155 replies to this topic

[mweb08]

There is definitely a lot of reasons to be concerned about the pen right now. Felix is a huge loss and that'd be true regardless of other moves, but I really wish the front office would have properly addressed what was an obvious need at the deadline and/or even before the season (getting someone better than Givens).

[Mike B]

I think what we are seeing with the Orioles pen is what we are seeing everywhere in baseball, the guys are tired.  The pen should have been addressed at the deadline.  I said at the time and still believe it, that we would have been better off adding 1 or 2 BP arms as opposed to Flaherty.  

Short term, the Orioles need to get the good Gibson tonight, the one who goes 7 or 8  innings and give guys like Webb, Hall and others 2 full days off.

 

I think last night was the first time we saw Hall on back to back days.  His stuff looked a little flat.

[mweb08]

The guys may very well be tired, but the bigger issue is that they guys just aren't that good. I mean there's depth there, but not many guys you want to go to in high leverage situations.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Os bullpen gave up the lead in the 7th.

Gave LAA the lead in the 8th.

Gave up the lead in the 9th,

 

I get we can back each time and ended up winning. But do that in the playoffs against good teams and that's a loss most games. And it all starts with a starter who can't finish 5 innings. Got to do better than 92 pitches in less than 5.

 

Might need to get gopher ball Baumann back up here. 

[Mike B]

The guys may very well be tired, but the bigger issue is that they guys just aren't that good. I mean that's depth there, but not many guys you want to go to in high leverage situations.

We all knew the Felix loss was huge but these are the guys have gotten the job done for this year.  IMO, Hyde has done a good job getting them through the season and we will see if they can freshen them up some and get ready for the post season.

[Mackus]

There is definitely a lot of reasons to be concerned about the pen right now. Felix is a huge loss and that'd be true regardless of other moves, but I really wish the front office would have properly addressed what was an obvious need at the deadline and/or even before the season (getting someone better than Givens).

 

Agree completely with the sentiment.  However, the two guys that I think were the two clearest targets, good pitchers who were traded for deals I definitely would have beaten, have both been pretty bad since the deadline.  Can't say for certain they'd also be pitching poorly if here, and certainly I'd have more faith in them the rest of September and October than I do several of the guys that are here.  But Sewald has a 4.63 ERA in Arizona and Robertson a 7.50 in Miami.  I think doing something and having it not work out is still better management than having done nothing and still needing help.

[Mike B]

I am interested in seeing how they use Means when he comes back next week.  I do not think, they will ask a guy who is just returning from TJ  rehab to pitch 3 or 4 times a week out of the pen.  I think he goes into the rotation or possibly a long guy or piggy back with maybe Grayson once a week.  If he goes into the rotation, who goes to the pen.  The obvious answer is Irvin, but I wonder if Flaherty or even Gibson can raise the velocity a tick to become someone who can help get the ball to Cano in close games.  

[TwentyThirtyFive]

I am interested in seeing how they use Means when he comes back next week. I do not think, they will ask a guy who is just returning from TJ rehab to pitch 3 or 4 times a week out of the pen. I think he goes into the rotation or possibly a long guy or piggy back with maybe Grayson once a week. If he goes into the rotation, who goes to the pen. The obvious answer is Irvin, but I wonder if Flaherty or even Gibson can raise the velocity a tick to become someone who can help get the ball to Cano in close games.

Ive thought about Flaherty and his stuff out of the pen. But hes always been a starter and hes just not gonna be able to transition to throwing back to back nights or likely even 2 of 3 nights. Now in the playoffs I think a guy like this might be willing to say use me how you want or you can use me two days in a row if necessary. Reg season I think generally the pen is who is here. With Baumann,Baker, and Wells if he can get right in the mix down in AAA

[mweb08]

We all knew the Felix loss was huge but these are the guys have gotten the job done for this year. IMO, Hyde has done a good job getting them through the season and we will see if they can freshen them up some and get ready for the post season.

The pens success was overwhelmingly due to Felix and Cano. By Win Probability Added, they were two of the most valuable players in baseball.

However, to your point, yes plenty of others have been at least solid. I think Coulombe is a good lefty reliever that can be used in high leverage situations (at least this year), but beyond him it's just a bunch of middle reliever or wildcard types imo.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

From as far back as May, even with Felix and Cano performing, I said my biggest desire at the deadline was at least 1 more BP arm. Elias said post deadline he was close on a RP on deadline day. Shoulda made it happen whoever it was Mike.

[You Play to Win the Game]

From as far back as May, even with Felix and Cano performing, I said my biggest desire at the deadline was at least 1 more BP arm. Elias said post deadline he was close on a RP on deadline day. Shoulda made it happen whoever it was Mike.

Lack of urgency, and also being OK with this year being a step forward rather than going for it. It's still hard for me to ignore these things. Meanwhile, you crack under the pressure on Flaherty when there is nothing in his profile that speaks to under performance? Just an odd deadline. He knew he had to do something, but that was a bad trade, made worse by not addressing the real need.

[NewMarketSean]

Willing to be patient with Hall but the leash is getting shorter with every shaky appearance. Kremer looked like he should have been bagging groceries in 2021 and two years later he’s a solid SP on a team that could win 100 games.

[Mike B]

Lack of urgency, and also being OK with this year being a step forward rather than going for it. It's still hard for me to ignore these things. Meanwhile, you crack under the pressure on Flaherty when there is nothing in his profile that speaks to under performance? Just an odd deadline. He knew he had to do something, but that was a bad trade, made worse by not addressing the real need.

I have said before 2022 surprised the hell out of Elias and company and I think this year has left him in a state of shock on how well this team has played.  Elias tried to downplay expectations all off season and at one point said that the Orioles winning the division was hard to see.  I think he was still focused on building the pipeline and becoming a constant contender going forward.  I didn’t like it, but I saw the reasoning on playing the off season close to the vest, but not addressing the BP at the deadline is real hard to understand.

All that said, we are going to have fun the rest of the year and years going forward, and Elias, Hyde and the front office deserve the credit.  Now do the best you can to get the BP through the end of the year.

[jamesdean]

I have said before 2022 surprised the hell out of Elias and company and I think this year has left him in a state of shock on how well this team has played.  Elias tried to downplay expectations all off season and at one point said that the Orioles winning the division was hard to see.  I think he was still focused on building the pipeline and becoming a constant contender going forward.  I didn’t like it, but I saw the reasoning on playing the off season close to the vest, but not addressing the BP at the deadline is real hard to understand.

All that said, we are going to have fun the rest of the year and years going forward, and Elias, Hyde and the front office deserve the credit.  Now do the best you can to get the BP through the end of the year.

I was just thinking that we haven't even seen Holliday yet. This team could be loaded for years if Angelos gets his head out of his ass and starts using some of that money he's been stuffing in his pockets for years. 

[Mike B]

Willing to be patient with Hall but the leash is getting shorter with every shaky appearance. Kremer looked like he should have been bagging groceries in 2021 and two years later he’s a solid SP on a team that could win 100 games.

Yep, fans need to be patient and understand that young players often need time to adjust.  

I am hoping that a couple of guys in the pen grab the opportunity and make a name for themselves,

 

I did not see the 10th inning last night, but watched the replay today.  Fuji was overpowering.  Build on that Fuji.  The timing is right to be a hero.

[Mike B]

I was just thinking that we haven't even seen Holliday yet. This team could be loaded for years if Angelos gets his head out of his ass and starts using some of that money he's been stuffing in his pockets for years. 

Holiday, Kjerstad, Mayo etc.  They will get here and make them team better.

The issue is Little John.  It is not a small problem.