28 replies to this topic

[dpsmith22]

No. We are using WAR here to describe the general level of player.

A 3-WAR player is a solid starting regular. 4-5 WAR is a borderline all-star. 6-7 WAR is a super-star. 1-2 WAR is a role player. It's a simple and easy-to-understand way to describe players. You don't have to know the full equation, that's not what we're talking about. This isn't a dissertation on the exact formula or criteria for determining what a player's WAR is. We're just using WAR instead of saying "better than average OF but not quite an AS" or other such description. It's shorthand.

In this case I agree with you. It can be used a quick description of a player and to catagorize someone.

[dpsmith22]

DJ MC:

It might be the best outcome of a bad situation, but it IS an example of how games are won and not counting towards someones "WAR".

Showing my point that WAR or any other stat you can name, does not tell the whole story. Thats all I am trying to say.

[DJ MC]

DJ MC:

It might be the best outcome of a bad situation, but it IS an example of how games are won and not counting towards someones "WAR".

Showing my point that WAR or any other stat you can name, does not tell the whole story. Thats all I am trying to say.

That's like complaining that a book on U.S. history doesn't tell the whole story because it doesn't include some minor, local event that had very little effect on the national landscape. I don't get upset reading about the American Revolution and not seeing a reference to the Bush Declaration.

[JTrea81]

Now I've seen the comments on the players somewhat, but what about the 7 categories?

I don't think I've seen anybody talk about a need for a hitter that had success in the postseason as a qualification for a MOO hitter, which is pretty strange considering hitting was our weakness in the postseason, and not pitching.

P/PA I've already talked about and I think most agree we need somebody that will work the pitchers, and OPS with RISP is also huge IMO, but is there anything that doesn't fit or is missing that you think should be a qualification?

[Mackus]

Now I've seen the comments on the players somewhat, but what about the 7 categories?

I don't think I've seen anybody talk about a need for a hitter that had success in the postseason as a qualification for a MOO hitter, which is pretty strange considering hitting was our weakness in the postseason, and not pitching.

P/PA I've already talked about and I think most agree we need somebody that will work the pitchers, and OPS with RISP is also huge IMO, but is there anything that doesn't fit or is missing that you think should be a qualification?

We struggled hitting for 6 games. Putting much emphasis on that is misplacing your attention. Of course we still need an offensive improvement, but it's because we were 9th in the AL in runs scored for the regular season, not because of how we hit in the playoffs. If those games were all 8-7 games instead of 2-1 games, we'd still need to focus on the hitting as an area to improve.

As far as what type of hitter, that is also a somewhat irrelevant question, IMO. We need a hitter. Someone who can produce. Sure a certain type of skillset would probably be preferred over some others, but it's not like there are tons of guys out there for us to chose from. I'll settle for a low-OBP, high power guy if that's all we can seem to find. I'll take a low power, high-OBP guy if that's the best value. Just bring in someone who can help bolster our lineup and hopefully hold down the DH spot everyday, making Betemit a pretty impressive left-handed bat off the bench.

[dpsmith22]

I agree with Mackus and I will add that we are one major injury away from being in the bottom 3rd in runs scored.

Last year should have shown us that injuries play a major role and the current lineup is not strong enough to sustain one. No way we can repeat the 1 run win differential we had last year. We need to score more, no matter how we get it done.

[dpsmith22]

That's like complaining that a book on U.S. history doesn't tell the whole story because it doesn't include some minor, local event that had very little effect on the national landscape. I don't get upset reading about the American Revolution and not seeing a reference to the Bush Declaration.

I respectfully disagree with you. I wonder how much team sports you played in your life. No offense meant.

Had Adam Jones hit a weak ground ball to second we score another run in the Yankee series. THAT act, would not have helped his WAR. However, it certainly would have helped the O's win.....

[DJ MC]

I respectfully disagree with you. I wonder how much team sports you played in your life. No offense meant.

Had Adam Jones hit a weak ground ball to second we score another run in the Yankee series. THAT act, would not have helped his WAR. However, it certainly would have helped the O's win.....

Great. You know what else helps score another run?

He hits a home run.
He hits a triple.
He hits a double.
He hits a single.
He hits a very long fly ball that gets the runner to third.
He walks, giving the team an extra out to play with.

You can hope that a player tries to ground out to second in a particular fashion that allows the runner to advance. I'll hope that he does something even more productive and, failing that, manages to get the runner over.

[Mackus]

I respectfully disagree with you. I wonder how much team sports you played in your life. No offense meant.

Had Adam Jones hit a weak ground ball to second we score another run in the Yankee series. THAT act, would not have helped his WAR. However, it certainly would have helped the O's win.....

The percentage of at bats where a player, especially a middle-of-the-order hitter, is up there with the intent of hitting a weak ground ball is very low. Maybe a handful all year long. WAR doesn't take that into account (though it may give credit for advancing runners, I don't know), but it doesn't need to. Even if it did, it wouldn't really change the values in any meaningful way.

It's nice to be able to bunt or move a runner over when you need it. But it's a hundred times better to be a consistently good hitter.

The little things matter, but only a very small percentage of the time. They can certainly help you win games, but judging a player based on numbers that don't necessarily that those small things into account is in no way wrong.