96 replies to this topic

[dude]

Logan Webb just got his extension last year... very reasonable deal.

That said, the Giants are in 4th in the West, under .500.... they aren't going anywhere. 

His K rates won't wow you, but he consistently takes the ball.  Is just 27.

 

The Giants have a huge investment in their roster over the next 2-3-4 years, Webb is clearly above well above the not-reasonably-available line.

 

What's the difference between him and Robbie Ray?  Maybe nothing, but Ray was a giant salary swap because they liked that cost profile better than the guys they were dumping on the Mariners.  They went after Webb and HIcks.and they may be looking at Ray as a thing, but it's at least reasonable they're not.  Take the salary (no chance to get out of the guys they traded, now they essentially could) and get something modest back...maybe that's interesting.

 

I typically like Farhan, but they're another group that seems to accumulate players rather than build a Team.   

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Is this some kind of test? Weird.

The results are better in #2 and the process is better in #1.

Which is better? In what way?

What's weird about this/ You started the results vs process discussion. My point is simple and hasn't ever deviated from this when evaluating a FO. I'll be clear as I can. I do NOT give a damn about any process. I care about the results. Period. And to further clarify I am only talking about the results upfront of trades and signings. Not the results the player in question produces down the road. A GM makes moves that I like or they don't. And sometimes making no moves is a good thing (depends on what other teams did). A GM pounding the phone lines and working their connections (process) is my expectation for all of them. They don't get brownie point one for that. 

[RichardZ]

What's weird about this/ You started the results vs process discussion. My point is simple and hasn't ever deviated from this when evaluating a FO. I'll be clear as I can. I do NOT give a shit about any process. I care about the results. Period. And to further clarify I am only talking about the results upfront of trades and signings. Not the results the player in question produces down the road. A GM makes moves that I like or they don't. And sometimes making no moves is a good thing (depends on what other teams did). A GM pounding the phone lines and working their connections (process) is my expectation for all of them. They don't get brownie point one for that.

A GM working the phones is what you expect but you're one scenario involved Elias not working the phones and not trying.

I don't give a flying F about your expectations either.

Process is important but I'm not bit surprised by your comment.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

A GM working the phones is what you expect but you're one scenario involved Elias not working the phones and not trying.

I don't give a flying F about your expectations either.

Process is important but I'm not bit surprised by your comment.

I have no idea what your point is.

[dude]

We need help down the stretch and into the playoffs, we can wait five weeks. Burnes, Rodriguez, Irvin, Kremer, Suarez, Povich plus McDermott in AAA can get us there.

 

Angels.

 

Tyler Anderson 

for 

Beavers, Tavera

 

Take Estevez?  Take Moore? just flip the RP they replace into the deal....Angels get Service and save some money.

 

Now? 

[BSLChrisStoner]

Good. We're even.

His point was he doesn't care about the process, he'll grade Elias on the results...  the roster will be improved or not. 

Don't see what's wrong with that. 

[BSLSteveBirrer]

His point was he doesn't care about the process, he'll grade Elias on the results... the roster will be improved or not.

Don't see what's wrong with that.

Exactly

[RichardZ]

His point was he doesn't care about the process, he'll grade Elias on the results...  the roster will be improved or not. 
Don't see what's wrong with that. 

Here’s what’s wrong. I asked a simple question.

“So, you’re willing to wait for the results before you make a judgement?”

You gave a simple answer. He did not. All this bs about scenario one and scenario two and even more bs after that.

[dude]

His point was he doesn't care about the process, he'll grade Elias on the results...  the roster will be improved or not. 

Don't see what's wrong with that. 

 

...and this line of discussion has been generated since I pulled the Elias quote from THIS article (made, apparently, on Wednesday).

 

I saw Elias getting interviewed during the game a week (or whatever) ago.  I thought he seemed loose and more engaging.  More how I'd expect/want him to be now that several other things are behind them.

 

....but you can't lose 4 important pitchers to your staff - not a projection, that's happening right now - and then start an article with your "sense of urgency" and end it with "we'll work hard and do our job", but the entire middle of it indicates you'll be starting that process over the next couple weeks.

 

For a FO that's shown zero, absolutely none, sense of urgency, when you announce that another important guy is done for the year in a hyper-competitive season, you might want to have already made a deal to buffer that loss.  FWIW, the Braves get an F for not responding to the loss of Acuna too.

 

It's not "panic", it's your job.  I don't need you grinding over draft picks, that's what your staff is for.  It's not complicated.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Yes if by results you mean.
1. What moves Elias makes.
2. What moves other teams make.

Perhaps you need to take reading comprehension course. I gave you a short direct answer right off the bat. Less than 20 words. You chose to ignore that and skip to the further explanation.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

You’re right. I should have skipped that stupid hypothetical. My fault for thinking you might have something intelligent to add.

Just put me on ignore then. Please.

[RichardZ]

Just put me on ignore then. Please.

Just one scenario? No choices. Shoot.

[jamesdean]

Why would you discount April, and only count his struggles? They all count.
That's why numbers average out.
What you saw was his ceiling, and you've now seen struggles and his floor.
He's getting extended ML ab's for the first time.
The whole game is built on failure.
The league made adjustments, and now he will have to fight through and adjust back.
Is there any reason to think he won't?

His .738 OPS is pretty much right in-line with what you'd expect from him in his rookie year.
Obviously he needs to raise his play vs what we've seen since May 1st, and then find a greater level of consistency.


Again, considering he's been the one getting time in CF when Mullins has been bench, zero chance he's moved imo.

I'm actually more impressed with him defensively. I'm not saying he has to be a .300 hitter or even a .280 but he's been flailing away for almost two months now. When is the adjustment coming? He has to know what they're doing to him and he still hasn't rebounded. Hopefully, your faith in him will eventually come to fruition because right now, he isn't contributing much.

[russsnyder]

I'm actually more impressed with him defensively. I'm not saying he has to be a .300 hitter or even a .280 but he's been flailing away for almost two months now. When is the adjustment coming? He has to know what they're doing to him and he still hasn't rebounded. Hopefully, your faith in him will eventually come to fruition because right now, he isn't contributing much.

I have been impressed with Cowser's defense as well. He's done a nice job at all three spots. Like yourself, I'm waiting for the adjustments at the plate. Perhaps they happen, or perhaps Cowser is going to be a streaky hitter in MLB. Lastly, baseball and life are similar in regards to "what have you done for me lately". It's not unfair to expect more from Cowser offensively.

[Mike B]

I read the article.

 

There are not many names that make me want the trade to happen today.

Crochet would be a nice addition, but maybe not for this year.  The guys we need to bing in should have at least 100 innings left in them for 2024, and that is  probably not Crochet.

Luzardo is back on the IL.  We already have 4 starters on the IL.  Pass.  If we deal with the Marlins Tanner Scott would interest me.

Miller is intriguing but would be very costly plus an injury risk.  The talent speaks for itself though.

Pass on Snell and Severino.  

Kikuchi would be a good get.

Anderson...I could see him struggling in the AL East.  Probably a pass.

Williams is on the IL right now, so not sure when he could help.

Gibson is better than Suarez, and maybe Povich (at the present), so as a 5th starter fine.

There are other guys out there.  I am sure Elias has a better list than the Sun.

 

We need to move sooner or later.  The Orioles losses are staggering.  Bradish, Means, Wells and Kremer, plus Coulombe added to Felix.  That hurts.  The Orioles are susceptible to losing streaks with our current 3, 4 and 5.

[JeremyStrain]

Mets are probably going to end up dealing and have a couple rental SP options. Wouldn't cost our top flight talent. Still think we need to resign Burnes in wake of all the injuries that fall into next year though.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Mets are probably going to end up dealing and have a couple rental SP options. Wouldn't cost our top flight talent. Still think we need to resign Burnes in wake of all the injuries that fall into next year though.

Agree but I think the priority right now is to found some help for this year. I know the numbers for the pitching staff. I don't think those are sustainable especially come October.