85 replies to this topic

[dpsmith22]

Are you serious? Same could be said for Tillman. He had strong minor league numbers but could not translate it in the big leagues until 2nd half of last year. Minor league time for Britton is likely important because he came back from a very serious injury to shoulder, which in past used to be almost an automatic dagger to a pitchers chances to be good again. Plus in minors and his MLB time, he went through control issues that he can still work on, especially coming back from a major injury. Arrieta needs to prove he can stay consistent from inning to inning and can continue to work on his fastball control and offspeed pitches. He may be better served as just being a power reliever but spending time in minors with more innings might still help him.

-Tillman's value is much higher then the others. He has pitched better than the other young pitchers. I never said trade Tillman.

-I didn't say it wouldn't be better for THEM. I said better for the organization. Your points are supporting how it would be better for them.

Example: Arrieta goes to AAA and pitches well in 10 starts. Your telling me his value to another major league club goes up? Nope, he has to do it at the big league level, which is isn't going to get the chance UNLESS he gets the 5 spot and does well.

I stick to my guns, sending them down doesn't help us get more for them.

[JeremyStrain]

-Tillman's value is much higher then the others. He has pitched better than the other young pitchers. I never said trade Tillman.

-I didn't say it wouldn't be better for THEM. I said better for the organization. Your points are supporting how it would be better for them.

Example: Arrieta goes to AAA and pitches well in 10 starts. Your telling me his value to another major league club goes up? Nope, he has to do it at the big league level, which is isn't going to get the chance UNLESS he gets the 5 spot and does well.

I stick to my guns, sending them down doesn't help us get more for them.

Actually them going down and doing well would still build trade value a bit. From a scouting point of view you just want to know that nothing is physically changed or wrong. If they went down and got shelled it would crush their value but if they did well as they are supposed to it wouldnt hurt them. They are all so young that they still have potential there that is worth giving them a shot. Tillman has no options...hes not going down. Britton is coming off an injury that scared people but he looks like he will be ok. Matusz needs to get out of cy but his success in short spurts showed he still has the ability. Arrieta is the only one really treading what you are saying and hes got the most potential as a rp if they move him.

[Tucker Blair]

It's entirely possible for a players value to go up while pitching at AAA.
It all depends on how he LOOKS doing it. If he still has the same mechanical issues, same troubles in certain situations...well then obviously it is all for naught. But a players value CAN go up in the minors.

It's obviously not ideal and usually not the case, but to say it can't happen is not correct.

/E
And Jeremy explained it fairly well, right before I hit send lol.

[JeremyStrain]

It's entirely possible for a players value to go up while pitching at AAA.
It all depends on how he LOOKS doing it. If he still has the same mechanical issues, same troubles in certain situations...well then obviously it is all for naught. But a players value CAN go up in the minors.

It's obviously not ideal and usually not the case, but to say it can't happen is not correct.

/E
And Jeremy explained it fairly well, right before I hit send lol.

Great minds and all...but I thought i was rambling.

[bmoreraventerp]

-Tillman's value is much higher then the others. He has pitched better than the other young pitchers. I never said trade Tillman.

-I didn't say it wouldn't be better for THEM. I said better for the organization. Your points are supporting how it would be better for them.

Example: Arrieta goes to AAA and pitches well in 10 starts. Your telling me his value to another major league club goes up? Nope, he has to do it at the big league level, which is isn't going to get the chance UNLESS he gets the 5 spot and does well.

I stick to my guns, sending them down doesn't help us get more for them.

My point about Tillman is that he was like Britton, Arrieta and Matusz at beginning of last season. He had very little trade value to the organization because he struggled so much in the majors but did well in the minors. But now look at this season. He is much more valuable and many see that he has that #2 potential again and has a much better chance of that now because he pitched so well after starting in the minors and then pitching in the 2nd half of the season. His value to the organization and trade value is much higher now after spending time in the minors to begin last season.

So the organization can still gain a lot of value if guys like Britton, Arrieta, and even Matusz go down to minors to start season and pitch well. They probably will still need to come up to the bigs and perform to gain value, but your post said the organization gains "nothing" if they send them down to the minors.

Britton is probably the only one of the 3 who can gain the most value before getting called back up to the majors because he was coming back from major injury last year and also had control issues even before the injury. So him pitching healthy in the minors and doing well and showing good sink on his fastball with good control will increase his value even before he gets any big league callup.

Arrieta and Matusz will likely need to show well in the majors to get value back. But time in minors can help them correct issues that caused them to struggle in majors that do not always show up in the stats.

[RichardZ]

My point about Tillman is that he was like Britton, Arrieta and Matusz at beginning of last season. He had very little trade value to the organization because he struggled so much in the majors but did well in the minors. But now look at this season. He is much more valuable and many see that he has that #2 potential again and has a much better chance of that now because he pitched so well after starting in the minors and then pitching in the 2nd half of the season. His value to the organization and trade value is much higher now after spending time in the minors to begin last season.

So the organization can still gain a lot of value if guys like Britton, Arrieta, and even Matusz go down to minors to start season and pitch well. They probably will still need to come up to the bigs and perform to gain value, but your post said the organization gains "nothing" if they send them down to the minors.

Britton is probably the only one of the 3 who can gain the most value before getting called back up to the majors because he was coming back from major injury last year and also had control issues even before the injury. So him pitching healthy in the minors and doing well and showing good sink on his fastball with good control will increase his value even before he gets any big league callup.

Arrieta and Matusz will likely need to show well in the majors to get value back. But time in minors can help them correct issues that caused them to struggle in majors that do not always show up in the stats.

Absolutely agree 100%. Arrieta and Britton on particular. Most agree they have great stuff. Are their problems mechanical? I don't know but I would say yes, especially in Arrieta's case. I would love to see Peterson spend a lot of time with both down in the minors where there is less pressure to perform. Matusz and Tillman proved that going back to the minors can be very beneficial. There's nothing more important than fastball command. Tillman had it last year. Matusz had it in September. Arrieta and Britton didn't have it. With it, they can take a giant leap forward.