502 replies to this topic

[Bmore Irish]

Yes, you are right.  I am counting Tampa Bay as a good team.  I mean other than Brady, they have Godwin, Evans and Fournette.  And their defense was ranked #7 coming into this week.   I had them as one of the better teams in the NFC.  I don't know what happened to them the last two weeks.  But I would be surprised if they came out and looked like that on Thursday in front of their home crowd.  

 

But then I was surprised by a few things today.  Even though they were on the road, I had GB pegged to get it together against Washington.  And on another thread I said I thought it was between the Chargers and Bengals for who was the #3 team in the AFC.  The Chargers then came out and get crushed by Seattle in LA.  So maybe I just don't really know what I'm talking about.  lol

It's been that kind of season in the league. Other than a select few teams on either end of the spectrum, it's a whole lot of mediocrity. Or maybe the NFL would prefer the term parity.

 

Even the top teams have looked pretty sloppy at time, including the Bills.
 

[Bmore Irish]

That was a crazy close call too. I’ve seen more contact go uncalled. And Peters is damn lucky they threw the flag cause he gave up on the play to plead his case.

That's funny, because I thought it was a pretty clear call at the time, and didn't feel like I was being a homer.

 

Cooper had a step on Peters, but the pass didn't. Which to me was why Cooper pushed off and made it look obvious.

 

Peters was pretty close to deflecting the ball with his left hand anyway, and that subtle stiff arm from Cooper kept him from fully making up the ground at the end imo.

[Mackus]

That's funny, because I thought it was a pretty clear call at the time, and didn't feel like I was being a homer.

Cooper had a step on Peters, but the pass didn't. Which to me was why Cooper pushed off and made it look obvious.

Peters was pretty close to deflecting the ball with his left hand anyway, and that subtle stiff arm from Cooper kept him from fully making up the ground at the end imo.

I'm with you. Randall's probably right that more egregious calls go uncalled often enough, but this one was so very clear and easy to see even if it wasn't the most physical contact you'll see. It's like fouling a shooter by glancing their arm. Not nearly as much contact as a foul under the basket but it's always gonna get called because it's so isolated and obvious.

[jamesdean]

It's been that kind of season in the league. Other than a select few teams on either end of the spectrum, it's a whole lot of mediocrity. Or maybe the NFL would prefer the term parity.
 
Even the top teams have looked pretty sloppy at time, including the Bills.
 

I think we tend to throw around the term "mediocrity" a lot, myself included but maybe what it really is just equal talent for the most part. If you stand back and realize that out of the thousands of college football players each year, any of them reaching the NFL is probably worse odds than standing in a field waiting to be hit by lightning. Each team has a handful of players who are elite but most are evenly matched. They're the best players in the world but not any better than anyone else. And that's what the league wants...what we consider average.

[PrimeTime]

Had to watch the game after the fact, definitely was a grind but that's no surprise in a division game and a must win for the Browns. You don't apologize for a division win, so I'll take it.

My impressions are that Lamar tries to do too much sometimes, rather than taking what's there. Bateman needs to make plays and stop dropping easy opportunities. Gus Edwards is a pleasure to watch run the ball. Hill can't put the ball on the carpet there; that swing turned a decisive, close the door win into a nail biter. Defensively, we were a little schizophrenic. Still too many big plays over the top and Peters seems to be the one getting victimized. Nice to see Houston back and with Bowser and Ojabo on the way, this pass rush could actually be formidable. Chubb got his but he didn't take over the game completely, so that's a W in my book.

I still don't know what to make of this team overall. They're flawed but still amongst the better teams in the AFC. Get rested as much as possible and see what we can do in Tampa on Thursday.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Last 4 weeks for Lamar:
Bills: 47.6 QBR; 63.0 Rating, 2 INT’s
Bengals: 29.6; 71.6, 1 INT
Giants: 60.3; 71.1, 1 INT 1 Lost Fumble
Browns: 47.0; 80.2

[makoman]

Lamar seemed like he was holding the ball a lot. I'm curious if it was his problem not seeing things or just no one was open.

 

There were 64 offensive plays, and only 101 WR snaps (Duv 42, Bateman 36, Robinson 15, Proche 8). Ricard played 56 snaps. Good for the run, but that doesn't seem conducive to passing well, especially if the defense was keying on Andrews like Lamar said.

 

I'm not intending to make excuses here, Lamar hasn't been good for several weeks, but I don't think the OC is doing him any favors with personnel and play calls (like that first 3rd down play leading to the FG was a head scratcher).

[Biggsy]

Last 4 weeks for Lamar:
Bills: 47.6 QBR; 63.0 Rating, 2 INT’s
Bengals: 29.6; 71.6, 1 INT
Giants: 60.3; 71.1, 1 INT 1 Lost Fumble
Browns: 47.0; 80.2

I feel like this is part of just who Lamar is. Even in college, he ebb and flowed. He'll have a string of games where he looks average at best. Then he'll string together 4 games where he looks like the best football player in the world.

All players do in a way. Very rare for a QB to play lights out every single week.

Not making excuses. He's been pretty bad the past 4 weeks. And we're still 2-2 in that stretch. Speaks volumes that our best player has been playing well below his standards, and we're still winning games, and playing competitive against playoff caliber teams.

[Mackus]

I don't think Lamar was bad at all yesterday.

 

Previous weeks, yes.  Starting at 2nd half of Bills he had been struggling with both accuracy and decision-making.  Didn't think either were a problem yesterday, was just a different game plan.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I don't think Lamar was bad at all yesterday.

 

Previous weeks, yes.  Starting at 2nd half of Bills he had been struggling with both accuracy and decision-making.  Didn't think either were a problem yesterday, was just a different game plan.

Bad is an interesting word. He wasn't good. Call it what you want I guess, but the numbers don't lie. 

[Mackus]

Bad is an interesting word. He wasn't good. Call it what you want I guess, but the numbers don't lie.

Numbers often lie. Is it you that's often laughing at the Ravens DVOA? That number lies. Why can't QBR?

Lamar was good yesterday, IMO. Not great, not average/fine. Good. His rushing was more important than his throwing yesterday.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Numbers often lie. Is it you that's often laughing at the Ravens DVOA? That number lies. Why can't QBR?

Lamar was good yesterday, IMO. Not great, not average/fine. Good. His rushing was more important than his throwing yesterday.

It's all relative. For what he's asking, for what we need him to be - yesterday wasn't good, it wasn't adequate. You're happy with the W, so am I - but come on, at least be objective. 

[makoman]

Bad is an interesting word. He wasn't good. Call it what you want I guess, but the numbers don't lie.

The numbers were bad but it seemed like he executed the game plan. I don’t recall seeing much where I thought “that was a mistake” or “he missed that one.” Didn’t watch the entire game though. And like I said it did seem like he held the ball too much at times. But with 40+ runs and 16 passes there isn’t a ton of opportunity to put up stats or get in any sort of rhythm. So I think I agree with Mackus that it wasn’t bad in the same way as the other games.

Of course, if they’re going to treat him like late stage Joe Flacco you might as well not pay him.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

As I said, the crowd who bitched all last week about not running the ball enough was presumably happy. Those that want to see WRs catch balls and QBs throw for 400 yards are going to have the pitchforks out this week. Last week Roman was Fing up because he wasnt committing to the run game. This week he isnt doing Lamar the passer any favors with the personnel and playcalling. You can make whatever narrative you want

[You Play to Win the Game]

I feel like this is part of just who Lamar is. Even in college, he ebb and flowed. He'll have a string of games where he looks average at best. Then he'll string together 4 games where he looks like the best football player in the world.

All players do in a way. Very rare for a QB to play lights out every single week.

Not making excuses. He's been pretty bad the past 4 weeks. And we're still 2-2 in that stretch. Speaks volumes that our best player has been playing well below his standards, and we're still winning games, and playing competitive against playoff caliber teams.

 

Mahomes had a similar stretch last year - so yeah, I'm cooling my jets on not reading too much into these little stretches. They happen for even the best players. I still don't think he's in that Manning/Brady/Mahomes tier like some others here do, but I'm not going to change their minds. There are a lot of Ravens fans perfectly fine being in that 7-10 - 9-8 type range, so long as they have a fun QB to watch.

 

Mahomes weeks 5-12 last season:

 

[NewMarketSean]

Now when I said Lamar shouldn't be passing all that much, I didn't mean 90 yards!

 

Still, we won. We committed to the run, for better or worse, and the defense finally stepped up late.

 

With Gus back it felt like a game we won when Lamar first started playing in 2018. And you know what? I'll take it every day of the week.

[You Play to Win the Game]

The numbers were bad but it seemed like he executed the game plan. I don’t recall seeing much where I thought “that was a mistake” or “he missed that one.” Didn’t watch the entire game though. And like I said it did seem like he held the ball too much at times. But with 40+ runs and 16 passes there isn’t a ton of opportunity to put up stats or get in any sort of rhythm. So I think I agree with Mackus that it wasn’t bad in the same way as the other games.

Of course, if they’re going to treat him like late stage Joe Flacco you might as well not pay him.

Well, you'd be agreeing with me. I said he wasn't bad. Mackus said he was good. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

Now when I said Lamar shouldn't be passing all that much, I didn't mean 90 yards!

 

Still, we won. We committed to the run, for better or worse, and the defense finally stepped up late.

You think?

 

They let the Browns stuff the ball down their throats for a TD to bring it close - then Peters allowed Brissett and Cooper to score a would be go ahead TD, if not for the inconsequential-to-the-play offensive PI. Not feeling better about the late game defense at all after yesterday. 

[Mackus]

It's all relative. For what he's asking, for what we need him to be - yesterday wasn't good, it wasn't adequate. You're happy with the W, so am I - but come on, at least be objective.

I am being objective. I think he played well.

[NewMarketSean]

You think?

 

They let the Browns stuff the ball down their throats for a TD to bring it close - then Peters allowed Brissett and Cooper to score a would be go ahead TD, if not for the inconsequential-to-the-play offensive PI. Not feeling better about the late game defense at all after yesterday. 

After the Hill fumble, yes.

 

Browns got ball back with 3:12 left on their 16 yard line, were forced to kick a 60 yard FG that never had a chance. How many times do they let the other team tie or take lead in that scenario?

 

They also held with 16 seconds left which I was expecting them to give  up a big play to put Cleveland in another FG chance.