230 replies to this topic

[BobPhelan]

Except hockey is much less popular than the big three. MMA might be more popular than hockey at this point. Every time this happens their popularity takes a hit. I don't think the league will fold but they really can't afford this.

[Oriole85]

Except hockey is much less popular than the big three. MMA might be more popular than hockey at this point. Every time this happens their popularity takes a hit. I don't think the league will fold but they really can't afford this.

I'm aware and I took that into consideration when I said it was a big enough of a niche. Not really too familiar with MMA, but can it get the type of media deals that hockey can and is it as lucrative?

[BobPhelan]

I'm aware and I took that into consideration when I said it was a big enough of a niche. Not really too familiar with MMA, but can it get the type of media deals that hockey can and is it as lucrative?

The UFC has a 7 year, $90 million per deal with FOX that sees 16 live events on three networks (FOX, FX, and Fuel TV) as well as two seasons a year of The Ultimate Fighter on top of 10-12 pay-per-view events a year, which is where they make most of their money.

I could be wrong but I thought hockey used to be more than just a niche sport. That niche could get smaller and it could eventually be in MLS territory.

[Oriole85]

The UFC has a 7 year, $90 million per deal with FOX that sees 16 live events on three networks (FOX, FX, and Fuel TV) as well as two seasons a year of The Ultimate Fighter on top of 10-12 pay-per-view events a year, which is where they make most of their money.

I could be wrong but I thought hockey used to be more than just a niche sport. That niche could get smaller and it could eventually be in MLS territory.

I used niche loosely, they are a big small sport or small big sport depending on the way you want to look at it. Clearly they are a distant 4th, but I would say they are vastly ahead of MLS (and smaller leagues Arena/Lax/etc).

I don't see them becoming MLS, but I guess it's possible. I think soccer's path to overtaking the NHL, would have to involve getting better talent, which I don't see happening.

[BobPhelan]

Yeah I don't see the MLS pulling in anyone that isn't in the sunset of their career.

I just hope the NHL gets its act together. I'm not a hockey fan but I like having it around. I enjoy the video games and I think it's good for sports in general.

[Oriole85]

ESPN: Source: Winter Classic canceled

http://espn.go.com/n...ngs-source-says

No real surprise, assuming it's true, but still pretty big deal!

[BSLMikeLowe]

My first reaction in seeing the WC cancelled was that this almost certainly spelled doom as far as having a realistic chance of any season at all. But after reading that today was the deadline for cancellation before the NHL would have been on the hook for a number of WC-related expenses, it looks more like just common sense to make the move and isn't necessarily the final nail.

[Oriole85]

My first reaction in seeing the WC cancelled was that this almost certainly spelled doom as far as having a realistic chance of any season at all. But after reading that today was the deadline for cancellation before the NHL would have been on the hook for a number of WC-related expenses, it looks more like just common sense to make the move and isn't necessarily the final nail.

I think it was sort of a goal to get back by this point, like the NBA's was with Christmas last year. It's their signature event, the one regular season game where casual fans with no team affliation involved will watch.

[Oriole85]

ESPN: NHL labor talks resume Saturday

http://espn.go.com/n...ore-2-weeks-off

[DuffMan]

More talks are scheduled for Tuesday. I'm not holding my breath here, but at this point any talks are better than no talks.

[DuffMan]

7 hrs of talks with more scheduled for Wednesday.
http://espn.go.com/b... ... ed-finally
Who knows what will come of this, but it least its sounds like the bickering and posturing have stopped and actual negotiations have started. Maybe we get some hockey this year after all??

[MKlein76]

The NHL and NHLPA broke their silence after meeting on Thursday.

NEW YORK -- For the first time since talks resumed earlier this week, the NHL and NHL Players' Association broke their silence Thursday. And although neither side offered much insight into the state of negotiations, it appears progress has been made.

A source confirmed to ESPNNewYork.com that the union offered two proposals Wednesday, one on revenue sharing and another on the "make-whole" concept to honor existing player contracts. Additionally, a source told ESPN.com's Pierre LeBrun the union's "make-whole" proposal includes a phase-in element that would see the players' share drop to 50-50 of revenue by Year 3 based on "regular" growth.

The NHL responded to the proposals Thursday, the source said, although it's not immediately clear how receptive it was to the union's ideas, if at all.

http://espn.go.com/n... ... five-hours

[DuffMan]

Hoping for the best, expecting the worst. I can't take this. I want Hockey!!!

[You Play to Win the Game]

Apparently it got very tense yesterday, and the talks have again stalled:

Any mounting optimism from four straight days of labor talks between the NHL and NHLPA seemed to abate as negotiations went sour between the two sides Friday.

Multiple sources told ESPNNewYork.com that Friday's evening session ended with some tense exchanges across the table between some of the players and some owners in attendance, as well as NHL commissioner Gary Bettman.

And although progress was made on revenue sharing and some non-core economic issues, there remains a stark divide on the issues that have polarized the two sides since talks began this summer.

"We thought we were much closer together on a structure of a deal than suggestions were," NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr said. "(The NHL) came back to us and said, 'No, we're very, very far apart on a structure of the deal.' "

The most contentious issue preventing the two sides from forging common ground remains the "Make Whole" concept to honor existing player contracts.

Multiple sources confirmed to ESPNNewYork.com that the league's offer of $211 million was seen as not even close to what the NHLPA seeks to guarantee existing contracts, believed to be approximately $590 million.

Fehr took issue with several elements of the league's "Make Whole" offer, including the fact that the provision only covers the first two years. A source told ESPN.com's Pierre LeBrun that payments in Years 1 and 2 -- $149 and $62 million, respectively -- with the belief that by Year 3 the players will not need to "Make Whole" further.

The owners are absolutely ridiculous with this crap. DON'T GIVE CONTRACTS YOU DON'T INTEND TO PAY!!!!!!

A source also told ESPNNewYork.com that the two sides remain far apart on players' rights and contracting issues, a vital element to the union's membership. However, two additional sources told ESPNNewYork.com that the league is ultimately willing to budge on those areas if the union is willing to make concessions.

The union, however, believes their willingness to drop to a 50-50 split of revenue by Year 3 (down from 57 percent last year) is enough of a concession.

http://espn.go.com/n... ... ources-say

[DuffMan]

Apparently it got very tense yesterday, and the talks have again stalled:





The owners are absolutely ridiculous with this crap. DON'T GIVE CONTRACTS YOU DON'T INTEND TO PAY!!!!!!



http://espn.go.com/n... ... ources-say

Something I'd like to point out as well is Caps owner Ted Leonsis is up in NY and is a big part of these negotiations. It's funny he's always been viewed as a quality owner and is always cheered when shown on screen at games, but he might lose alot of that good will and may hear some boos depending on how this plays out. The sides are supposed to meet and negotiate today, but it's not sounding good at all. Despite making some progress on a few of the secondary issues neither side wants to budge much on the main problems.

[Oriole85]

Something I'd like to point out as well is Caps owner Ted Leonsis is up in NY and is a big part of these negotiations. It's funny he's always been viewed as a quality owner and is always cheered when shown on screen at games, but he might lose alot of that good will and may hear some boos depending on how this plays out. The sides are supposed to meet and negotiate today, but it's not sounding good at all. Despite making some progress on a few of the secondary issues neither side wants to budge much on the main problems.

By many accounts, Leonsis has been heavily involved in both NHL lockouts as well as the NBA's. He's put together a quality NHL team, despite their playoff failures. He's also very accessible by owners standards and transparent. If Angelos did the same thing despite the losses, I think the public would have somewhat more empathy. At the end of the day though, I think like everything else though you are judged by your results. Ted knows how to play the PR game.

[JeremyStrain]

The bigger issue to take away from that is that Ovi has felt personally attacked in this lockout and from what I hear blamed Ted for a lot of it. Might be some serious relationship damage done, but that depends on if Ovi can separate work and personal or not at the end of the day.

[DuffMan]

And Bettman suggest a 2 week break from negotiations. This whole freaking lockout has been a break from negotiations! This isn't looking good at all.

[Oriole85]

And Bettman suggest a 2 week break from negotiations. This whole freaking lockout has been a break from negotiations! This isn't looking good at all.

What's the deadline for a season, New Years? I would think they need 40 games minimum.

[DuffMan]

The lockout in the 94-95 season didn't end until January 11th resulting in a 48 game season that got started on the 20th.

For this year I think if a deal isn't in place by the end of December I don't think we get any hockey at all
I didn't think we would really see another complete season wiped out and it's looking more and more likely that will happen. We've already reached the point where if we even get Hockey this season that either side can say they "won" the negotiations. I doubt it happens, but I would like to see them get a mediator in there to help get a deal done.