74 replies to this topic

[SportsGuy]

Dammit, Nickle, stop hacking Rob's account!!!!
 
#leBronsuckstoo

Nah..I just think SVP is more well rounded and more entertaining.

I also think he appeals more to viewers/listeners more so than Simmons does.

[mweb08]

Dammit, Nickle, stop hacking Rob's account!!!!

 

#leBronsuckstoo

Nah..I just think SVP is more well rounded and more entertaining.


I also think he appeals more to viewers/listeners more so than Simmons does.

What do you base that last comment off of?

ESPN disagrees with who is more valuable.

I'm not sure that SVP is more well rounded either, and he's definitely not more knowledgeable about 2 of the 3 main sports talked about on national sports radio/TV.

[BSLChrisStoner]

What do you base that last comment off of?

ESPN disagrees with who is more valuable.

I'm not sure that SVP is more well rounded either, and he's definitely not more knowledgeable about 2 of the 3 main sports talked about on national sports radio/TV.

 

How do you figure that ESPN doesn't find SVP more valuable?

SVP is very knowledgeable with golf, college football, gambling... good with the NFL, NBA, and college basketball.

Simmons better with the NBA... not any better with the NFL... not better with college football or basketball. Same or better with gambling.

 

Both pop culture guys.



I personally think what Simmons developed with Grantland, and giving voice to many of those excellent analysts is a great accomplishment. Love everything he did with the site, and wish there was more of that type of coverage. He also gets credit for the 30 for 30...

If I had to choose one who was more 'valuable' I'd say Simmons.  Overall, as we've talked about before, I don't think it matters how valuable any individual is for ESPN.

[mweb08]

What do you base that last comment off of?


ESPN disagrees with who is more valuable.


I'm not sure that SVP is more well rounded either, and he's definitely not more knowledgeable about 2 of the 3 main sports talked about on national sports radio/TV.

 
How do you figure that ESPN doesn't find SVP more valuable?


SVP is very knowledgeable with golf, college football, gambling... good with the NFL, NBA, and college basketball.


Simmons better with the NBA... not any better with the NFL... not better with college football or basketball. Same or better with gambling.
 
Both pop culture guys.




I personally think what Simmons developed with Grantland, and giving voice to many of those excellent analysts is a great accomplishment. Love everything he did with the site, and wish there was more of that type of coverage. He also gets credit for the 30 for 30...


If I had to choose one who was more 'valuable' I'd say Simmons.  Overall, as we've talked about before, I don't think it matters how valuable any individual is for ESPN.

Simmons is allegedly the highest paid talent in ESPN history.

SVP isn't as good with the NFL IMO. Definitely better with the college sports and golf. Not close with the NBA.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Simmons is allegedly the highest paid talent in ESPN history.

SVP isn't as good with the NFL IMO. Definitely better with the college sports and golf. Not close with the NBA.

 

And if they deemed him too valuable to lose, they wouldn't be saying goodbye to him without a desire to even negotiate. (EDIT, this was wrong.)

 

SVP and Simmons are equal with the NFL to me. Both fine. Neither great.   Maybe an edge to Simmons in that he writes.

Also when talking about who is more valuable...  another consideration would be relations with other employees. SVP well liked, Simmons not so much.

[mweb08]

Simmons is allegedly the highest paid talent in ESPN history.


SVP isn't as good with the NFL IMO. Definitely better with the college sports and golf. Not close with the NBA.

 
And if they deemed him too valuable to lose, they wouldn't be saying goodbye to him without a desire to even negotiate.
 
SVP and Simmons are equal with the NFL to me. Both fine. Neither great.   Maybe an edge to Simmons in that he writes.

I didn't say too valuable, I said more valuable. Simmons has obviously pissed them off, but they did want him back before that, and were willing to continue to pay him a ton, presumably easily more than SVP makes. How valuable can SVP be if the radio show is considered expendable in favor of midnight sportscenter? Simmons is also believed to be worth 7+ million on the open market according to some people in the know. It seems that he is pretty much considered the most valuable talent in the industry.

[BSLChrisStoner]

I didn't say too valuable, I said more valuable. Simmons has obviously pissed them off, but they did want him back before that, and were willing to continue to pay him a ton, presumably easily more than SVP makes. How valuable can SVP be if the radio show is considered expendable in favor of midnight sportscenter? Simmons is also believed to be worth 7+ million on the open market according to some people in the know. It seems that he is pretty much considered the most valuable talent in the industry.

 

Right you said more valuable.

One guy they are allowing to leave without attempting to negotiate with.  (EDIT, this was wrong.)

The other guy they presumably gave a raise, and are making a larger focal point of their programming.

I can personally agree with you that Simmons had more overall value, but ESPN's actions don't show agreement with that opinion.

[mweb08]

I didn't say too valuable, I said more valuable. Simmons has obviously pissed them off, but they did want him back before that, and were willing to continue to pay him a ton, presumably easily more than SVP makes. How valuable can SVP be if the radio show is considered expendable in favor of midnight sportscenter? Simmons is also believed to be worth 7+ million on the open market according to some people in the know. It seems that he is pretty much considered the most valuable talent in the industry.

 
Right you said more valuable.


One guy they are allowing to leave without attempting to negotiate with.


The other guy they presumably gave a raise, and are making a larger focal point of their programming.


I can personally agree with you that Simmons had more overall value, but ESPN's actions don't show agreement with that opinion.

They did negotiate with him. They did want him back. Then they got annoyed with him and decided they didn't want to pay him at the salary of the highest talent on their roster.

That doesn't support your stance. That's like if a team let their MVP go elsewhere in part due to off the field issues and partly due to having to pay him a ton. Then they kept their good soldier who's an all-star and will cost considerably less. That doesn't mean they think the latter player is more valuable.

I think it's obvious who is considered more valuable by ESPN and by outsiders, but they're a juggernaut and don't feel they need to deal with the headache that SD Simmons creates while he's being paid more than anyone else.

Also, are they really making SVP a larger part of their programming? The radio show is done and he was already doing SC. Yes, they're building one nightly episode of SC around him, but not exactly the best time slot.

[BSLChrisStoner]

They did negotiate with him. They did want him back. Then they got annoyed with him and decided they didn't want to pay him at the salary of the highest talent on their roster.

That doesn't support your stance. That's like if a team let their MVP go elsewhere in part due to off the field issues and partly due to having to pay him a ton. Then they kept their good soldier who's an all-star and will cost considerably less. That doesn't mean they think the latter player is more valuable.

I think it's obvious who is considered more valuable by ESPN and by outsiders, but they're a juggernaut and don't feel they need to deal with the headache that SD Simmons creates while he's being paid more than anyone else.

Also, are they really making SVP a larger part of their programming? The radio show is done and he was already doing SC. Yes, they're building one nightly episode of SC around him, but not exactly the best time slot.

 

I think SVP would have been best served staying with the radio show, he didn't though... it was his choice, so you would have to think he thinks it is a better opportunity and will be more than just highlights.

Hmm. Thought I saw the other day that there had been no exchange of numbers with Simmons Agent. Maybe I had that wrong.

I won't beat this to death since I do agree with you Simmons has a bit more value, and especially if I'm wrong that there had been negotiations.

[DJ MC]

One guy they are allowing to leave without attempting to negotiate with.

 

This isn't true, any more than Nelson Cruz and Andrew Miller left the Orioles last year without any attempts to negotiate.

[BSLChrisStoner]

I think SVP would have been best served staying with the radio show, he didn't though... it was his choice, so you would have to think he thinks it is a better opportunity and will be more than just highlights.

Hmm. Thought I saw the other day that there had been no exchange of numbers with Simmons Agent. Maybe I had that wrong.

I won't beat this to death since I do agree with you Simmons has a bit more value, and especially if I'm wrong that there had been negotiations.

 

Definitely had this wrong, seeing there had been negotiations.

[mweb08]

I think SVP would have been best served staying with the radio show, he didn't though... it was his choice, so you would have to think he thinks it is a better opportunity and will be more than just highlights.

Hmm. Thought I saw the other day that there had been no exchange of numbers with Simmons Agent. Maybe I had that wrong.


I won't beat this to death since I do agree with you Simmons has a bit more value, and especially if I'm wrong that there had been negotiations.

 
Definitely had this wrong, seeing there had been negotiations.

I don't know that they got into specifics, but there were definitely discussions and the expectation that ESPN wanted him back. Then they got annoyed at him about stuff that has little to nothing to do with his value.

[BSLChrisStoner]

I don't know that they got into specifics, but there were definitely discussions and the expectation that ESPN wanted him back. Then they got annoyed at him about stuff that has little to nothing to do with his value.

 

Well.. it does have something to do with his value.

 

I would imagine it like this...  you take a piece of paper and you have positives on one side, and negatives on the other.
Not every positive and not every negative is the same weight... but you weight things out...

Ability to find talent... 5 points...    Create interesting material... 5 points...  NBA knowledge... 2 points...  Grantland's audience.. 2 points..Ability to work with others -1 point   Salary - 2 points..  etc etc...  (points were not real here, using as example.)

 

If SVP provides All-Star production at a lower cost....  he could be more valuable than Simmons providing MVP production at a higher cost.

 

Definitely interesting seeing these stories kind of break simultaneously.  Will be interesting to watch how things turn out for both.

[mweb08]

More valuable because he's paid less does not equate to more valuable. When I'm talking value, salary is clearly not a consideration, nor should it be. Annoying the bosses could be a part of value, but it's a very minor part. Value in this context is how much money does this person generate.

[BSLChrisStoner]

More valuable because he's paid less does not equate to more valuable. When I'm talking value, salary is clearly not a consideration, nor should it be. Annoying the bosses could be a part of value, but it's a very minor part. Value in this context is how much money does this person generate.

 

You can't not factor salary into any consideration of value... especially if you are then going to say value is in the context of money they generate.

Past that though... even if Simmons generated more money than any individual talent at ESPN...  the money he generated to ESPN was basically meaningless for their bottom-line.

 

 

 

[mweb08]

More valuable because he's paid less does not equate to more valuable. When I'm talking value, salary is clearly not a consideration, nor should it be. Annoying the bosses could be a part of value, but it's a very minor part. Value in this context is how much money does this person generate.

 
You can't not factor salary into any consideration of value... especially if you are then going to say value is in the context of money they generate.


Past that though... even if Simmons generated more money than any individual talent at ESPN...  the money he generated to ESPN was basically meaningless for their bottom-line.


 

Of course I can talk value without considering salary. I mean that's the clear context of this entire discussion. When we talk MVP in sports, we don't talk about salary. When we've talked MVP of ESPN before, salary hasn't been a hinderence. How much these guys get paid is a direct reflection of their value. I really have no clue why we'd hold a higher salary against someone in this conversation. I'm seriously befuddled by this angle.

As for the last part, well that's why they can ditch their MVP because he's annoying them. He's still very valuable in relation to the other talent though. They're just a juggernaut.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Of course I can talk value without considering salary. I mean that's the clear context of this entire discussion. When we talk MVP in sports, we don't talk about salary. When we've talked MVP of ESPN before, salary hasn't been a hinderence. How much these guys get paid is a direct reflection of their value. I really have no clue why we'd hold a higher salary against someone in this conversation. I'm seriously befuddled by this angle.

As for the last part, well that's why they can ditch their MVP because he's annoying them. He's still very valuable in relation to the other talent though. They're just a juggernaut.

 

It's the same as building a team in sports.

Maybe ESPN decided they were going to choose between Simmons and SVP.  Maybe they decided on content, Simmons was more valuable.

But they could have also decided that SVP was close on content, had other intangibles going for him, and was cheaper. Maybe cheap enough to keep some of the others at Grantland.

That would make SVP the more valuable / better investment overall.

 

 

[mweb08]

I don't think these two had much, if anything to do with each other. And surplus value and overall value are two very different things. This has been about overall value.

[BSLChrisStoner]

I don't think these two had much, if anything to do with each other. And surplus value and overall value are two very different things. This has been about overall value.

 

I don't think they had anything to do with each other either, but I don't really see how you can talk value of the two guys... talk about their ability to generate profit... and then not include discussion on the salaries.  I think it would be part of ESPNs valuation of who was more valuable. But ok.

Even limiting it to the criteria you want... while I would give the edge to Simmons... it's not a blowout for Simmons imo.  I'm not really a golf fan, so doesn't matter so much to me.. but the college sports do. As I said, for me... the NFL talk is a wash, maybe slight edge to Simmons for the writing. NBA to Simmons, but I don't think that is a huge disparity either.

 

 

IDK... interesting thoughts. Looking forward to seeing what happens with each.

[SBTarheel]

Simmons- 3.74 Million Twitter followers. 

SVP- 823K

 

For what it's worth.