180 replies to this topic

[jamesdean]

If she had no intention of pressing charges against Flowers and his brother, why even bother reporting it in MA?  You've got two very lucky guys that got off without a scratch.  And the Ravens brass breathe a huge sigh of relief, despite harboring a POS on the roster. 

[Nigel Tufnel]

I guess there's a chance that she was pissed about something and just made it up, but it's more likely that she changed her mind about her complaint, either because they reconciled, because there was a payoff, or because she's scared.

[jamesdean]

And if Flowers is innocent and she just made it up to be vindictive, he absolutely needs to speak up publicly and defend himself. Silence is going to mean only one thing to the fanbase- he's guilty and a POS.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

And if Flowers is innocent and she just made it up to be vindictive, he absolutely needs to speak up publicly and defend himself. Silence is going to mean only one thing to the fanbase- he's guilty and a POS.

The majority of the fanbase only cares that hes gonna be playing games on Sundays.

[jamesdean]

The majority of the fanbase only cares that hes gonna be playing games on Sundays.

I don't agree with that. I think most fans care about domestic abuse and how it reflects on the team they cheer for.

[Mike in STL]

I don't agree with that. I think most fans care about domestic abuse and how it reflects on the team they cheer for.

I don't know. There were tons of women...WOMEN...cheering for Ray Rice's return at training camp and preseason games. The tape came out right before week 1. People forget a lot if you're putting up the numbers. 

[CantonJester]

And if Flowers is innocent and she just made it up to be vindictive, he absolutely needs to speak up publicly and defend himself. Silence is going to mean only one thing to the fanbase- he's guilty and a POS.

 

His handlers (agent, attorney, et al) have likely advised him that the moment he opens his mouth she can share the information she's apparently doing him a favor remaining quiet about. He will lose that battle. 

 

I hope her discretion doesn't get some other girl beaten or worse. 

[russsnyder]

I don't know. There were tons of women...WOMEN...cheering for Ray Rice's return at training camp and preseason games. The tape came out right before week 1. People forget a lot if you're putting up the numbers.

Yep.

A mother and daughter (probably about 14) in front of me at a preseason game gave Rice a standing ovation at the first preseason game he played in after the incident. The mom gave me a dirty look because I didn't join in their cheering.

[russsnyder]

I think Flowers and his brother are going to get grilled by NFL investigators. He'll at least get a fine, and I think he may get a two game suspension if this young lady cooperates with investigators. Too much smoke for the NFL not to get involved IMO

[jamesdean]

Yep.

A mother and daughter (probably about 14) in front of me at a preseason game gave Rice a standing ovation at the first preseason game he played in after the incident. The mom gave me a dirty look because I didn't join in their cheering.

Sad commentary on the world we live in today. 

[bmore_ken]

I think Flowers and his brother are going to get grilled by NFL investigators. He'll at least get a fine, and I think he may get a two game suspension if this young lady cooperates with investigators. Too much smoke for the NFL not to get involved IMO

I don't agree with someone being suspended with no charges. Any woman could that to any man. Just based on what I've read,  her story sounds flimsy af

[Ravens2006]

If there are no charges, it is what it is. None of us was there most likely.

[russsnyder]

I don't agree with someone being suspended with no charges. Any woman could that to any man. Just based on what I've read, her story sounds flimsy af

I may be wrong, however, I think a player has been suspended by the without criminal charges being filed. That said, I think he only gets suspended if she cooperates with NFL investigators. Based on what's happened already, I wouldn't count on her cooperating with the NFL.

[Slidemaster]

I have a really hard time with this.

On one hand, I think it certainly does not put Zay in a good light that this was a thing, and it certainly raises major questions about his character and the company he keeps. With that said, the police did an investigation, and nobody is being charged. None of us were there or saw what happened. There is no video, audio, or even transcriptual evidence of what happened. From what I know, the state can absolutely choose to take matters into its own hands and press charges even if a victim doesn't want to, assuming they see evidence that a felony was committed. That sort of thing happens all the time, where a victim will choose not to press charges to protect a loved one, but the state takes matters into their own hands. That is not what happened here.

I think that it is a poor take to assume his absolute guilt, and move forward believing he is a woman beater despite none of us being privy to the facts of the case or what the police saw. I suppose that if the NFL does its own investigation, we'll find out more by what they decide.

With that said, I think it would be a very sad world if we were judged forever by the worst thing we ever did. No life is defined entirely by a single moment, and nearly everyone (with some notable exceptions) deserve the chance to rewrite the direction of their story. There had never been any character concerns about Zay until now, and I hope that he looks at this as a second chance to become a better man with better people around him, and lives a life free from controversy from now on.

[Slidemaster]

I don't agree with someone being suspended with no charges. Any woman could that to any man. Just based on what I've read, her story sounds flimsy af

As a teacher, this sort of thing is terrifying. Educators can and will be fired without any evidence whatsoever based on the words of a student, regardless of what the truth is. There have absolutely been cases where students have been mad at a teacher, claimed they did something abhorrent, and then recanted their story after the teacher was removed. That teacher still never gets a job again.

The first husband of a colleague of mine actually had that happen to him, and he committed suicide because he felt like his life was ruined.

[russsnyder]

As a teacher, this sort of thing is terrifying. Educators can and will be fired without any evidence whatsoever based on the words of a student, regardless of what the truth is. There have absolutely been cases where students have been mad at a teacher, claimed they did something abhorrent, and then recanted their story after the teacher was removed. That teacher still never gets a job again.

The first husband of a colleague of mine actually had that happen to him, and he committed suicide because he felt like his life was ruined.

That's an awful story and a very sobering one.

My son's English teacher his junior year in high school was a young and attractive woman. It was only my son and I at the parent teacher meeting before the school year started. I found her to be a bit flirtatious, but not inappropriate.

Anyway, later that year she was accused of having an inappropriate relationship with a student. She was removed for several weeks, but she resumed her job after she was cleared. My son told me that the accusations came from the female student that the boy in question was dating.

These charges could have ruined this young woman. I kind agree with Ken , no charges, no discipline from the NFL. Major league sports leagues operate a bit differently. I'm not sure if it's a good or bad thing.

[Slidemaster]

That's an awful story and a very sobering one.

My son's English teacher his junior year in high school was a young and attractive woman. It was only my son and I at the parent teacher meeting before the school year started. I found her to be a bit flirtatious, but not inappropriate.

Anyway, later that year she was accused of having an inappropriate relationship with a student. She was removed for several weeks, but she resumed her job after she was cleared. My son told me that the accusations came from the female student that the boy in question was dating.

These charges could have ruined this young woman. I kind agree with Ken , no charges, no discipline from the NFL. Major league sports leagues operate a bit differently. I'm not sure if it's a good or bad thing.

That sort of thing happens all the time. And, whether it's right or not, it is likely the outcome of that story would have been far different if it were a male teacher with a female student.

At the end of the day people need to form their own opinions and that's fine, but I personally will not be assuming that Zay is a monster based on a case brought to the police that was then found to not be substantive enough to press charges.

Cynical though I may be, I'm not that jaded yet. With that said, he better keep his nose clean, because his image can't take another blow like this.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Dont ever be alone with a kid in school. Seems like an easy solution

[cprenegade]

There is precedent in the NFL that charges do not have to be filed in order for a suspension from the NFL.  All you have to do is go back to the Ben Roethlisberger alleged attempted rape case in Georgia.  The supposed victim declined to press charges.  The Georgia prosecutor said he believed something happened, but without her they had no case.  No chargers were filed. The NFL suspended Roethlisberger for 6 games, reduced to 4.  I think everyone without blinders on assumes that Roethlisberger paid the victim to keep quiet.  

 

I would think this case deserves at least that.  The victim claimed she was bruised and was hesitant to provide information because the perpetrator was an NFL player.  She also claimed she was threatened to keep quiet at gun point.  She would not talk to detectives investigating the case and Flowers refused to talk to detectives as well.  The case can be reopened if something else comes up.

 

It's a sticky situation for the Ravens.  On one hand, you can take the side that no charges means nothing happened.  But there is a 911 call and a report filed out of state.  Something happened.  So if you have a zero tolerance for domestic abuse, like the Ravens claim they do, then do you dish out some discipline?  If not, then maybe you don't have a zero tolerance policy, only when it applies to charges filed.  But were charges filed against Ray Rice?  I'm not sure they were, although the video made it impossible to ignore.  And if you do nothing your zero tolerance policy seems like it may be driven by who it is rather than what happened.  If this were a third string part time kick returner does anyone believe he wouldn't be off the team after this?

[Slidemaster]

Dont ever be alone with a kid in school. Seems like an easy solution

If only it were that easy.

Teachers have office hours, tutorials, and so many other things they do. If you've never done the job, this is basically an impossible thing to do entirely.

And on top of that, if a kid is lying, it doesn't matter if you were alone with them or not.