136 replies to this topic

[BSLChrisStoner]

Orioles.com: Elias angling for a SP deal, if the price is right

https://www.mlb.com/...-pitching-needs

[TwentyThirtyFive]

"The White Sox are not budging on price and teams dont seem to have interest in paying that price".

Bottom line it for everyone. No one else has paid the price either so why are some of you so adamant on giving in. You do not in any world include Holliday or Bassalo in a trade. Nor do you like load up with say Mayo Cowser and Povich for example. Stay the course.

[BaltBird 24]

Ok.

Then pony up and sign Snell or Montgomery if you want to hold onto all of your chess pieces. It's not like trading is the only avenue towards adding talent to the roster.

I wouldn't be thrilled with Paxton, but he'd be an OK addition at the back of the rotation.

[Mackus]

"The White Sox are not budging on price and teams dont seem to have interest in paying that price".

Bottom line it for everyone. No one else has paid the price either so why are some of you so adamant on giving in. You do not in any world include Holliday or Bassalo in a trade. Nor do you like load up with say Mayo Cowser and Povich for example. Stay the course.

 

I don't think anyone is saying pay any price the White Sox want.  Cease wasn't/isn't the only pitcher available.  But its a failure if they don't get a good SP, so if they (perhaps rightfully) don't want to meet the price for Cease you have to do something else.  Overpaying is worse than paying the right price.  But doing nothing is worse than overpaying.  They've let all the acceptable FA options leave (assuming they don't surprise us and go for Snell or Montgomery).  So trade is the only path left. 

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Ok.

Then pony up and sign Snell or Montgomery if you want to hold onto all of your chess pieces. It's not like trading is the only avenue towards adding talent to the roster.

I wouldn't be thrilled with Paxton, but he'd be an OK addition at the back of the rotation.

Well Mack is right. We arent in the FA business. At least not at the level for a Snell or Montgomery so it puts us at a disadvantage. Teams think they can ask for more. And its fine to pay a little tiny bit more. I agree with Mack there too. But an opportunity will open up eventually. If its Ryu or Paxton vs Cease but you give up Holliday or Bassalo well its no option at all. Same if they are asking for like 2 of Mayo, Cowser, Kjerstad. Stay the course. See what March brings. Then see what June/July brings assuming we are in the playoff hunt.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Im still predicting a trade is made before the month is over. 10 days.

[Slidemaster]

I'm all for not overpaying, but you also have to be willing to pay full freight for a guy who gives you the chance to win a world series. If you get obsessed with "winning" a deal, you might wind up making no deals at all.

[mdrunning]

The other alternative would be to deal prospects who are either ready or close to major-league ready for pitching prospects. It doesn't immediately improve the team, but it adds depth to a position where the Orioles are perhaps a bit shallow. That in turn would provide potential trade chips should Elias look to acquire a frontline starter at the deadline.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

The problem is just what is overpaying?

 

Just who is untouchable? I agree I am not trading Holliday. Basallo? Not sure on that but probably not.

 

But Westburg? Good solid player but I'd be fine with moving him. At least Elias did say "you have to give up something to get something." I guess the question is he willing to give up enough to get something worth getting? 

[RichardZ]

The problem is just what is overpaying?
 
Just who is untouchable? I agree I am not trading Holliday. Basallo? Not sure on that but probably not.
 
But Westburg? Good solid player but I'd be fine with moving him. At least Elias did say "you have to give up something to get something." I guess the question is he willing to give up enough to get something worth getting? 

I think Holliday, Basallo, and probably Mayo are not going in any deal for Cease. We’ve seen rumors that he’s unwilling to include Kjerstad or Westburg as well but when push comes to shove Elias is probably going to have to bite the bullet to some extent. As long as he feels no pressure on losing Cease to another team he’s going to wait and hope Getz compromises a little.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Cease...  

 

I think Cowser or Kjerstad

 

+

 

Ortiz or Norby

 

Then a 3rd of lower consequence. 

[Slidemaster]

Cease...

I think Cowser or Kjerstad

+

Ortiz or Norby

Then a 3rd of lower consequence.

I think if the cost was in that range it would be done already.

My guess is they want 3 of the Orioles top 5 prospects.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Im gonna trust the article that essentially says WhiteSox are asking for too much. Its not Elias saying that. Its not Roch saying that. Its an NL exec saying it to a National reporter.

[Mackus]

Im gonna trust the article that essentially says WhiteSox are asking for too much. Its not Elias saying that. Its not Roch saying that. Its an NL exec saying it to a National reporter.

 

This is valid reason to not trade for Dylan Cease.  Its an invalid reason to not make a serious SP addition this offseason.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

This is valid reason to not trade for Dylan Cease. Its an invalid reason to not make a serious SP addition this offseason.

Well we arent in the FA business and we cant give away the farm for a Cease or Luzardo. It sucks. Someone said earlier they think Elias will ultimately give in and I could see that happening but there is a world where the asking prices remain unreasonable.

[RichardZ]

Well we arent in the FA business and we cant give away the farm for a Cease or Luzardo. It sucks. Someone said earlier they think Elias will ultimately give in and I could see that happening but there is a world where the asking prices remain unreasonable.

The bottom line is that Getz, I’m sure, would like to trade Cease before the season starts. It seems obvious that the Orioles are serious about acquiring Cease. The Orioles were always seen as the most logical trade partner. There has been lots of posturing but in the end both sides want to make a deal. Each side has to give a little. It’s been reported that Getz won’t budge but as long as the Orioles don’t make a different move he can play it tough right up to ST. 60/40 a deal gets done.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

I think a deal gets done too. Whether its Cease or someone a little more under the radar.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

I think a deal gets done too. Whether its Cease or someone a little more under the radar.

Ok but the question becomes do you think that this other someone "under the radar" is a potential difference maker like Cease or just another back end piece?

[TwentyThirtyFive]

A legit quality SP.

[Mackus]

A legit quality SP.

 

I still expect they sign or trade for a starter, but I think we're gonna have a lot of ambiguity as to the quality of that guy.  I think many are gonna be lowering the bar in retrospect when we end up with Lorenzen or Paxton.  Blech.