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NBA 2019-20 General Talk (Lakers Win The Championship)


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#1701 mweb08

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 10:23 PM

Also, props to Rondo, another guy that was widely doubted, including by me. He played quite well in these playoffs.

#1702 mweb08

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 10:56 PM

Gary Payton with the old man Zoom skills.

#1703 Ricker Says

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 11:54 PM

I don't necessarily have LeBron ahead of MJ... yet. But he can still get there. He's knocking on the door.
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"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." ~ The Earl of Baltimore

#1704 Ricker Says

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 11:58 PM

https://theundefeate...-of-excellence/

 

Excellent article.


"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." ~ The Earl of Baltimore

#1705 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 07:46 AM

When do we think the next season will begin? Christmas Day?   January?



#1706 mweb08

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 08:04 AM

When do we think the next season will begin? Christmas Day? January?


Sounds like MLK Day is somewhat realistic.
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#1707 KWebz

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 09:26 AM

My subjectivity is 90% of what fans think which pretty much makes its objectivity. Again, unless youre contrarian just to be contrarian.

I think the thought that it cannot even be a discussion is an opinion that is widely popular among people who are 35+. They grew up with him and I think nostalgia plays a bigger part than most want to admit. I think as time goes on, the argument becomes thinner or at least more blurred. 



#1708 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 09:57 AM

I think the thought that it cannot even be a discussion is an opinion that is widely popular among people who are 35+. They grew up with him and I think nostalgia plays a bigger part than most want to admit. I think as time goes on, the argument becomes thinner or at least more blurred. 


Nostalgia can play a part.  
Mythology can play a part. 

For James, recency bias can play a part. 

I think if you watched Jordan's prime, and you've watched James career... the large majority would have Jordan 1. But I don't think that slights James at all. 

James is quoted last night as saying he wants the respect he deserves.  

That feels strawman to me.  Don't think any basketball fan doesn't respect James talent + accomplishments (and also who he is off the court). 



#1709 Mike B

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 09:57 AM

Sounds like MLK Day is somewhat realistic.

That makes sense, but it seems a little early to me.    I guess the teams could report to training camp 12/26 which would give them about 3 weeks to prepare.


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#1710 KWebz

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:10 AM


Nostalgia can play a part.  
Mythology can play a part. 

For James, recency bias can play a part. 

I think if you watched Jordan's prime, and you've watched James career... the large majority would have Jordan 1. But I don't think that slights James at all. 

James is quoted last night as saying he wants the respect he deserves.  

That feels strawman to me.  Don't think any basketball fan doesn't respect James talent + accomplishments (and also who he is off the court). 

I think the best way to give him the respect he deserves is to stop comparing him to MJ. Its a pedestal that he will never be able to achieve whether that's based in fact/stats (its not) or opinions. I think that's what is frustrating to me, the Era's are so different, and the way the game is played is very different. Nearly everything about the game, both on and off the court, is different, yet people talk like its pure apples to apples. Do people spend hours of their lives comparing Namath to Brady? I mean maybe they do? But yeah, that's my beef, it shouldn't always have to be a comparison. 



#1711 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:10 AM

Speaking of Wilt some of the videos of his athleticism are amazing. Still might be the most athletic big man to ever play. Absolutely would have been a star in the current game.
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#1712 Mike B

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:11 AM


Nostalgia can play a part.  
Mythology can play a part. 

For James, recency bias can play a part. 

I think if you watched Jordan's prime, and you've watched James career... the large majority would have Jordan 1. But I don't think that slights James at all. 

James is quoted last night as saying he wants the respect he deserves.  

That feels strawman to me.  Don't think any basketball fan doesn't respect James talent + accomplishments (and also who he is off the court). 

LBJ dermading respect seems way to self serving to me.  He has long been considered the best player in the current game.  He is the most decorated player in the last 15 years of the NBA.  Considering Jordan or any of the past greats as the GOAT, is oppinion not disrespect.  I think Jordan is the best of all time, but Lebron is certainly in that class.

Frankly, his speech last night was clearly rehearsed.   


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#1713 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:12 AM

LBJ dermading respect seems way to self serving to me. He has long been considered the best player in the current game. He is the most decorated player in the last 15 years of the NBA. Considering Jordan or any of the past greats as the GOAT, is oppinion not disrespect. I think Jordan is the best of all time, but Lebron is certainly in that class.
Frankly, his speech last night was clearly rehearsed.

He gave a speech?

#1714 Mike B

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:14 AM

Speaking of Wilt some of the videos of his athleticism are amazing. Still might be the most athletic big man to ever play. Absolutely still would have been a star in the current game.

As a very young kid, I saw Wilt play a good bit at the beautiful Civic Center.  Wilt was as powerful and skilled player as any.  I agree, he would have been a star today and would have forced teams out of the small lineups.


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#1715 Mike B

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:15 AM

He gave a speech?

It seemed like it to me.  He rightfully won the MVP and talked at least 5 minutes.


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#1716 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:31 AM

I think the best way to give him the respect he deserves is to stop comparing him to MJ. Its a pedestal that he will never be able to achieve whether that's based in fact/stats (its not) or opinions. I think that's what is frustrating to me, the Era's are so different, and the way the game is played is very different. Nearly everything about the game, both on and off the court, is different, yet people talk like its pure apples to apples. Do people spend hours of their lives comparing Namath to Brady? I mean maybe they do? But yeah, that's my beef, it shouldn't always have to be a comparison. 

 

There are plenty of stats in Jordan's favor.  And some for James. 

I think beyond the stats is where people see a difference. Some will see that as made-up mythology. 
Maybe to a point? I just see a clear, and yet hard to describe discernable difference.  

But simpler than that... James better on the boards, better playmaker for others.  Jordan better pure scorer, and defensive player.

 

James getting deserved credit for a longer career, sustained excellence.  But of course Jordan's numbers would be that much better without the retirements. 

Overall, comparisons are inevitable when you are talking about the best of the best.  It's just part of sports. 

But the difficulty in comparing eras is real. 

 


PS: Namath? He's pretty far down the list of all-time QBs. 



#1717 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:34 AM

Speaking of Wilt some of the videos of his athleticism are amazing. Still might be the most athletic big man to ever play. Absolutely would have been a star in the current game.


I can only read the stat lines, and arguments of people who saw both (and readily admit that many favor Russell for his leadership, being labeled a winner)...  but sure seems to me that Wilt has a great argument for being better than Russell. 



#1718 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 10:39 AM


I can only read the stat lines, and arguments of people who saw both (and readily admit that many favor Russell for his leadership, being labeled a winner)... but sure seems to me that Wilt has a great argument for being better than Russell.

You can only judge the player by how they played in their era against their peers but I don't see any way where Russell would have had as big an impact as Wilt if brought into todays game.

#1719 mweb08

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 11:28 AM

That makes sense, but it seems a little early to me. I guess the teams could report to training camp 12/26 which would give them about 3 weeks to prepare.


I think that's an optimistic start date, so for sure could end up later.

#1720 mweb08

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 11:29 AM

Speaking of Wilt some of the videos of his athleticism are amazing. Still might be the most athletic big man to ever play. Absolutely would have been a star in the current game.


Russell was also a physical freak.




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