48 replies to this topic

[DJ MC]

The Sun: Prospect Xu Guiyuan has Orioles in leadoff spot as baseball eyes China market
http://www.baltimore...0108-story.html

 

 

Deeming baseball a "bourgeois indulgence for the rich," Mao Zedong, China's longtime communist leader, banned the game in 1966 during his Cultural Revolution.

 

Fifty years later, even as the popularity of other Western sports such as basketball booms in mainland China, baseball remains largely unfamiliar. But the Baltimore Orioles are in the leadoff spot for a mounting effort by Major League Baseball to revive the game there.

[RShack]

China's got a whole lot of people... which means they have a whole lot of potential baseball talent... but it'll take a couple generations before they know what they're doing...

 

I remember when the Ruskies were making an effort because of the Olympics... the American coach of their national team said they'd made a lot of progress in a short time... but he also said that any decent American HS team could clean their clock... (his phrase, not mine...)

[SportsGuy]

I said we should try to get into China before everyone else years ago.

[DJ MC]

The Sun: Chapter 1: Chinese Orioles signee Xu Guiyuan will arrive with intrigue

 

From China to Birdland

 

Arriving at Orioles minor league spring training this week, Xu Guiyuan, a 20-year-old left-handed-hitting first baseman, is trying to become the first player from mainland China to make it to the big leagues. He’s already the first player signed from one of the major league's three youth developmental centers in China, a country that American baseball officials consider fertile ground to grow their sport. He has adopted the nickname "Itchy Shoe," a reference to his hero, Ichiro Suzuki, and the phonetic pronunciation of "Xu." The Baltimore Sun's Jeff Barker is following Xu's journey with daily reports and videos: Can he hit American pitching, much less navigate the pressure and cultural curveballs that accompany his 9,000-mile trip? Barker is involved in a documentary chronicling Xu and Major League Baseball’s China push.

[Mike in STL]

Meanwhile....the Orioles continue to ignore scouting the countries where actual talented baseball players play.

[DJ MC]

Meanwhile....the Orioles continue to ignore scouting the countries where actual talented baseball players play.

 

Yeah, that seems like a necessary comment for this thread.

 

"Hey, the team's trying something different, and is at the forefront of a major effort by the sport as a whole, but they also aren't doing exactly what I want them to, so fuck 'em."

[NewMarketSean]

Yeah, that seems like a necessary comment for this thread.

 

"Hey, the team's trying something different, and is at the forefront of a major effort by the sport as a whole, but they also aren't doing exactly what I want them to, so fuck 'em."

 

Right maybe they'll make a G rated Disney movie about our efforts in China. Because thats what it's all about.

 

And not, you know, about winning baseball games.

[DJ MC]

Right maybe they'll make a G rated Disney movie about our efforts in China. Because thats what it's all about.

 

And not, you know, about winning baseball games.

 

K

[Mike in STL]

Yeah, that seems like a necessary comment for this thread.
 
"Hey, the team's trying something different, and is at the forefront of a major effort by the sport as a whole, but they also aren't doing exactly what I want them to, so fuck 'em."

Pretty much.

The Orioles operate within a tight budget. History has taught us that the most bang for your buck is signing Cuban free agents for middle of the road money and get All-Star caliber production.

The Orioles ignore this to be trail blazers instead.

They want to do something different? Find some players with plate discipline for once. Hire folks who can develop young arms. Not ruin them and allow them to be Cy Young winners elsewhere.

[Mike in STL]

^^^^^^

When They find that in China let me know.

[DJ MC]

Pretty much.

The Orioles operate within a tight budget. History has taught us that the most bang for your buck is signing Cuban free agents for middle of the road money and get All-Star caliber production.

The Orioles ignore this to be trail blazers instead.

They want to do something different? Find some players with plate discipline for once. Hire folks who can develop young arms. Not ruin them and allow them to be Cy Young winners elsewhere.

 

I didn't realize you knew how much they were spending to find players in China. Would you care to share that information with the rest of the class?

[Chris B]

I'm not sure that signing Cuban free agents is getting the most "bang for your buck" at all.

[Pedro Cerrano]

Yeah, that seems like a necessary comment for this thread.

 

"Hey, the team's trying something different, and is at the forefront of a major effort by the sport as a whole, but they also aren't doing exactly what I want them to, so fuck 'em."

 

Please.  If there was an influx of talent in China the Yankees and Dodgers would have been there already.

[Pedro Cerrano]

How many Dominican players have the Orioles ever signed as international FAs?  Venezuelan?  Cuban?  

[NewMarketSean]

The Orioles do deserve some props for leading the charge in China. Just by sheer population alone, there has to be a some MLB quality talent there. Hopefully the Orioles blazing a trail earns them some good will and when players are ready to sign with MLB teams, the Orioles are at the top of the list. But, we have to be willing to pay those guys, agree to their physicals, etc. And when other teams catch on to China, will the O's do what it takes to sign the best amateur talent? They haven't done that anywhere else.

 

Meanwhile, the best players are coming from Latin America and they've done little to nothing of note there. Players like Sano ($3.15 mil) were bargains -- low risk signings.

 

Yet the Orioles don't blink an eye signing mediocre talent for that money and more.

 

They definitely don't maximize potential per dollar they spend.

[Chris B]

They won't do it but this is the year that you go out and spend all of your international bonus pool allotment.

 

According to Baseball America, 11 teams cannot sign pool-eligible players for more than $300,000 this year.

 

The Diamondbacks, Red Sox, Rays, Yankees and Angels are serving their 2nd year of their penalty.

The Cubs, Reds, Giants, Royals and Dodgers cannot sign anyone for over $300,000 for this signing period (2016) and the next (2017). The Blue Jays cannot sign anyone over $300K for 2016.

 

That leaves 19 teams that can either: A- Use all of their pool money (O's unlikely) B- Use a portion of their pool money (O's likely) or C- Blow through their pool allotment and face a penalty for 2 season (O's incredibly unlikely).

 

AFAIK, the 2016 international bonus pools have not yet been released but they should soon. The Phillies are in a position to have the top bonus pool for 2016. According to BA reports, the Braves, Cardinals and Nationals are expected to blow past their pools (which includes signing young Cubans under 23 years old). The Rangers, Twins and Astros could also do the same.

 

Frankly, this year or the next year is when the Orioles should just make a huge push and go up and over their international pool (and pay the tax) when the market and available teams to sign is low. There's a big opportunity for them but unfortunately, given their history, they won't.

[Mike in STL]

I didn't realize you knew how much they were spending to find players in China. Would you care to share that information with the rest of the class?

Anytime they spend in China that isn't being spent in Latin countries is too much time.

[Mike in STL]

I'm not sure that signing Cuban free agents is getting the most "bang for your buck" at all.

You wouldn't want Yasiel Puig for $6M a year? You wouldn't want Aroldis Chapman for $5M per? Ok.

[Mike in STL]

How good are the Chinese at baseball?

http://www.baseballa...mproving-14808/

"In the other dugout, China, whose three-hole hitter, second baseman Lei Li, weighs 140 pounds. Lefthander Xin Li, the Chinese starting pitcher, parked his fastball at 78-83 mph. Ray Chang, a 29-year-old third baseman who hit .241/.304/.271 in 89 games for Minnesota’s Triple-A Rochester club last year, is their ringer, playing shortstop and batting cleanup."

"The game even had the shenanigans of a game between the Globetrotters and the Generals. In the second inning, Fujia Chu had second base stolen after a pitch got past Cuban catcher Eriel Sanchez. Yet despite the Spanish-to-Chinese language barrier, the Cuban infielders gesticulated to Chu that it was a foul ball, so Chu started walking back to first base. Once Chu was caught between second and first, Cuban second baseman Jose Fernandez tagged him out."

"For China to start producing major league prospects, however, might take another 10 years. Or it could take 20 years. Or it might never become a fruitful source of talent for MLB. It’s certainly not there yet, but progress is being made."

The ace of the national team barely throws 80mph. So who are they hitting against? It's a giant waste of time being there until maybe the next decade.

[Pedro Cerrano]

Their clean up hitter had a .575 OPS in AAA.

Agree with Mike. Colossal waste of time and money. Par for the course.