40 replies to this topic

[SportsGuy]

Putting aside the idea of acquiring Upton for a moment.

If this team could acquire Headley now, without giving up the big 3 prospects(and preferably not Delmonico as well), then how about we just go all out for Josh Hamilton and Greinke in the offseason.

So, few questions for you:

1) are you on board with getting those guys?

2) Does it bother you to go after both of them given their histories, whether it be physical or mental? Should we just go after 1 of them because the risk is too high to have them both?

3) What is the most you would be willing to go to acquire each player?

[Mackus]

I would not sign Hamilton for what it would take to get him here. I'm worried about his injury issues, his drug history, and the possibility that he's a late peak / early decline type guy.

Greinke is probably just as risky given that he's a pitcher, but I'd be more willing to go after him. 5-6 years at $20-23M sounds about right. It's a huge commitment, but I do think the team is close enough to be in a position to make a large splash.

It may be interesting to see the contracts some of the secondary guys get this offseason. There are some pretty interesting guys. If we miss out on Greinke, perhaps we can grab two of them.

[Hooded Viper]

I am all for that as long as you add an additional SP, such as Wandy Rodriguez to Headley prior to the trade deadline. The "calvary" is no longer and this team needs legitimate MLB talent. Plus we still have a healthy farm system with Bundy, Machado, Schoop, Gausman and Delmonico. There is risk, yes but playing it safe hasn't done the O's any good so I say WTF! I would offer Greinke 5-140 amd Hamilton 6-160. This is a team that is a contender:

2B-Roberts
DH/LF-Reimold
RF-Makakis
LF/DH-Hamilton
CF-Jones
C-Wieters
1B-Davis
3B-Headley
SS-Hardy

Greinke
Hammel
Chen
Rodriguez
Britton/Arrieta/Gonzo with Bundy or Gausman as a mid year call up.

Closer JJ
Setup Strop

[JeremyStrain]

Those two have been my preference from the beginning. Hamilton doesn't have the wear and tear some other players his age has, and can transition to LF/RF/1B if he needs to in the field. I think his bat will play exceptionally well for another 5-6 years.

[SportsGuy]

Those two have been my preference from the beginning. Hamilton doesn't have the wear and tear some other players his age has, and can transition to LF/RF/1B if he needs to in the field. I think his bat will play exceptionally well for another 5-6 years.

How much money for both though?

[JeremyStrain]

Don't care. Whatever it takes. Even $20m each will leave our payroll around $100m with Nick, Roberts and Gregg coming off the books soon. We need one more big bat to realistically contend, and his would play really well here. Grienke I think has a decent chance of being successful here, although ideally you want elite sinker pitchers for this park, high K guys are good too.

[SportsGuy]

Don't care. Whatever it takes. Even $20m each will leave our payroll around $100m with Nick, Roberts and Gregg coming off the books soon. We need one more big bat to realistically contend, and his would play really well here. Grienke I think has a decent chance of being successful here, although ideally you want elite sinker pitchers for this park, high K guys are good too.

I think we will need to go 6 years on Greinke and at least 6 and probably 7 years on Hamilton.

Is 6/120-132 for Greinke and 7/160-175 on Hamilton too rich for your blood(or anyone elses)?

[JeremyStrain]

To me it's only money, keeping the prospects that would leave having to trade to add two all-stars is well worth it. That means we'd have cheap talent to offset those contracts with later and let us contend longer.

Two all-stars = more winning. More winning = better attendance. Better attendance = more money. Easy choice for me, it's just all about the timing, and I think the timing is about right.

[SportsGuy]

For arguments sake, let's say the high end of the contracts I suggested are what it would take...This is what some of the team could look like by June 1:

1st- ????
2nd- Schoop- 400K
SS- Machado- 400K
3rd- Headley- 6M
LF- Hamilton- 25M
CF- Jones- 8.5M
RF- Nick- 15M
DH- Davis- 750K
C- Wieters- 3M

Greinke- 22M
Hammel- 7M
Chen- 3.5
Bundy- 400K


Other money owed:

BRob: 10M
Wada: 4M
Lindstrom: 200K
Betimet: 1.75M

That is 108 million...still need another starter, a bullpen, a first baseman and a bench.

For me, I am trading Hardy and Johnson and hoping to fill out more of this team with some of those players. My hope is to get Headley without giving up BMat or Schoop...if we are able to do that, then I think Matusz is the 5th starter.

So, the question is this...is it realistic to think they couldspend 130-140 million on the payroll NEXT YEAR and, would they go beyond that and sign another very good starter, like a Sanchez?

[Mackus]

I think we will need to go 6 years on Greinke and at least 6 and probably 7 years on Hamilton.

Is 6/120-132 for Greinke and 7/160-175 on Hamilton too rich for your blood(or anyone elses)?

That depends on what our payroll maximum really is.

If we can only afford (or Angelos has a cap at) a $100M payroll, then that's too much. That would mean we have about $70-75M tied up in 4 players (Greinke, Hamilton, Markakis, and Jones) for the next 3 years.

If it's a $120-130M cap, then that is a lot easier pill to swallow.

[BSLChrisStoner]

For arguments sake, let's say the high end of the contracts I suggested are what it would take...This is what some of the team could look like by June 1:

1st- ????
2nd- Schoop- 400K
SS- Machado- 400K
3rd- Headley- 6M
LF- Hamilton- 25M
CF- Jones- 8.5M
RF- Nick- 15M
DH- Davis- 750K
C- Wieters- 3M

Greinke- 22M
Hammel- 7M
Chen- 3.5
Bundy- 400K


Other money owed:

BRob: 10M
Wada: 4M
Lindstrom: 200K
Betimet: 1.75M

That is 108 million...still need another starter, a bullpen, a first baseman and a bench.

For me, I am trading Hardy and Johnson and hoping to fill out more of this team with some of those players. My hope is to get Headley without giving up BMat or Schoop...if we are able to do that, then I think Matusz is the 5th starter.

So, the question is this...is it realistic to think they couldspend 130-140 million on the payroll NEXT YEAR and, would they go beyond that and sign another very good starter, like a Sanchez?

It is potentially realistic they could get up to $105-$110M. That is unlikely, but possible. Zero chance at $130-$140M.

With your team above, I'd expect Davis at 1st, with Reimold/Betemit at DH.

[JeremyStrain]

What Chris said. And BTW Sanchez is NOT a good SP

[SportsGuy]

What Chris said. And BTW Sanchez is NOT a good SP

Based on what? The very good K rates, low BB rates, low HR rates, good FIP and xFIp, good GB rates, his ability to miss bats or his very high str%?

[SportsGuy]

It is potentially realistic they could get up to $105-$110M. That is unlikely, but possible. Zero chance at $130-$140M.

With your team above, I'd expect Davis at 1st, with Reimold/Betemit at DH.

Agreed...so that means no Hamilton and Greinke then, although you could really backload the contracts for when when BRob and Nick come off the books.

[ChaosLex]

As long as PA is the owner, I doubt we'll ever give a long term deal to a pitcher.

[JeremyStrain]

Based on what? The very good K rates, low BB rates, low HR rates, good FIP and xFIp, good GB rates, his ability to miss bats or his very high str%?

Getting DFA by a pitching starving team is usually an indicator. He's effectively wild. Another case of the stats not telling you the whole story.

[SportsGuy]

Getting DFA by a pitching starving team is usually an indicator. He's effectively wild. Another case of the stats not telling you the whole story.

I am talking about Anibal Sanchez, not Jonathon.

[JeremyStrain]

I am talking about Anibal Sanchez, not Jonathon.

Well you didn't SAY that

[SportsGuy]

Well you didn't SAY that

But since I was discussing him in another thread, I figured you could put 2 and 2 together. It must be the shoulder acting up. LOL

[JeremyStrain]

But since I was discussing him in another thread, I figured you could put 2 and 2 together. It must be the shoulder acting up. LOL

Didn't see you talking about him. I'd be scared of Anibal, he's kinda fragile.

Can't blame the shoulder for this one...