8 replies to this topic

[bnickle]

Ok, so I'm not a big fan of these threads. Especially, when they are reactionary and clearly hindsight type of complaints. When a manager does something that logically makes sense or is generally a 50/50 call I'm not one to really complain when it doesn't work out. I also will say that I think Buck in general is a very good manager. With that said, there are definitely times where you have the right to question and be upset with a managerial decision. So this is the thread for any complaints or venting. Tonight was one of them for me, and I'll copy and paste what posted in the game thread below.



First gutwrenching loss of the year. At least the only one I can think of right now.

BTW...I missed much of the game but some questionable managing. Ok, first you take Britton out after he had been very good for the last 4.2 innings because he walked 1 guy with 2 down. Granted, again, I wasn't watching the game at this point, I guess if he was noticeably done it's a move you have to make but man does bringing in Socolovich there look brutal in hindsight(BTW...Send SOlocolovich down to AAA for good please).

Now onto the bottom of the 7th. To not pinch hit for Betemit or not give yourself the option to pinch hit for Betemit in that situation is bad. Now, tonight with Weiters being out the options were Flaherty and Chavez. Thats what a stupid 3 man bench or an unwillingness to platoon a horrible right handed hitting Betemit does to you. It's criminal that a guy hitting .160 against LHP is allowed to play regularly against lefties.

Finally, the sending of Thome in the 8th was horrible.Obviously, not Buck but a coaches decision. Tonight was a night where the players got no help from their superiors.

[SportsGuy]

Yea, Socolovich pitching in that situation was awful.

Even worse was watching him load the bases and still leave him in with Lindstrom ready.

Horrible managing.

[Oriole85]

I'm afraid this board is going to be the ultimate second-guessing board. Like bnickle said with the reactionary and hindsight comments, I feel social media is the worst with this. I try to keep all my criticisms to "first-guessing" instead of second-guessing. More times than not, people will tweet their thoughts after something happens and say they felt that way all along. If you felt so strongly about something, why wait to post it? Don't want to look like a fool if you were wrong?

I just think this board is a bad idea, but I guess let's go ahead. I don't mind so much criticisms with philosophy and long-term problems like "why does Buck bunt so much, why not play for the big inning."

[bnickle]

There is nothing wrong with venting. Honestly, with the collection of posters we have here I expect a lot of rational responses in this thread anyway. Critical, but rational.

Lets take tonight for example. Ok, taking Britton out for Sololovich was a judgement call that didn;t work out. I don't like it on the surface but you know there is def a 2nd guessing aspect there. However, while Chris Davis was batting in the 7th I'm sitting there saying to myself, think ahead saying ugh if Balfour walks him they are going to bring in Doolittle to turn Betemit around and make a .160 hitter from the right side beat them. Now again, tonight with a 3 man bench and Wieters being out Buck really didn't have a choice because the other options were Flaherty and Chavez. However, again the point is to put yourself in a position where Betemit has to hit in that situation is horrible. What's worse is Buck's decision to keep letting betemit get reg ABs vs lefty starters. Tolleson should be up here platooning with Betemit at 3b. I just think that is obvious and something I have the right to complain about.


The Thome send is another where really there isn't any hindsight. I mean when a guy gets thrown out by 30 feet that isn't really 2nd guessing. It was simply a bad decision.

[Coker]

I'm afraid this board is going to be the ultimate second-guessing board. Like bnickle said with the reactionary and hindsight comments, I feel social media is the worst with this. I try to keep all my criticisms to "first-guessing" instead of second-guessing. More times than not, people will tweet their thoughts after something happens and say they felt that way all along. If you felt so strongly about something, why wait to post it? Don't want to look like a fool if you were wrong?

I just think this board is a bad idea, but I guess let's go ahead. I don't mind so much criticisms with philosophy and long-term problems like "why does Buck bunt so much, why not play for the big inning."

I couldn't catch the game last night, but anybody who frequents the game threads know how I feel about Betemit against LHP. There is no second-guessing there. He should not be batting against lefties..and that's it. I sure as hell would have said something to the effect of "are you kidding me, Buck? You're going to kill any chance with Betemit batting against Doolittle(?)

[You Play to Win the Game]

I just think this board is a bad idea, but I guess let's go ahead. I don't mind so much criticisms with philosophy and long-term problems like "why does Buck bunt so much, why not play for the big inning."

I think you mean this "thread" not this "board".

Anyway, I don't think there's anything wrong with it, especially with it being confined to one thread like this just to vent and see if others agree with your observations.

As for last night, I wasn't necessarily throwing stuff at the TV when Soco came in, but when he stayed in after walking the bases loaded, I was pretty much at "ape shit" status. And yes, the decision to send Thome was awful. (although I'll provide the caveat that Hale is still the best 3rd base coach we've had since Perlozzo, IMO.)

[SammyBirdland]

Slow Hook Showalter

[Mackus]

I don't mind pulling Britton there or going to Socolovich in that situation. One on and two out in the 6th isn't exactly a high pressure situation, even with just a one-run lead. But I wouldn't let a guy like Socolovich pitch in a tight game like that without having someone ready to come pick up the pieces if things go wrong quickly. You can't have him being the only guy warming up while Britton is pitching there, especially when you know Britton isn't pitching the 7th even if he gets them 1-2-3. So have Soco and Lindstrom warming, with Lindstrom planning to come in for the 7th if Britton/Socolovich get the job done or right away if things get out of hand.

After the second walk to load the bases, you had to pull Socolovich. Can't let him give away that lead.

Any other runner than Thome, except maybe Wieters, and I would have been ok sending him there. Make Jennings make a good throw. But Thome would get thrown out even with a bad throw that isn't caught by the cutoff, him picking it up, and then throwing a two-hopper to the plate. You definitely can be more aggressive with tack-on runs, but you can't be suicidal, which that decision was. It's odd because I think Hale's done a very good job at 3B, and if anything he's actually been too cautious.

[Greg Pappas]

I don't mind pulling Britton there or going to Socolovich in that situation. One on and two out in the 6th isn't exactly a high pressure situation, even with just a one-run lead. But I wouldn't let a guy like Socolovich pitch in a tight game like that without having someone ready to come pick up the pieces if things go wrong quickly. You can't have him being the only guy warming up while Britton is pitching there, especially when you know Britton isn't pitching the 7th even if he gets them 1-2-3. So have Soco and Lindstrom warming, with Lindstrom planning to come in for the 7th if Britton/Socolovich get the job done or right away if things get out of hand.

After the second walk to load the bases, you had to pull Socolovich. Can't let him give away that lead.

Any other runner than Thome, except maybe Wieters, and I would have been ok sending him there. Make Jennings make a good throw. But Thome would get thrown out even with a bad throw that isn't caught by the cutoff, him picking it up, and then throwing a two-hopper to the plate. You definitely can be more aggressive with tack-on runs, but you can't be suicidal, which that decision was. It's odd because I think Hale's done a very good job at 3B, and if anything he's actually been too cautious.

This.