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PressBox: How Will Orioles Handle Starting Rotation In 2023? Ben McDonald, Jim Palmer Weigh In


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#1 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 06 January 2023 - 09:48 AM

PressBox: How Will Orioles Handle Starting Rotation In 2023? Ben McDonald, Jim Palmer Weigh In

https://pressboxonli...almer-weigh-in/



#2 Slidemaster

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Posted 06 January 2023 - 10:09 AM

Prayers.

#3 glenn__davis

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Posted 06 January 2023 - 10:20 AM

If Bradish and Kremer are as good in 2023 as they were down the stretch in 2022 then I think the rotation will surprisingly be solid.  Those are of course 2 big "ifs".  

 

I really look forward to seeing what they do with DL Hall and how he looks in the spring.  The treatment of him was so weird last year but by the end of the year he was a force out of the pen.  

 

Still plenty of really interesting things to follow as far as the rotation goes.  



#4 bmore_ken

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 10:29 AM

I think Ben and Jim should put the cletes back on   :mrgreen:



#5 dude

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 11:13 AM

Haven't listened to it yet, so I'm (again) relying on Luke's presentation.

 

I agree with most of what they said and I remember someone else saying something like this re: GRod...

[Palmer] I’m not sure he’d even be pitching in late August or September under the fact that he just hasn’t pitched that many innings.

 

...but it feels like we never really got into answering the title of the article.

 

Jake Rill had suggested maybe a 6 man rotation early to limit innings exposure across the season but there's some bullpen consequences to that too.  Could you go with a 3-man bench?



#6 BaltBird 24

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 04:18 PM


Jake Rill had suggested maybe a 6 man rotation early to limit innings exposure across the season but there's some bullpen consequences to that too. Could you go with a 3-man bench?


Aren't teams only allowed to carry a certain number of pitches? Don't think they could have a 3 man bench even if they wanted to.

#7 dude

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 04:22 PM

Aren't teams only allowed to carry a certain number of pitches? Don't think they could have a 3 man bench even if they wanted to.

 

Yeah, I was trying to remember the rules on that.  They had a rule for the roster expansion in September so we didn't see crazy number of consecutive matchups, most of the rules have worked against that (3 batter min, limiting times optioned each year).

 

I was thinking the max was 14....which would be the 6-man, 8-man bullpen and 3-man bench on the 26, but if that's wrong, I accept the correction.



#8 BaltBird 24

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 04:24 PM

Yeah, I was trying to remember the rules on that. They had a rule for the roster expansion in September so we didn't see crazy number of consecutive matchups, most of the rules have worked against that (3 batter min, limiting times optioned each year).

I was thinking the max was 14....which would be the 6-man, 8-man bullpen and 3-man bench on the 26, but if that's wrong, I accept the correction.


13 pitcher max until September when they can add a 14th.
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#9 dude

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 04:35 PM

13 pitcher max until September when they can add a 14th.

 

Thx. 

 

I think it's a little problematic to do 6 with only a 7 man pen especially if you are trying to tandem a guy like Hall to limit innings.  Certainly ways you could probably do it, if that was the answer, but it likely puts guys like GRod and Hall at AAA for a while.



#10 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 08:19 AM

Thx. 

 

I think it's a little problematic to do 6 with only a 7 man pen especially if you are trying to tandem a guy like Hall to limit innings.  Certainly ways you could probably do it, if that was the answer, but it likely puts guys like GRod and Hall at AAA for a while.

But if the issue is innings then how does GRod and Hall being at AAA for a while help this? I assume that they would still be pitching in AAA vs sitting on the bench.



#11 BSLRoseKatz

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 08:40 AM

Haven't listened to it yet, so I'm (again) relying on Luke's presentation.

 

I agree with most of what they said and I remember someone else saying something like this re: GRod...

 

...but it feels like we never really got into answering the title of the article.

 

Jake Rill had suggested maybe a 6 man rotation early to limit innings exposure across the season but there's some bullpen consequences to that too.  Could you go with a 3-man bench?


I feel like any of sort of non-traditional rotation plan would include Tyler Wells giving you 3-4 innings however often 


she/her


#12 dude

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 12:55 PM

But if the issue is innings then how does GRod and Hall being at AAA for a while help this? I assume that they would still be pitching in AAA vs sitting on the bench.

 

They did a poor job with this last year with GRod and let him push too much early but he was so dominant at times, it's hard to pull him after 3 or 4 innings.  You have to build the structure in and stick with it.  This isn't "is he ready"...the stuff is ready.  It's about build up and both pitchers and catchers (more than position players) have this path.

 

The difference is we expect Hyde to have a priority to win at the ML level and you can have a priority of something else (development) at AAA, AA, etc 

 

Everyone talks about GRod being on the cusp.  He'd still only built up to 100 pitches a couple times last year and like Palmer said (and I said this last year), He was going to get shut down in late-Aug or early-Sep.  Imagine we're in a Playoff race in an important game nad he's on the mound scoreless through 5 and gets pulled....then the bullpen blows the Games.  How hard is it to imagine the narrative that surrounds that.  Happened to Strasburg.  Happened to Harvey and likely caused a bunch of his problems.  You yourself have argued that development isn't really a thing and you are either ready to go or you aren't.



#13 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 02:07 PM

They did a poor job with this last year with GRod and let him push too much early but he was so dominant at times, it's hard to pull him after 3 or 4 innings.  You have to build the structure in and stick with it.  This isn't "is he ready"...the stuff is ready.  It's about build up and both pitchers and catchers (more than position players) have this path.

 

The difference is we expect Hyde to have a priority to win at the ML level and you can have a priority of something else (development) at AAA, AA, etc 

 

Everyone talks about GRod being on the cusp.  He'd still only built up to 100 pitches a couple times last year and like Palmer said (and I said this last year), He was going to get shut down in late-Aug or early-Sep.  Imagine we're in a Playoff race in an important game nad he's on the mound scoreless through 5 and gets pulled....then the bullpen blows the Games.  How hard is it to imagine the narrative that surrounds that.  Happened to Strasburg.  Happened to Harvey and likely caused a bunch of his problems.  You yourself have argued that development isn't really a thing and you are either ready to go or you aren't.

 

If he's pulled after 5, it's a non-issue considering the average MLB start is like 5.1 innings. 

 

They might occasionally skip him, they might limit his innings early, but I'm not worried about him going from 75 to 150 innings. 



#14 Mackus

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 02:08 PM

He won't get to 150. 130 or so.

#15 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 08 January 2023 - 02:13 PM

He won't get to 150. 130 or so.


Yeah, 130 is a good expectation.  But I have no worry about him doubling his 2022 innings if need be.   But between skipped started, and probably limited innings early on, I think they'll have him in position to get through the year.






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