513 replies to this topic

[hallas]

Yes, it's fun to magically pretend that the athletic department has the funds to not only fire Durkin and pay him off, but to fire Turgeon as well, then pay big dollars to another coaching candidate.

It's just not realistic. Anyone arguing that the department has the funds is either misinformed or guessing incorrectly.

It would take a booster being willing to fund his buyout to be able to afford it at this point. Or something so terrible that the economic fallout is more palatable than keeping him on. Something like Durkin. Not just disappointing results for the program.

 

I'm willing to bet that the buyout, both as a percentage of promised money and in absolute terms, for Durkin was a lot lower than it would be for Turgeon.  Even if they didn't fire Durkin I doubt they'd want to try and buy out Turgeon because of the economic implications.

[birdwatcher55]

Does this Turgeon looking to leave Maryland story have any real legs?

[Mike B]

Does this Turgeon looking to leave Maryland story have any real legs?

Who knows but if you read some of the "fans" comments on Testudo Times, you realize you have to take most with a grain of salt.  Just from listening to interviews, I get the feeling Turgeon really likes this team, and I think he has some good players who are 4 year guys.  Guys like Morsell, Cowan, Lindo, Ayala, and even Wiggins look like good players who will be at CP for the duration of their eligibility.  He has shown he can recruit talent to augment these guys, so I think he would want to stay and see where it takes him.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Nate Oats from Buffalo would be on my radar if you did make a move with Turgeon.

Bruce Pearl too. Admittedly some baggage there.

 

3/22 EDIT: My number 1 dream pursuit would be Billy Donvoan.

[SBTarheel]

Nate Oats from Buffalo would be on my radar if you did make a move with Turgeon.

Bruce Pearl too. Admittedly some baggage there.

Understatement of the century? 

 

[BSLChrisStoner]

Understatement of the century? 

 

Yeah, I mean reading about the issues he's had...  some are trivial. But they add up. 

Still, he has been at Auburn for 5 years now.  

I just like his personality, and how his teams play.  There is some fire, some aggressiveness.  Teams that come out ready to swing. 

MD's teams under Turgeon are so soft. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

Soft and never multi-dimensional in terms of style. He's just a stubborn, limited coach scheme wise, and rarely improve.

Don't trust Pearl, he's got shady character, even when you think he finally "gets it", he's still who he is. Think Rick Pitino. It's tempting, but we don't need to be desperate here. Get a young up and coming guy, like Nate Oats, whom you've mentioned previously.

[Mike in STL]

Soft and never multi-dimensional in terms of style. He's just a stubborn, limited coach scheme wise, and rarely improve.

Don't trust Pearl, he's got shady character, even when you think he finally "gets it", he's still who he is. Think Rick Pitino. It's tempting, but we don't need to be desperate here. Get a young up and coming guy, like Nate Oats, whom you've mentioned previously.

I think Pitino isn’t a great personality though. Pearl is easily likable, genuine, minus the baggage.

Pearl went topless in a rally in the student section for a Lady Vols game. That’s just cool.

I’m fine with an up and comer too. Maybe if Juan has some success with Coppin State....love to get an alum in here. Blake would probably make a great coach. Someone who knows what MD basketball is supposed to be.

[BSLChrisStoner]

I do see there is some additional recent issues with Pearl.

Enough that MD in particular probably would have to stay away.

The whole football saga was a PR nightmare. You would need to hire someone where there was zero smoke.

[birdwatcher55]

I've had it with Turgeon. I'm ready to cut a deal with the devil. Bring in
Miller or Pitino. Make Maryland Basketball Great Again! I don't believe there's much baggage with Miller and if Pitino has repented, everyone deserves a second chance.

[mdrunning]

Yes, it's fun to magically pretend that the athletic department has the funds to not only fire Durkin and pay him off, but to fire Turgeon as well, then pay big dollars to another coaching candidate.

It's just not realistic. Anyone arguing that the department has the funds is either misinformed or guessing incorrectly.

It would take a booster being willing to fund his buyout to be able to afford it at this point. Or something so terrible that the economic fallout is more palatable than keeping him on. Something like Durkin. Not just disappointing results for the program.

I heard on the radio yesterday that Turgeon's contract contains no buyout provision, which I found to be a tad bit surprising.

 

From what I subsequently read, should the university fire Turgeon, they'd owe him 50 percent of his base and supplemental salaries within 60 days, with the remainder of the contract's base and supplemental salaries to be paid through the end of his term. The only money on which Turgeon would miss out are bonuses he obviously wouldn't have reached.

 

(P.S. I hope I'm not simply parroting what's already been stated on here. I looked through the thread and didn't find any specific mention.)

[Mackus]

I heard on the radio yesterday that Turgeon's contract contains no buyout provision, which I found to be a tad bit surprising.

From what I subsequently read, should the university fire Turgeon, they'd owe him 50 percent of his base and supplemental salaries within 60 days, with the remainder of the contract's base and supplemental salaries to be paid through the end of his term. The only money on which Turgeon would miss out are bonuses he obviously wouldn't have reached.

(P.S. I hope I'm not simply parroting what's already been stated on here. I looked through the thread and didn't find any specific mention.)

Its been mentioned, though I think without the exact langauge of the contract. Even if it was quoted verbatim from what you've said here, this is worth repeating

[Mike in STL]

Leaving my own theories out of it, here is what is out there for us to see:

 

https://www.washingt...m=.5fd95cbc6b47

 

Washington Post article says Turgeon is due $2.557M per year through the 22'-23' season. Four more seasons. If he is fired, he is owed all it it. Currently $10.228M if it happened today. If he leaves on his own for a new job, he owes the school $350k, or $250K is it is in the final year. 

 

The loss on Saturday cost Turgeon a $75K bonus he gets if the teams makes the sweet 16. $100K for elite 8, $150K for the final four, and $200k for the title game. Other incentives, Turgeon can make up $425K/year in bonuses. For argument sake, if this was the NFL with a salary cap, those incentives count against the cap because the money has to be earmarked. Can't go over the cap if the incentive is reached. But if not reached, it can be rolled over to the next seasons cap.

 

$425K looks significant.

 

Heres the 17'-18' Terps Athletics report. 

https://umterps.com/...iew.pdf?id=7953

 

Read into it what you will. And I don't see this years anywhere which will look interesting with football turmoil. But for a year ago, reported revenue from all athletics was $95,817,442. Reported expenses for all athletics were $95,342,196. That means that athletics made $475,246. That is a razor thin margin considering you're dealing in nearly $100M in transactions a year. If Turgeon earned all his bonuses, that brings profit down to about $50K, although revenue would maybe up from ticket sales, but expenses as well when you consider travel for the NCAAT that they didn't make.

 

Also took a look at Penn State's report. They deal in larger numbers, obviously. Bottom line, profited $5.3M last year. 

https://gopsusports....617.pdf?id=8422

 

One area of note. Maryland has 500ish student athletes and they paid $10.4M in travel expenses. Penn State has 800ish student athletes and they paid $7.1M in travel expenses. Unless Penn State is putting their athletes up in the no tell motel while MD puts theirs up in the Hilton on the road, and assuming these numbers are even 99.9% accurate, it's pretty clear MD spends way too much on this. Get someone who makes travel cheaper, and there is $3.3M+ a year you can use to purge Turge. 

 

There. I found a way to find the money to fire him with the information available to the public. If you believe it to be a 100% accurate. 

 

 

 

[birdwatcher55]

Didn't MD get $50 million dollars for joining the Big Ten? MD Basketball is a cash cow beside. Please, nobody should cry poverty if we fire a mediocre basketball coach. Bite the fucking bullet Alumni.

[JordanKough]

There. I found a way to find the money to fire him with the information available to the public. If you believe it to be a 100% accurate. 

 

I mean money can always be found if you need it.

 

Though this feels a little like Dave and the scene where the Dad from Beethoven helps him find the money he needs in the budget. 

 

[DJ MC]

Though this feels a little like Dave and the scene where the Dad from Beethoven helps him find the money he needs in the budget.

 

I mean, he is a pretty decent accountant...

[BSLZackKiesel]

Didn't MD get $50 million dollars for joining the Big Ten? MD Basketball is a cash cow beside. Please, nobody should cry poverty if we fire a mediocre basketball coach. Bite the fucking bullet Alumni.

They paid the ACC $50 million to leave. Their Big Ten profit shares have helped, but to this point have essentially only gotten them back into the green after years of being in the red. I believe the shares get bigger in the next few years, which should open some things up.

 

I had inside knowledge of the athletic department's budget as recently as Spring 2016 when I was leading The Pride, and Mike's analysis is pretty spot-on. People assume there's all this money to go around, but the bottom line is that their profit margins are tiny. For awhile there, they were in the red. Since 2010, they've had to buy out the contracts of 3 different head football coaches and numerous assistants. For Damon Evans to go to the boosters yet again to buyout the contract of another head coach (and all of his assistants), he'd have to do a lot worse than reach NCAA Tournament in 4 of the last 5 seasons.

 

In a perfect world, there would be an easy way out of Turgeon's contract. But the bottom line is that this athletic department isn't going to eat the cost to buy him out just yet. Not that it isn't a worthwhile conversation to have, but it simply isn't happening anytime soon.

[McNulty]

I mean money can always be found if you need it.

Though this feels a little like Dave and the scene where the Dad from Beethoven helps him find the money he needs in the budget.

Call Charles Grodin a bitter old man one more time and SEE WHAT HAPPENS

[SportsGuy]

If he wasn’t winning, would they keep him?

Are the results just good enough where they don’t see a need to fire him or would it not matter at all if he was winning or not? I.e., they wouldn’t fire him no matter what?

[Mackus]

They broke even the year before they had to buy out the entire football coaching staff and hire a new one. They won't be coming close to breaking even during the '18-19 fiscal unless donors pitched in a ton of the money to move on from Durkin which I haven't seen.

Also, Turgeon's contract doesn't just need to be covered. Half of the remaining money due has to be paid almost immediately after you fire him. So you need to find a ton of cash to can him, over $5M right away plus the remaining 50% in installments.

Mike I appreciate you trying to find sources and wrap your head around the numbers unlike others who just foolishly say they must be able to afford it because of...I don't know, magic, I guess. I hope people don't deal with their own personal finances the same way.