3891 replies to this topic

[RShack]

The media won't allow it. Doesn't matter if the candidate is sincere or not. 

 

The FOX News and MSNBC's of the world have too much stake in having us watch them exclusively and "hate" the other side. It's absurd. Just watch Each network for an hour. They wouldn't compliment the other side if their lives depended on it. 

 

FOX is the RNC channel

 

MSNBC is the DNC channel (but less so, as they are reducing the hours of political hosts)

 

Neither the DNC nor the RNC are motivated to fix what's wrong...

[SportsGuy]

The long term implications of Bernie's campaign are fascinating, assuming the younger generation really is as liberal as their rampant support for him suggests.  There could be significant changes in societal structures in the future.

Yea...the younger generation is a sad group of people. Free college!! Lol.

[bnickle]

320M +/-.


Whoever wins... the country will move on. Life goes on. Sun comes back out. Country as a whole has too much going for it to be f'ed.

The divisiveness that exists is real though.

It's definitely real. There is a storm brewing. You're the eternal optimist,and I hope you're right, but a lot of people at at their breaking points.

[SportsGuy]

Btw...this whole process, on both sides, has been awful. Disgusting how they are acting.

[Dupin]

Possibly, especially when you consider the demographic trends.

 

Most definitely, increasing urbanization and minority support could increase support for democrats in the future.  That being said, the democrats as they are really aren't a left wing party when taking a broader look at world politics.  The younger generation could demand more widespread support for democratic socialist ideals, which could either push the party or cause a split.  It's possible the mess the republicans are in right now could be looming for the dems.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Personally, I think that's the Ostrich Strategy...  how much does the Middle Class have to shrink before you think it's serious?

 

The issues are profound....  but I think it's in our DNA to handle adversity and move on.

Also... one of those issues is that there is a high level of general ignorance among Americans.  For example.. a legit sizeable amount of the country doesn't know who the VP is....  and even more who the Speaker of the House is.

 

So... Hillary or Trump wins...  there is anger from a sizeable amount of people...  the anger stays... but people return to their lives.

[SportsGuy]

It's definitely real. There is a storm brewing. You're the eternal optimist,and I hope you're right, but a lot of people at at their breaking points.

Yep. Chris is a rosey outlook guy and that's good but you can't ignore the issues in this country.

I mean, forget Isis for a moment. The civil unrest in this country is legit and it's a huge issue. There are going to be more Fergusons and that's scary.

[mweb08]

Part of it is because they think he'll lose.Part of it's because they think he's awful for the party as a whole.Part of it is because they personally don't think he's good and perhaps doesn't even represent Republican ideals as much as they'd like.

It's all because he used to be a liberal and has supported democrats in the past. They are a bunch of fucking assholes.


The country is coming out in huge numbers and they want him and the party is saying fuck you, we want someone else.


It's bullshit.

I agree it's bullshit if they go another direction in a contested convention.

That said, I think you're going a bit overboard on how much support there is for Trump. He's gotten this far in large part due to the sheer number of Republican candidates and that not one guy ever became the true mainstream, establishment Republican.

Trump is truly supported by maybe half of the Republicans and he's not often been the second choice in these primaries. He's truly disliked by a large number of Republicans. Some of those will vote for him in a lesser of two evils choice, some will vote 3rd party, some will vote Hillary, and some will stay home.

[Dupin]

Yea...the younger generation is a sad group of people. Free college!! Lol.

 

That's an issue I have a tough time despite being a 20-something.  I got a real degree (not that it's helped me in this job market) and I made decisions specifically to avoid college debt and don't owe the banks, the government, or anybody else a damn thing.  At the same time, lending practices towards college students, the rampant growth of the cost of college, textbook prices, and numerous other factors could significantly hamper people's ability to attend college.  An easily educated populace would be a benefit to society, but I would be very angry if my money was funding the nonsense degrees some of these kids get.

[mweb08]

Possibly, especially when you consider the demographic trends.

 
Most definitely, increasing urbanization and minority support could increase support for democrats in the future.  That being said, the democrats as they are really aren't a left wing party when taking a broader look at world politics.  The younger generation could demand more widespread support for democratic socialist ideals, which could either push the party or cause a split.  It's possible the mess the republicans are in right now could be looming for the dems.

Shh, don't let the Republicans know that most establishment Democrats aren't even that liberal.

And yes, a split could happen. A true multi-party (4+) system would be better anyway imo.

[SportsGuy]

I agree it's bullshit if they go another direction in a contested convention. That said, I think you're going a bit overboard on how much support there is for Trump. He's gotten this far in large part due to the sheer number of Republican candidates and that not one guy ever became the true mainstream, establishment Republican. Trump is truly supported by maybe half of the Republicans and he's not often been the second choice in these primaries. He's truly disliked by a large number of Republicans. Some of those will vote for him in a lesser of two evils choice, some will vote 3rd party, some will vote Hillary, and some will stay home.

Same will happen with Hilary too though. People can't stand her either.

This is truly a pathetic and yet fascinating election.

People hate politicians. I think this is Trumps biggest weapon. Let's face it, whether you think he's whacky or not, he's the most likely candidate to shake things up.

He may do a shit job but I don't think his chances are any higher than Hilary's of sucking snd it's that shake up that people want.

Again, I think he loses..just don't think he gets crushed.

[mweb08]

Yea...the younger generation is a sad group of people. Free college!! Lol.

 
That's an issue I have a tough time despite being a 20-something.  I got a real degree (not that it's helped me in this job market) and I made decisions specifically to avoid college debt and don't owe the banks, the government, or anybody else a damn thing.  At the same time, lending practices towards college students, the rampant growth of the cost of college, textbook prices, and numerous other factors could significantly hamper people's ability to attend college.  An easily educated populace would be a benefit to society, but I would be very angry if my money was funding the nonsense degrees some of these kids get.

Many colleges used to be free or very cheap. That's back in a time some would call a better time in America btw.

The cost of college is absurd now and the debt people leave college with is not good for the nation.

There can be fair and honest disagreements about solutions and how much college should cost, but it does need to drastically decrease imo.

[SportsGuy]

That's an issue I have a tough time despite being a 20-something.  I got a real degree (not that it's helped me in this job market) and I made decisions specifically to avoid college debt and don't owe the banks, the government, or anybody else a damn thing.  At the same time, lending practices towards college students, the rampant growth of the cost of college, textbook prices, and numerous other factors could significantly hamper people's ability to attend college.  An easily educated populace would be a benefit to society, but I would be very angry if my money was funding the nonsense degrees some of these kids get.

The price of college is stupid but that doesn't mean it should be paid for by a group of people or that govt needs to step in. We need less govt, not more.

[SportsGuy]

Many colleges used to be free or very cheap. That's back in a time some would call a better time in America btw. The cost of college is absurd now and the debt people leave college with is not good for the nation. There can be fair and honest disagreements about solutions and how much college should cost, but it does need to drastically decrease imo.

It will happen because college is going to become less and less of a big deal.

Businesses will start to have their own colleges, teach young people on the job, etc....I truly think we are headed that way.

[RShack]

The issues are profound....  but I think it's in our DNA to handle adversity and move on.

Also... one of those issues is that there is a high level of general ignorance among Americans.  For example.. a legit sizeable amount of the country doesn't know who the VP is....  and even more who the Speaker of the House is.

 

So... Hillary or Trump wins...  there is anger from a sizeable amount of people...  the anger stays... but people return to their lives.

 

Nobody says life will stop...  but what is stopping at an alarming rate is families who are middle class... this is not just some passing squabble issue... it's about the economic foundation of our society...

 

We destroyed Communism over a 50-year period by beating them according to their own criterion:  which system did a better job of providing a decent life for regular people.   That was their criterion, not ours.  But we beat them at it by having a very restrained, moderate, and regulated version of Capitalism.   While that was going on, Capitalism was not deified... while it was going on, the basic American position was the Capitalism was the worst economic system except for the available alternative.  

 

Yet, somehow, as soon as we won the Cold War, that somehow got twisted around into unrestrained, immoderate, unregulated Capitalism getting credit... which it didn't deserve because that's not what won the Cold War, it was the restrained version that did it.   But now we've had 30+ years of the wrong version of Capitalism getting more and more dominant... and now we see the FX:  it's killing the middle class in ways that not only were predictable, they were very explicitly predicted.

 

Neither party wants to admit that... which is how we get Hillary wanting to tweak the status quo... when tweaking will just provide minor adjustments to how many crumbs are tossed towards regular folks while overall wealth gets more and more concentrated... unless/until this is addressed, things will not get better in any meaningful way...

[BSLChrisStoner]

Yep. Chris is a rosey outlook guy and that's good but you can't ignore the issues in this country.

I mean, forget Isis for a moment. The civil unrest in this country is legit and it's a huge issue. There are going to be more Fergusons and that's scary.

 

For someone that has known me for 20+ years... not sure you know me that well.

My normal disposition is not rosy. It's pessimistic, and negative on most things.

It takes effort on my part to try and stay level headed, and not be an extremist.    

 

I'm not naive on the issues which exist.

[mweb08]

I agree it's bullshit if they go another direction in a contested convention. That said, I think you're going a bit overboard on how much support there is for Trump. He's gotten this far in large part due to the sheer number of Republican candidates and that not one guy ever became the true mainstream, establishment Republican. Trump is truly supported by maybe half of the Republicans and he's not often been the second choice in these primaries. He's truly disliked by a large number of Republicans. Some of those will vote for him in a lesser of two evils choice, some will vote 3rd party, some will vote Hillary, and some will stay home.

Same will happen with Hilary too though. People can't stand her either.


This is truly a pathetic and yet fascinating election.


People hate politicians. I think this is Trumps biggest weapon. Let's face it, whether you think he's whacky or not, he's the most likely candidate to shake things up.


He may do a shit job but I don't think his chances are any higher than Hilary's of sucking snd it's that shake up that people want.


Again, I think he loses..just don't think he gets crushed.

Bernie is just as likely to shake things up, but he's obviously going to fall short.

Hillary has a lot more support as of now despite being more unfavorable than favorable. It's hard to compete with Trump in that regard though.

His chances of sucking are vastly higher than Hillary imo. Hillary will likely be pretty much status quo as president. Nothing radical and sound foreign policy decisions even if she's more hawkish than I'd like.

Trump is like Ubaldo.

[Dupin]

The price of college is stupid but that doesn't mean it should be paid for by a group of people or that govt needs to step in. We need less govt, not more.

 

The widespread institutions that the overwhelmingly vast majority of the population have access to are public institutions.  I don't think that ideal really holds up when they're intimately involved in the issue, unless you want to start getting rid of state colleges.

[SportsGuy]

For someone that has known me for 20+ years... not sure you know me that well.
My normal disposition is not rosy. It's pessimistic, and negative on most things.
It takes effort on my part to try and stay level headed, and not be an extremist.    
 
I'm not naive on the issues which exist.

You are pessimistic about a lot of things but you get very rosy for things you csre about...baltimore, sports teams, the greatness of this country.

And yes, you do tend to ignore some issues or, perhaps put in a better way, you brush them aside for the the positives.

[mweb08]

That's an issue I have a tough time despite being a 20-something.  I got a real degree (not that it's helped me in this job market) and I made decisions specifically to avoid college debt and don't owe the banks, the government, or anybody else a damn thing.  At the same time, lending practices towards college students, the rampant growth of the cost of college, textbook prices, and numerous other factors could significantly hamper people's ability to attend college.  An easily educated populace would be a benefit to society, but I would be very angry if my money was funding the nonsense degrees some of these kids get.

The price of college is stupid but that doesn't mean it should be paid for by a group of people or that govt needs to step in. We need less govt, not more.

During the time period Republicans often fondly look back on, the government did subsidize college much more than it does now.