own merit? I think it is. And I thought their W-L record stood on its own, before they started winning multiple series against other good teams.   

Exactly, like last year's wins count toward this year's standings. 

[bmore_ken]

Love fans that essentially root for the team to lose to fit their narrative. Second best record in baseball, just swept the Blue Jays in Toronto, the best farm system in the sport on top of it that includes yet another #1 overall prospect. You’re allowed to enjoy it and still hate ownership and how they got here. Ask Ricker.

I don't see anyone rooting for them to lose. Who would they be exactly?

[bmore_ken]

Of course you do.  It's your whole schtick here.  But all good my friend.  Enjoy the season.

If that's your opinion, all good. That's not how I feel and I won't bother trying to convince you of that. 

[makoman]

Exactly, like last year's wins count toward this year's standings. 

Yet you are using their historical deficiencies (I guess? not sure what else) to claim the team with the second best record in the league is not a contender. 

[bmore_ken]

The citation of the record wasn't by me, but it seems clear it wasn't for you, it is clear you don't need it. It was for ken who said the O's aren't even a contender, today, at 31-16. Then claimed he is just a realist, which is what pessimists always say as justification. 

That's not what I said. I said two months with a solid record doesn't necessarily make them a contender because it's too early to know that, just like you can't count the Padres out because they've struggled the first two months. I also said they were playing great, but let's get selective about which part of my post you choose to present. 

[bmore_ken]

I understand. I've been talking baseball with Ken for so long, I guess I've learned how to interpret his comments. But there's a great chasm between pessimism (which could be better termed as tempered optimism) and rooting for them to lose.

I've been on this board long enough for everyone to interpret my posts. You're just intellectually honest about it even though I don't RAH RAH everything they do. The fact is it's a long season and a lot can happen. Especially when they didn't improve the SP and GR has already been sent back down. I 100% hope they have a great season since I may be one of a few people here who have actually seen their last two world series. I want that for all of us. 

[bmore_ken]

Yet you are using their historical deficiencies (I guess? not sure what else) to claim the team with the second best record in the league is not a contender. 

Show me a post where I did that. 

[makoman]

That's not what I said. I said two months with a solid record doesn't necessarily make them a contender because it's too early to know that, just like you can't count the Padres out because they've struggled the first two months. I also said they were playing great, but let's get selective about which part of my post you choose to present. 

Ok. To me saying it's premature to call them a contender means they aren't a contender at this point. It's binary, contender or not contender. Are the Dodgers? The Braves? Rays? It's awfully early still...if your opinion is that no one is a contender on May 23rd that's fine, I personally wouldn't use that definition but can now see where you are coming from, if true.

 

In the same vein, are the Ravens a contender this year? Does their roster and what they've done in the past matter, particularly with a similar roster last year? Or do we need to wait until week 10 or so to see?

 

Show me a post where I did that. 

I said I guess, because I don't understand why the team with the 2nd best record in the league wouldn't be a contender. People can infer things, and have to sometimes, everything isn't always spelled out. But see the rest of my post above. 

[bmore_ken]

Ok. To me saying it's premature to call them a contender means they aren't a contender at this point. It's binary, contender or not contender. Are the Dodgers? The Braves? Rays? It's awfully early still...if your opinion is that no one is a contender on May 23rd that's fine, I personally wouldn't use that definition but can now see where you are coming from, if true.

 

In the same vein, are the Ravens a contender this year? Does their roster and what they've done in the past matter, particularly with a similar roster last year? Or do we need to wait until week 10 or so to see?

 

I said I guess, because I don't understand why the team with the 2nd best record in the league wouldn't be a contender. People can infer things, and have to sometimes, everything isn't always spelled out. But see the rest of my post above. 

IMO. No team is a contender after two months in a seven month season, just like no team is out of it after two months. I don't know how else to explain my opinion. And it's strictly my opinion. If you guys consider them contenders more power to you. We all have our own opinions. You apparently don't like mine while i don't have a problem with yours. And as an aside, The Yankees were in last place about a week or two ago.

[Mackus]

Ken you seem to have a tendency to make statements that aren't explicitly quantified but can only have one reasonable interpretation, and then act very defensive when anyone cites that singular reasonable interpretation as being your opinion.  That is not the same as people putting words in your mouth.

[bmore_ken]

Ken you seem to have a tendency to make statements that aren't explicitly quantified but can only have one reasonable interpretation, and then act very defensive when anyone cites that singular reasonable interpretation as being your opinion.

I'm not defensive at all. People tend to have issues with my opinion if I don't think the O's are the best thing since sliced bread, which is actually fine. Have I attacked anyone for their opinion on this thread? I literally said they're playing great. 

[makoman]

IMO. No team is a contender after two months in a seven month season, just like no team is out of it after two months. I don't know how else to explain my opinion. And it's strictly my opinion. If you guys consider them contenders more power to you. We all have our own opinions. You apparently don't like mine while i don't have a problem with yours. And as an aside, The Yankees were in last place about a week or two ago.

I said literally "if your opinion is that no one is a contender on May 23rd that's fine, I personally wouldn't use that definition but can now see where you are coming from, if true." So yes, I think you confirmed that, and like I implied I don't really agree, but I don't have a problem with yours either.

[85Knight]

That's not what I said. I said two months with a solid record doesn't necessarily make them a contender because it's too early to know that, just like you can't count the Padres out because they've struggled the first two months. I also said they were playing great, but let's get selective about which part of my post you choose to present.

It might be too early for you but I think 30% in is very significant and it's backed up by a team whose trajectory has been upward for over a full season now. What are you waiting for, the All Star break or are you just being a Debbie Downer?

[Mackus]

I'm not defensive at all. People tend to have issues with my opinion if I don't think the O's are the best thing since sliced bread, which is actually fine. Have I attacked anyone for their opinion on this thread? I literally said they're playing great. 

 

"show me one post where I said that" is getting defensive.  People aren't putting words in your mouth.  The things you are saying generally mean what everyone is interpreting them to be and responding to.

 

Its like you say something is more than 2 but less than 4, another poster replies and asks why do you think its 3, and you respond with "show me one post where I said it was 3".  Sure, you didn't explicitly say 3, but the words can only be interpreted to mean 3.

[makoman]

It might be too early for you but I think 30% in is very significant and it's backed up by a team whose trajectory has been upward for over a full season now. What are you waiting for, the All Star break or are you just being a Debbie Downer?

Do you mean some kind of upward arc? 

[BobPhelan]

Do you mean some kind of upward arc?

Perhaps… lifting off, so to speak?