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2021 HOF Ballot


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#1 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 08:13 AM

CBS Sports: Baseball Hall of Fame: Seven things to know about 2021 ballot, which includes weak class of newcomers
https://www.cbssport...s-of-newcomers/



#2 BSLJordanKatz

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 12:17 PM

Can't see any first-ballot guys on that barring something pretty odd 



#3 Old Man

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 12:37 PM

a very weak cast for sure.



#4 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 12:54 PM

Bonds
Clemens
M.Ramirez
Sheffield
Schilling
Rolen
Vizquel

Wagner
Abreu
Helton

The first 5 I'd definitely have, the second 5 I can be talked into.  Each of them has a decent argument. 

 

 

EDIT: I didn't realize Vizquel's career WAR was about half of Smith.  He's off the list. If the abuse allegations are accurate, easy for me to not vote for him. 


Abreu had a very good career, and he was generally underrated in his career... but I think he's more Hall of Very Good. 

 

I left off Jeff Kent.  Obviously wasn't a fielder, but has an argument for his bat, and his career numbers at 2nd vs. other HOF 2nd baseman. 



#5 BSLJordanKatz

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 01:22 PM

Why Rolen and not Andruw, feel like their case is basically the same but at different positions?



#6 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:09 PM

Why Rolen and not Andruw, feel like their case is basically the same but at different positions?


That's fair.  Career WAR totals similar. 

 

Total games similar..  Jones more power.  Rolen higher wOBA. 



#7 Old Man

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:17 PM

Bonds
Clemens
M.Ramirez
Sheffield
Schilling
Rolen
Vizquel

Wagner
Abreu
Helton

The first 5 I'd definitely have, the second 5 I can be talked into.  Each of them has a decent argument. 

The first 4 can take a hike, sorry, PEDS is a big issue for me and I mean a known serial user, doesnt deserve in.

 

But, just my own opinion and I dont get a vote in the matter.


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#8 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:25 PM

Schilling and Wagner are my pet peeves. Wagner is the best LH RP of all time. Clemens and Bonds will get in eventually. Id vote for them but not as hung up on them right now as Schilling and Wagner. Jones and Rolen also get strong consideration to go on my ballot. Im not there yet on Manny or Sheff. Dont get the Vizquel love at all.

#9 Old Man

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:29 PM

Schilling and Wagner are my pet peeves. Wagner is the best LH RP of all time. Clemens and Bonds will get in eventually. Id vote for them but not as hung up on them right now as Schilling and Wagner. Jones and Rolen also get strong consideration to go on my ballot. Im not there yet on Manny or Sheff. Dont get the Vizquel love at all.

Schilling deserves in, based on his on the field performances.

 

he wont, because he is an ass, and he is out spoken mouth piece.

 

They claim because he never won a Cy Young that he isnt a HOF caliber pitcher. Same excuse they tried to use on Mussina.

 

So these guys are penalized for pitching in the same years as other extraordinary pitchers?



#10 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:35 PM

I think he gets in. If not by ballot then eventually by vet committee. He should have a strong shot this year.

#11 BSLJordanKatz

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 02:41 PM

ballot.png

I feel like Manny should be treated differently from other PED guys given he actually got suspended but that might be my hill to die on

 

Also I think Bobby Abreu has a really good case, higher career OBP than Tony Gwynn and a .303/.416/.513 slash in his prime as a Phillie is pretty strong


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#12 Pedro Cerrano

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Posted 16 November 2020 - 10:50 PM

MY hall of fame ballot:
-Bonds
-Clemens
-Sosa
-Schilling
-Manny
-Helton
-Rolen
-Sheffield
-Wagner
-Abreu

*edited to add Abreu. Didn’t realize I had only used 9 slots

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#13 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 17 November 2020 - 07:58 AM

FanGraphs: The Big Questions About the 2021 BBWAA Hall of Fame Ballot



#14 BSLMikeRandall

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Posted 17 November 2020 - 11:34 AM

Schilling I think gets in this time. He's probably the lone winner.

 

In the last four years, Schilling has gone 45%, 51.2%, 60.9%, 70%. (He's also been a giant A-Hole for at least this long and his votes keep going up, so that won't be a factor, IMO).

 

Besides Clemens he is the best pitcher on the ballot. Since he's been on the ballot (9th time) all of his peers that are better have gotten in. Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Pedro, Randy Johnson, Halladay, Mussina. 

 

Clemens got 61% last time, Bonds got 60.7% last time. Both Bonds and Clemens saw a big jump of about 8% from 2015 to 2016, but their climb has been slower of late, only about 2%, not 10% like Schilling.

 

There are no 90%+ guys coming in on the first ballot like the last three years. Maybe Buehrle and Hunter hang on the ballot for a number of years. But this is the worst first ballot class in probably a while. I think if voters vote, rather than turn in blank ballots like a bunch of dicks, or vote for only Jeff Kent like an idiot, Schilling definitely gets in, and Bonds/Clemens will be 2nd and 3rd. Maybe those two don't get the 75%, but should get their biggest jump in a while, pushing 70%. 


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#15 Old Man

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Posted 17 November 2020 - 11:37 AM

Schilling I think gets in this time. He's probably the lone winner.

 

In the last four years, Schilling has gone 45%, 51.2%, 60.9%, 70%. (He's also been a giant A-Hole for at least this long and his votes keep going up, so that won't be a factor, IMO).

 

Besides Clemens he is the best pitcher on the ballot. Since he's been on the ballot (9th time) all of his peers that are better have gotten in. Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Pedro, Randy Johnson, Halladay, Mussina. 

 

Clemens got 61% last time, Bonds got 60.7% last time. Both Bonds and Clemens saw a big jump of about 8% from 2015 to 2016, but their climb has been slower of late, only about 2%, not 10% like Schilling.

 

There are no 90%+ guys coming in on the first ballot like the last three years. Maybe Buehrle and Hunter hang on the ballot for a number of years. But this is the worst first ballot class in probably a while. I think if voters vote, rather than turn in blank ballots like a bunch of dicks, or vote for only Jeff Kent like an idiot, Schilling definitely gets in, and Bonds/Clemens will be 2nd and 3rd. Maybe those two don't get the 75%, but should get their biggest jump in a while, pushing 70%. 

Schilling was told if he kept his image quiet and out of controversy, he  would probably get in.

 

The other pitchers noted by you as in the HOF, are not tainted with PEDS as Roger is.



#16 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 17 November 2020 - 12:01 PM

Schilling has the same ERA+ as Gibson and Seaver. He's 15th in strikeouts(1behind Gibson).Hes 26th in WAR for a pitcher. He has longevity stats are there and his peak was terriffic. Oh, and he was excellent in the postseason for what that means to you. Its a travesty he's had to wait this long.

#17 Old Man

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Posted 17 November 2020 - 12:16 PM

Schilling has the same ERA+ as Gibson and Seaver. He's 15th in strikeouts(1behind Gibson).Hes 26th in WAR for a pitcher. He has longevity stats are there and his peak was terriffic. Oh, and he was excellent in the postseason for what that means to you. Its a travesty he's had to wait this long.

I agree.

Career WAR over 80, is another threshold that he makes.



#18 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 16 December 2020 - 11:30 AM

Let's end the Vizquel HOF talk. He's not worthy on merit and he's a also a serial wife beater.
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#19 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 16 December 2020 - 11:33 AM

Let's end the Vizquel HOF talk. He's not worthy on merit and he's a also a serial wife beater.


Didn't know the wife beating part, which makes it fine for me to not root for him. 

Keeping things between the lines, he has a far lower career bWAR vs. Ozzie Smith, but similar hits and OPS+. 

11x Gold Glove. 

I think there is an argument.  I guess push to shove, I do think he's more Hall of Very Good.



#20 Mike B

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Posted 16 December 2020 - 11:48 AM

Schilling has the same ERA+ as Gibson and Seaver. He's 15th in strikeouts(1behind Gibson).Hes 26th in WAR for a pitcher. He has longevity stats are there and his peak was terriffic. Oh, and he was excellent in the postseason for what that means to you. Its a travesty he's had to wait this long.

I agree, Schilling belongs in the Hall.  It should happen now.


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