179 replies to this topic

[jamesdean]

Once Means comes back, I wouldn't mind a six man rotation to preserve both his and GRod's arms for the stretch. Of course, that's depending on four other SPs being at least decent between now and then.

Hall may be in the mix at some point also.  As lousy as the starting pitching has been, there is the potential to eventually have a solid rotation. 

[NewMarketSean]

Hall may be in the mix at some point also.  As lousy as the starting pitching has been, there is the potential to eventually have a solid rotation. 

Hall needs to stop walking so many batters. 7 BB in 11 IP so far.

 

I think we should have traded him this past offseason personally.

[Mike B]

We live in this instant gratification/hot take world that simply doesn't lend itself to baseball. The amount of "send him down" and "he's not ready" posts I saw on social media after the 1st inning was ridiculous.

True, take a look back at the game threads.  Everyone sucks until they start hitting or pitching then they do not.  Baseball is a failure game.  The ones that do it the least, are the best.  

Only in game threads, Twitter etc. are players expected to be perfect.

[PrimeTime]

Yeah, if you guys can’t understand fans venting in a game thread over a 1st inning meltdown, given the history of pitching prospects in Baltimore, I really don’t know what to tell you.

 

Venting is one thing and we all do it to varying degrees.

 

To turn this discussion around a bit, if you can't see the difference between Grayson Rodrigues and "the Cavalry", for example, I really don't know what to tell you. 

 

The difference between being frustrated with a specific aspect of player's performance within a game is different than summarily dismissing a player after a bad inning, bat AB, etc. 

 

Maybe I'm being nitpicky or perhaps I try to be more measured in reactions. C'est la vie.

[PrimeTime]

Hall may be in the mix at some point also.  As lousy as the starting pitching has been, there is the potential to eventually have a solid rotation. 

 

We're going to have an interesting dilemma with the pitching staff in general. With Givens and Tate hopefully close to returning, along with Bradish and at some point Irvin and Means, we're going to have some tough decision to make.

[JStruds]

We're going to have an interesting dilemma with the pitching staff in general. With Givens and Tate hopefully close to returning, along with Bradish and at some point Irvin and Means, we're going to have some tough decision to make.

Could be a great dilemma to have.

[JStruds]

Hall may be in the mix at some point also. As lousy as the starting pitching has been, there is the potential to eventually have a solid rotation.

I agree. At some points last year, Bradish, Kremer, Wells, Hall (albeit in relief) and even Voth showed some serious potential. If Irvin figures out what caused him to suddenly throw too many balls, you've got potentially @7 serviceable starters to sort through. Emphasis on potentially.

[Mackus]

Heavy emphasis on potentially

[JStruds]

Heavy emphasis on potentially

Ha. Yeah, should have bolded that word for sure!

[You Play to Win the Game]

Venting is one thing and we all do it to varying degrees.

To turn this discussion around a bit, if you can't see the difference between Grayson Rodrigues and "the Cavalry", for example, I really don't know what to tell you.

The difference between being frustrated with a specific aspect of player's performance within a game is different than summarily dismissing a player after a bad inning, bat AB, etc.

Maybe I'm being nitpicky or perhaps I try to be more measured in reactions. C'est la vie.

Ahh, so you’re expecting logic and calm during a time of fanatical emotional expression. That’s cool. Keep hoping, I guess. Or, just understand how things work, lol.

[You Play to Win the Game]

O’s are 26th in the bigs in team ERA at 5.26 - I need to see some substantial improvement before I’m starting to worry or even ponder tough decisions with the pitching staff. Their xFIP is 4.32, so improvement is coming. But my point remains.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Yeah, if you guys can’t understand fans venting in a game thread over a 1st inning meltdown, given the history of pitching prospects in Baltimore, I really don’t know what to tell you.

I get it from a frustration standpoint from posters. The annoyance from me is when it feels like it is piling on. That can be 5 or 10 different posters saying the same thing once. Not really anyones fault just seeing it ten times in a row is tilting.

[Mackus]

To turn this discussion around a bit, if you can't see the difference between Grayson Rodrigues and "the Cavalry", for example, I really don't know what to tell you. 

 

Bundy was top-10 everywhere, as high as #2 from both BA and MLB and still was ranked highly by most even after his injury, though would be fair to say he had dropped a tier or two by that point.  Matusz reached #5 in BA his final year before promotion, everyone had him top-20.  Gausman was reached as high as #10 from Baseball Prospectus, slightly lower from the others but still very highly regarded.  Britton was top-20 by BP.

 

Rodriguez was slightly higher ranked consensus at the time of his promotion (not higher than Bundy's peak though).  Top-10 before last year and this year.  Absolutely fine if anyone prefers Grayson's makeup to the other guys, but they were all close to as studly as a pitching prospect gets.  There really isn't a tier above any of these guys.  Maybe Stephen Strasburg and some others, but mostly its guys like all of these that are the best of any given year.  Grayson might be higher on that tier than the others, but I really don't think its a major difference.  That none of them became stud SP here doesn't mean Grayson won't. 

 

If you're comparing him only to the rest of the "cavalry", then absolutely, Grayson's on another level.  Guys like Arrieta and Britton were more similar to DL Hall as prospects (Britton did rocket higher right before his promotion).  And lesser guys like Bergesen, Maine, Liz, Penn, Berken, Olson, Rodriguez and any others are even further down.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Ahh, so you’re expecting logic and calm during a time of fanatical emotional expression. That’s cool. Keep hoping, I guess. Or, just understand how things work, lol.

The other funny thing Ive heard now about GRod was the coming to the same conclusion on the two opposite ends of the spectrum in a span of 2 or 3 weeks. Some, like you, were arguing before the season started GRod should be here because games in April count the same as any other time. Hes one of our 5 best SP. The same lofic I randomly ran across on twitter Sun. Expect it was why we should send him down to AAA and not let him figure it out up here. Because the games in April mean the same as any other time. Just found that hilarious.


Btw for as much as I wanted him to start down for service time manipulation now that the seal is broke dont think of messing with him anytime soon. Working through the lumps and letting him figure it out up here is crucial.

[Mike B]

The other funny thing Ive heard now about GRod was the coming to the same conclusion on the two opposite ends of the spectrum in a span of 2 or 3 weeks. Some, like you, were arguing before the season started GRod should be here because games in April count the same as any other time. Hes one of our 5 best SP. The same lofic I randomly ran across on twitter Sun. Expect it was why we should send him down to AAA and not let him figure it out up here. Because the games in April mean the same as any other time. Just found that hilarious.


Btw for as much as I wanted him to start down for service time manipulation now that the seal is broke dont think of messing with him anytime soon. Working through the lumps and letting him figure it out up here is crucial.

Agree 100% on the last line.  Very rarely does a young player come up and have immediate success, and that is especially true of pitchers.  GRod is learning as he goes.  IMO, he will figure it out and be a good pitcher, it is just going to take awhile.

[jamesdean]

Agree 100% on the last line.  Very rarely does a young player come up and have immediate success, and that is especially true of pitchers.  GRod is learning as he goes.  IMO, he will figure it out and be a good pitcher, it is just going to take awhile.

His change-up was outstanding in his last start and that's the key pitch for him.  Once he gets consistent with it, he'll be on his way.  He already has great stuff otherwise.  That and figuring out how to get off to a good start instead of imploding in the first inning.  I've said this before- he has nothing to gain by going back down to AAA. 

[fishteacher]

...and Coulombe gets the out...dude is SOLID.  LIke it.

[fishteacher]

The other funny thing Ive heard now about GRod was the coming to the same conclusion on the two opposite ends of the spectrum in a span of 2 or 3 weeks. Some, like you, were arguing before the season started GRod should be here because games in April count the same as any other time. Hes one of our 5 best SP. The same lofic I randomly ran across on twitter Sun. Expect it was why we should send him down to AAA and not let him figure it out up here. Because the games in April mean the same as any other time. Just found that hilarious.


Btw for as much as I wanted him to start down for service time manipulation now that the seal is broke dont think of messing with him anytime soon. Working through the lumps and letting him figure it out up here is crucial.

Not sure why we can't just all shut the F up and let the game happen....LOL!  At times we all sound like tools.

[JStruds]

Not sure why we can't just all shut the F up and let the game happen....LOL! At times we all sound like tools.

You're on the wrong game thread

[fishteacher]

You're on the wrong game thread

No...I'm on the right one.  The arguing about G-Rod is ridiculous.  He's "Mussina" all over again...just give him time...and his time is HERE, not in AAA or AA.  Waste of time.