304 replies to this topic

[Pedro Cerrano]

Use whatever words you want, define it how you want. People were saying the day Edsall was hired that he was a meh coach with limited potential. That wasn't in hindsight. He was certainly not Plan A. Probably not Plan B.  Who knows exactly how far down the line he really was for Anderson.  

Please show me proof that any of the above is true. And, btw, "people" does not mean random folks on a message board.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Why are you mentioning Nick Saban? What does he have to do with anything?

There is nothing that indicates any of those guys you mentioned are any better or worse than Edsall when he was hired.

 

Maybe, maybe not. I would hope that when an AD goes through the hiring process, they are consulting with people who actually have quite a bit of insight as to one's coaching abilities... not just people who are aware of fan narratives that aren't necessarily based on fact. The narrative on Edsall was he was a program builder. The things I've observed are that he's an adequate recruiter, but that his MD teams have been generally unprepared (although also incredibly unhealthy, to be fair).

[Oriole85]

Those two guys haven't shown that they CAN'T be great. Edsall has shown that and had when he was hired at MD. That's my whole point. I'm not saying anyone on that list is the next Nick Saban. I'm saying that those guys COULD be the next great college coach. Not many people, if any, thought that about Edsall.

 

Maryland didn't need their program built from the ground up. Should Alabama had hired Greg Schiano instead of Saban? After all, he built that program from the ground up. 

Again, these comparisons are ludicrous. Maryland has much more limitations than Alabama. If Maryland had the resources of Bama, they would've gotten someone better. 

[bnickle]

Please show me proof that any of the above is true. And, btw, "people" does not mean random folks on a message board.

Let me know the last time a guy was hired and the media criticized him or even say, it's a mediocre hire. Especially nationally. 99% of the time you're going to get cliché's and praise. There were certainly articles and media members at the time saying he wasn't Plan A. That's pretty much well known. Im sure if you google it you'll find a credible source on that.

 

 

 

Of course a lot of the "people" are fans. It's not like they are just throwing shit up in the air in deciding whether they like a hire or not. You look at the situation he was coming from, the numbers he put up, talk to opposing fans who've really seen him coach a lot. There just was never any excitement about Edsall. It barely made a ripple on any stage.

[Pedro Cerrano]

Let me know the last time a guy was hired and the media criticized him or even say, it's a mediocre hire. Especially nationally. 99% of the time you're going to get cliché's and praise. There were certainly articles and media members at the time saying he wasn't Plan A. That's pretty much well known. Im sure if you google it you'll find a credible source on that.
 
 
 
Of course a lot of the "people" are fans. It's not like they are just throwing shit up in the air in deciding whether they like a hire or not. You look at the situation he was coming from, the numbers he put up, talk to opposing fans who've really seen him coach a lot. There just was never any excitement about Edsall. It barely made a ripple on any stage.

Sorry, none of this is even close to convincing.

[Oriole85]

Maybe, maybe not. I would hope that when an AD goes through the hiring process, they are consulting with people who actually have quite a bit of insight as to one's coaching abilities... not just people who are aware of fan narratives that aren't necessarily based on fact. The narrative on Edsall was he was a program builder. The things I've observed are that he's an adequate recruiter, but that his MD teams have been generally unprepared (although also incredibly unhealthy, to be fair).

With the way the ADs have changed from coaches moving up to it being more of a CEO position(big business), they almost always rely on search firms.

[Oriole85]

Let me know the last time a guy was hired and the media criticized him or even say, it's a mediocre hire. Especially nationally. 99% of the time you're going to get cliché's and praise. There were certainly articles and media members at the time saying he wasn't Plan A. That's pretty much well known. Im sure if you google it you'll find a credible source on that.

 

 

 

Of course a lot of the "people" are fans. It's not like they are just throwing shit up in the air in deciding whether they like a hire or not. You look at the situation he was coming from, the numbers he put up, talk to opposing fans who've really seen him coach a lot. There just was never any excitement about Edsall. It barely made a ripple on any stage.

Weren't you saying it was widely panned from Day 1, so surely there was some reputable college football expert who panned it. Now you are saying they are never criticized when hired. Which way do you want it?

[bnickle]

Sorry, none of this is even close to convincing.

Oh well. Go do your own research. You think Im sitting here lying to you or "misremembering" the vibe around the Edsall hire.

 

 

 

The proof is in the pudding. The people, whether Joe Blow who is a casual CFF fan or a very informed media member, who were not fans of the hire at the time are being proven correct.

[Mike in STL]

I think the one thing we're forgetting is that to be the best team, you have to pay for it. Literally. I'm 99% sure Maryland goes about its business the right way, and that's why they are mediocre. Pete Carrolls USC, Urban Meyers Florida, Chip Kellys Oregon, Sabans Alabama soon to come, and others...all paid to be the best.

[Oriole85]

I think the one thing we're forgetting is that to be the best team, you have to pay for it. Literally. I'm 99% sure Maryland goes about its business the right way, and that's why they are mediocre. Pete Carrolls USC, Urban Meyers Florida, Chip Kellys Oregon, Sabans Alabama soon to come, and others...all paid to be the best.

Bingo, I was talking about resources being limited and Maryland just can't compete with those programs you mentioned. 

[bnickle]

Weren't you saying it was widely panned from Day 1, so surely there was some reputable college football expert who panned it. Now you are saying they are never criticized when hired. Which way do you want it?

 

No you are putting words in my mouth. Never said panned and I never said some reptable "expert" criticized it. I just remember the vibe at the time.  

 

 

Everyone knew he wasn't Plan A. As DiLutis mentioned there were also other guys who were contacted and ultimately not interested. How are the fans supposed to buy into Edsall as a great hire when I know he is Plan C or D or E.

[Mackus]

I don't care about the decision to hire him anymore.  That's a sunk cost.  I don't want him back for what he's done since he's been here, not for whatever he did or didn't do before showing up.  I understand we can't afford to do it, though, and that's sad.  Maybe the team will do something next year to turn things around and he'll earn the right to stay. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

I don't care about the decision to hire him anymore.  That's a sunk cost.  I don't want him back for what he's done since he's been here, not for whatever he did or didn't do before showing up.  I understand we can't afford to do it, though, and that's sad.  Maybe the team will do something next year to turn things around and he'll earn the right to stay. 

 

Agreed, well said. This is pretty much where I am too.

[BSLMikeLowe]

I don't care about the decision to hire him anymore.  That's a sunk cost.  I don't want him back for what he's done since he's been here, not for whatever he did or didn't do before showing up.  I understand we can't afford to do it, though, and that's sad.  Maybe the team will do something next year to turn things around and he'll earn the right to stay. 

 

This. It's sad that as fans who care about the program (and apparently there aren't many who do) that this is the reality we face, that no matter what happens the rest of the season we're still at least one more year away from a change. I don't care what Edsall did at UConn, I don't care what the vibe was when he was hired. I only care about the results he's gotten at Maryland, and I don't see how even his staunchest supporters could say he's been a success up to now. Like I said already, I reached my tipping point with him yesterday...no one can throw out the injury excuse for that poor showing. And I think it will take a small miracle to avoid going 0-3 the rest of the way.

[Oriole85]

No you are putting words in my mouth. Never said panned and I never said some reptable "expert" criticized it. I just remember the vibe at the time.  

 

 

Everyone knew he wasn't Plan A. As DiLutis mentioned there were also other guys who were contacted and ultimately not interested. How are the fans supposed to buy into Edsall as a great hire when I know he is Plan C or D or E.

Turgeon wasn't plan A either and atleast plan C. So fans shouldn't buy into him either? Pete Carroll was a fallback at USC. Nick Saban wasn't the first option at Alabama. You don't always get your first choice.

[Mike in STL]

Bingo, I was talking about resources being limited and Maryland just can't compete with those programs you mentioned. 

Maybe they do. They could find enough money to buy a kid a car, or some escorts. Its not relatively expensive for a University. but then they run the risk of getting caught and all the hoopla that follows, if you care about that stuff. While the NCAAs enforcement of violations is laughable, I'd play ball. Look at what Miami got. A slap on the wrist.

[Oriole85]

Maybe they do. They could find enough money to buy a kid a car, or some escorts. Its not relatively expensive for a University. but then they run the risk of getting caught and all the hoopla that follows, if you care about that stuff. While the NCAAs enforcement of violations is laughable, I'd play ball. Look at what Miami got. A slap on the wrist.

All those programs you mentioned Maryland can't emulate in the current landscape. Not getting into this discussion of illegal activities.

[Oriole85]

No you are putting words in my mouth. Never said panned and I never said some reptable "expert" criticized it. I just remember the vibe at the time.  

 

 

Everyone knew he wasn't Plan A. As DiLutis mentioned there were also other guys who were contacted and ultimately not interested. How are the fans supposed to buy into Edsall as a great hire when I know he is Plan C or D or E.

It's not as bad as you are trying to make it out to be now. I remember it as well. 

[Mike in STL]

All those programs you mentioned Maryland can't emulate in the current landscape. Not getting into this discussion of illegal activities.

I'm joking, sort of. I'm glad they are doing things the right way. I can't express that enough.

But being completely hypothetical, they got some real players, and a real QB, they win the conference a few times, maybe a couple trips to the BCS playoffs, a heisman for the school. Then four years after the fact you find out they did it the wrong way, and the joke of a punishment is that they can't go to a bowl game next year, but they're a 7 win team anyway that year, and It means missing out on the "Macaroni and cheese Bowl", would it be worth it?

Again, not condoning cheating. I'd like to see more death penalties to scare schools straight and make college athletics fair. So the best scouts and coaches and programs really win. But if the fine for driving 100MPH was a dollar, I'd probably drive 100MPH.

[DJ MC]

His supporters say that Edsall is supposed to be recruiting better. I posted those numbers earlier.

 

They say he's supposed to be a strong leader of men. This team has a real shot to finish their third consecutive season with at least a six-game losing streak.

 

It honestly doesn't matter what he did at UConn. Whether because of his own faults, or because of failings outside of his control, it is looking pretty clear that he just isn't the right fit in this job.

 

I think of Bill Belichick and how he didn't succeed in Cleveland during his first go-round as an NFL head coach. He learned some lessons, found a better situation in New England, and became the coach he is today. Had he come to Baltimore with the franchise, though, there's no reason to think he would have suddenly improved.

 

Maybe that is what both sides need here: a fresh start.