908 replies to this topic

[SportsGuy]

Simmons has been arguing Duncan over Kobe.

What's his argument for that?

[mweb08]

The excitement factor certainly favors Kobe.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Kobe is clearly above Duncan, IMO. But I understand why he's arguing that RIGHT NOW, given Duncan was looking strong in the current Finals. Another what have you done for me lately type of thing.

[SBTarheel]

He wrote a 2 part piece on Duncan's greatness on Grantland a few weeks back, and brought up some great points, not that anyone has ever doubted Duncan's greatness of course..It's not even that he's arguing better than Kobe per se, more just that Duncan is the best player of that generation.

 

Try to go back and find it, it's a great read regardless of your feelings on whether he's "better" than Kobe or not.

[Oriole85]

if I was doing Rob & Mike's podcast, my top 10 players that I saw play in their prime: off the top of my head.

 

Jordan

Magic

Bird

LeBron

Bryant

Hakeem

Duncan

Isaiah Thomas

Stockton

tie betwen Hansbrough/Lawson/Danny Green/Ellington/Jamison/Carter...

What does LeBron need to do to get to #2? How many more championships?

[SBTarheel]

What does LeBron need to do to get to #2? How many more championships?

If he stays at this pace, he may end up #1...too soon for me to tell for now.

 

I do think LeBron is more Magic 2.0 than Jordan 2.0 though...

[Icterus galbula]

I agree with Simmons' argument of Duncan over Kobe. Duncan's career has been unbelievably steady and valuable. I think his talent is one that is easier to build a winner off of. Kobe is a great player, no doubt, but in terms of consistent, winning, team-focused excellence I am taking Duncan.

[mweb08]

Kobe is clearly above Duncan, IMO. But I understand why he's arguing that RIGHT NOW, given Duncan was looking strong in the current Finals. Another what have you done for me lately type of thing.

He argued it before this year. He makes a good case.

[mweb08]

I agree with Simmons' argument of Duncan over Kobe. Duncan's career has been unbelievably steady and valuable. I think his talent is one that is easier to build a winner off of. Kobe is a great player, no doubt, but in terms of consistent, winning, team-focused excellence I am taking Duncan.

Yeah, it's a tough call imo. Duncan was by far the better teammate and I agree he had been easier to build around.

[SportsGuy]

Yeah, it's a tough call imo. Duncan was by far the better teammate and I agree he had been easier to build around.

But do those things make you a better player?

I will look more into it but I am sure I would have Kobe higher.

[mweb08]

But do those things make you a better player?
I will look more into it but I am sure I would have Kobe higher.

They are part of it.

Btw, no one should use the title argument for Kobe between these two. Duncan has been the best player on all his title teams.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I really respect Tim Duncan a lot, but he just isn't nearly the dynamic player that Kobe is. I'm going to read that article though, thanks for pointing me toward it. I'm in no way trying to dismiss Duncan though, by any stretch. But just my .02 cents, my opinion, Kobe is far superior in terms of being a dynamic ball player. 

[mweb08]

I really respect Tim Duncan a lot, but he just isn't nearly the dynamic player that Kobe is. I'm going to read that article though, thanks for pointing me toward it. I'm in no way trying to dismiss Duncan though, by any stretch. But just my .02 cents, my opinion, Kobe is far superior in terms of being a dynamic ball player. 

But dynamic is different than better player. Kobe has been way more exciting and breathtaking, but that didn't necessarily mean better.

[You Play to Win the Game]

But dynamic is different than better player. Kobe has been way more exciting and breathtaking, but that didn't necessarily mean better.

 

But when not only are you dynamic, but your career averages are also superior, and the championships match Duncan's, I just don't see it. Let's not pretend that Duncan didn't have any key compliments in his title's either. But I'm not really dismissing TD here, I'll read that Grantland article for some more perspective and revisit this later.

[mweb08]

But when not only are you dynamic, but your career averages are also superior, and the championships match Duncan's, I just don't see it. Let's not pretend that Duncan didn't have any key compliments in his title's either. But I'm not really dismissing TD here, I'll read that Grantland article for some more perspective and revisit this later.

His points are superior, but the statistical profile is up for interpretation.

[BSLMattJergensen]

If I were making my own Top Ten of players that I've seen play I'd go with:

 

Jordan

Magic

Bryant

Bird

Shaq

Duncan

Malone

Olajuwon

Lebron

Stockton

 

I will say this about James. If you were to construct a player in a lab you could not come up with a better basketball player than him. He is a physical freak that can shoot from the outside, is a terror to stop off the run and creates matchup issues due to his size and ability to find open teammates.That doesn't mean that he's a better player than Jordan - at least not yet. Among the best of the best he still has a bit of work to do. I fear though that he may never live up to the enormous hype that was placed on him as a teenager. Still he's one of the best I've ever seen.

[Oriole85]

If I were making my own Top Ten of players that I've seen play I'd go with:

 

Jordan

Magic

Bryant

Bird

Shaq

Duncan

Malone

Olajuwon

Lebron

Stockton

 

I will say this about James. If you were to construct a player in a lab you could not come up with a better basketball player than him. He is a physical freak that can shoot from the outside, is a terror to stop off the run and creates matchup issues due to his size and ability to find open teammates.That doesn't mean that he's a better player than Jordan - at least not yet. Among the best of the best he still has a bit of work to do. I fear though that he may never live up to the enormous hype that was placed on him as a teenager. Still he's one of the best I've ever seen.

I believe you are underrating him. I think he's already exceeded initial expectations -- he was holding back in high school. Let's look at his resume: 4 NBA Finals appearances, 2 championships(MVP both times), 4X MVP, NBA first team every year since 2008, perennial All-Star, Olympic gold medal, Rookie of the Year. And he's not even 30 yet. How many people have achieved this much at his age (and yes I know he started earlier but still). Unless he wins every year now, sure some people are going to be disappointed.

[Icterus galbula]

Karl Malone over James seems silly to me.

[SBTarheel]

Karl Malone over James seems silly to me.

This times a Gazillionmilliontrillion.

 

Malone was a beast obviously, but I can't put him in this conversation.

[SportsGuy]

I haven't started to look into the numbers yet...but one initial thought...Stockton over Pippen?