52 replies to this topic

[TwentyThirtyFive]

I dont mind OBJ expressing frustration. Nor does the lack of explosiveness really bother me. Cant be something you arent anymore. The problem is the tape shows he takes plays off. Doesnt finish routes. Not running the best routes. Hes not giving 100%. Thats the big issue and its not a surprise. There is never an excuse for lack of effort.


I know a lot of people here criticized the move immediatedly but my god let it be a damn lesson for the casuals who just hear a name and get all excited.

[hallas]

He's always been a prima Donna so despite his "positive" attitude in training camp and so far in real games, he isn't suddenly going to lose his giant ego. Hopefully, we're not going to see another Earl Thomas situation but with OBJ, it wouldn't surprise me.

 

This is maybe a hot take but I've always thought that reports of his prima donna attitude was way overblown.  His teammates have loved him everywhere he's gone, and the Browns are just the Browns so I'm not really going to seriously consider any parting shots they take on him.

[hallas]

Yup his pff rating is terrific. Hes clearly made the most of buying time. Its easy to say pull it down and run when he gets sack. Or get the ball out sooner. Of course when buying time results in big plays crickets from the fans. Its the nature of MMQBing and its annoying. Btw Lamar is obviously still the gold standard for running/scrambling from a QB but its also clear hes lost a step. Slowly seeing the decline in explosiveness

 

 

I'm also wondering how much of that is Roman not being there to make mad scientist blocking schemes to open lanes for him.  His yards after contact is more or less in line with his career averages. (2.77 yards/attempt after contact, compared to 2.87 for his career,) He was fantastic in this regard in 2019 and 2022, so compared to those years, he's taken a step back.  But his number this year is better than 2018 and 2020. (though 2018 maybe doesn't really count.)

None of the running backs are seeing the success we've become used to under Roman.  I can't imagine Hill and Gus all being washed at this point in their careers.

[Mike in STL]

Wasn't he pissed because he drew DPI on a touchdown pass? It certainly didn't strike me as all that odd. I get that he wants to make the play. You like to see that in a player.

Yes, but he’s not doing really anything good all year. The diva is showing up now. Unlike in his first couple years in the league, he’s not good enough to put up with the noise.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

I'm also wondering how much of that is Roman not being there to make mad scientist blocking schemes to open lanes for him. His yards after contact is more or less in line with his career averages. (2.77 yards/attempt after contact, compared to 2.87 for his career,) He was fantastic in this regard in 2019 and 2022, so compared to those years, he's taken a step back. But his number this year is better than 2018 and 2020. (though 2018 maybe doesn't really count.)

None of the running backs are seeing the success we've become used to under Roman. I can't imagine Hill and Gus all being washed at this point in their careers.

Obv Romans schemes helped with the pure yardage and ypc. Still pretty obvious that hes lost some juice. I think for a few years he was legit the most explosive dynamic runner in the whole league. Still dangerous obviously but just not the same

[hallas]

Yes, but he’s not doing really anything good all year. The diva is showing up now. Unlike in his first couple years in the league, he’s not good enough to put up with the noise.

 

Another thing, he had 3 DPI called against him for 20+ yards each, 2 others in addition to this one where he ended up heated, and ended up taking a spike in the ribs from Budda Baker on a play that somehow avoided being a PF on a defenseless receiver, so he had a few reasons to be salty.

[bmore_ken]

Sure, if we're grading him on actual performance, I'd like to see him performing better.  He's definitely not performing like a 15 million dollar WR.

He should have never gotten that contract. It didn't make sense then, it still makes no sense. 

[jamesdean]

He should have never gotten that contract. It didn't make sense then, it still makes no sense. 

I would think that part of the reason for signing him was Lamar wanting him on the team. Or at least wanting wide receiver upgrades to drop his trade request and get a deal done.

[bmore_ken]

I would think that part of the reason for signing him was Lamar wanting him on the team. Or at least wanting wide receiver upgrades to drop his trade request and get a deal done.

That very well could be the case. Just seems like a waste of $15M to me. I mean you drafted Flowers, Andrews is Andrews. You signed Agholoar. I know I spelled that wrong. Unless you just didn't trust Bateman to be around all year, it simply made no sense. I mean PI penalties aside, so far it's looking like wasted money. 

[Mike B]

I am still trying to be optimistic about OBJ.  He has shown flashes.  At times I think Lamar tries to force the ball to him.  Bottom line, we need one of OBJ or Bateman to step up.  Bateman has looked fast the last few games and made some plays.  I would bet on him.  

[85Knight]

I am still trying to be optimistic about OBJ. He has shown flashes. At times I think Lamar tries to force the ball to him. Bottom line, we need one of OBJ or Bateman to step up. Bateman has looked fast the last few games and made some plays. I would bet on him.

Hopefully Bateman improves. I have no faith in OBJ giving us much more than he already has. Father time is undefeated.

[Mackus]

I would think that part of the reason for signing him was Lamar wanting him on the team. Or at least wanting wide receiver upgrades to drop his trade request and get a deal done.

 

I wanted Lamar back desperately and was intrigued by Beckham although I still can't imagine anyone else offering him half as much.  But this rationale would really be frustrating to me if it's true.

[jamesdean]

I wanted Lamar back desperately and was intrigued by Beckham although I still can't imagine anyone else offering him half as much.  But this rationale would really be frustrating to me if it's true.

It's easy to play the cynic in retrospect but I really do think it had quite a bit to do with OBJ's signing.  Maybe not Lamar demanding it as part of his negotiations but at the very least, requesting it as a way to convey his dissatisfaction with the state of the Ravens receiving group. 

[bmore_ken]

It's easy to play the cynic in retrospect but I really do think it had quite a bit to do with OBJ's signing.  Maybe not Lamar demanding it as part of his negotiations but at the very least, requesting it as a way to convey his dissatisfaction with the state of the Ravens receiving group. 

See I'm both ways on that. Lamar is playing great(and most of us (wanted him signed) and I get it if EDC needed to placate him. But if Lamar can't win games with a healthy Bateman, Flowers, Andrews, and Agholar(SP). What are they paying for? Because that's pretty much what he's doing now. 

[jamesdean]

See I'm both ways on that. Lamar is playing great(and most of us (wanted him signed) and I get it if EDC needed to placate him. But if Lamar can't win games with a healthy Bateman, Flowers, Andrews, and Agholar(SP). What are they paying for? Because that's pretty much what he's doing now. 

You know I love a heavy, run game but they have all these receivers now who are fast and can stretch the field.  Take advantage of it and use them.  Completion PCT. beyond 20 yards isn't going to be great but what Arizona was doing on Sunday was BS.  They should have stretched them beyond those 10 yards and pounded them right up the middle with Linderbaum leading the way.  As good as Monken was against the Lions, that's how poor he was on Sunday.  He had zero command of what was unfolding in front of his eyes. 

[hallas]

You know I love a heavy, run game but they have all these receivers now who are fast and can stretch the field.  Take advantage of it and use them.  Completion PCT. beyond 20 yards isn't going to be great but what Arizona was doing on Sunday was BS.  They should have stretched them beyond those 10 yards and pounded them right up the middle with Linderbaum leading the way.  As good as Monken was against the Lions, that's how poor he was on Sunday.  He had zero command of what was unfolding in front of his eyes. 

 

We should have just run against that.  Which to our credit we made the adjustment at halftime.  But there's a secondary issue which is that our O-Line gave up pressures and caused passing lanes to get clogged up when they were rushing 3.

[jamesdean]

We should have just run against that.  Which to our credit we made the adjustment at halftime.  But there's a secondary issue which is that our O-Line gave up pressures and caused passing lanes to get clogged up when they were rushing 3.

The offense just played a lousy game and are fortunate Dobbs made it a little bit easier for them.

[Mike in STL]

See I'm both ways on that. Lamar is playing great(and most of us (wanted him signed) and I get it if EDC needed to placate him. But if Lamar can't win games with a healthy Bateman, Flowers, Andrews, and Agholar(SP). What are they paying for? Because that's pretty much what he's doing now. 

Exactly. 

 

Brady had Randy Moss for a couple years. But who else? Welker, Edleman, Gronk. But for the better part of two decades 12 was who you had to gameplan against. Was Deion Branch and Troy Brown keeping defenses up at night? Not a chance. Even Welker and Edleman aren't great by any stretch. OMG that's Danny Amendola over there! Please.

 

Lamar should be able to do it with Andrews and the current cast around him if he's really worth the money given. Mahomes group is decimated except for Kelce. They took away Tyreek Hill last year, still wins MVP and Super Bowl.

 

No excuses. Up your game. 

 

I do worry that Beckham will become a problem in the coming weeks. 

[jamesdean]

Exactly. 

 

Brady had Randy Moss for a couple years. But who else? Welker, Edleman, Gronk. But for the better part of two decades 12 was who you had to gameplan against. Was Deion Branch and Troy Brown keeping defenses up at night? Not a chance. Even Welker and Edleman aren't great by any stretch. OMG that's Danny Amendola over there! Please.

 

Lamar should be able to do it with Andrews and the current cast around him if he's really worth the money given. Mahomes group is decimated except for Kelce. They took away Tyreek Hill last year, still wins MVP and Super Bowl.

 

No excuses. Up your game. 

 

I do worry that Beckham will become a problem in the coming weeks. 

Brady had a rare football acumen, so there's that.  I don't expect Lamar or any other quarterbacks to be able to bring something similar to the table.  That said, there does seem to be a specific disconnect between what Monken/Jackson are seeing at the line of scrimmage and what to do with it.  Sunday's game was a prime example.  It was a new wrinkle in playing shallow, zone coverage and the offense seemed dumbfounded by it all and took a good half of football to adjust.  That's too long.  Way too long.  Against a better team and a quarterback that wasn't throwing gifted interceptions, the Ravens would have been in deep shit quickly.  Brady would never take that long to make a defense pay for what they were doing.  Maybe one or two series and then the assault was on and it was up to the defense to readjust, which rarely happened.  So, who's to blame for the inconsistency?  Monken?  Lamar?  Harbaugh?  Whatever the problem is, it better be fixed starting this week because Seattle is not Arizona.  If it's not going to be fixed, then expecting a deep run into the play-offs is unlikely at best. 

[bmore_ken]

Brady had a rare football acumen, so there's that.  I don't expect Lamar or any other quarterbacks to be able to bring something similar to the table.  That said, there does seem to be a specific disconnect between what Monken/Jackson are seeing at the line of scrimmage and what to do with it.  Sunday's game was a prime example.  It was a new wrinkle in playing shallow, zone coverage and the offense seemed dumbfounded by it all and took a good half of football to adjust.  That's too long.  Way too long.  Against a better team and a quarterback that wasn't throwing gifted interceptions, the Ravens would have been in deep shit quickly.  Brady would never take that long to make a defense pay for what they were doing.  Maybe one or two series and then the assault was on and it was up to the defense to readjust, which rarely happened.  So, who's to blame for the inconsistency?  Monken?  Lamar?  Harbaugh?  Whatever the problem is, it better be fixed starting this week because Seattle is not Arizona.  If it's not going to be fixed, then expecting a deep run into the play-offs is unlikely at best. 

Brady didn't develop that overnight. And people disagree with me on this, but I think he benefited by learning under Bledsoe. The rest of that I agree with though. I think they'll be fine in the playoffs. Jackson and Monken are still learning each other. I think they'll get there. They have a whole half season behind them.