93 replies to this topic

[Matt_P]

I'm just glad I didn't make a dumb trade recommendation in that thread

 

That would have been me. Looks like he lost the power he showed last year and hasn't hit for average the way he did two years ago.

 

I'm a fan of the trade. I think he'll be part of a platoon in LF/RF next year.

[JeffLong]

That would have been me. Looks like he lost the power he showed last year and hasn't hit for average the way he did two years ago.

 

I'm a fan of the trade. I think he'll be part of a platoon in LF/RF next year.

 

Haha wasn't calling you out directly! More just relieved that I didn't say something dumb.

 

In your defense, he showed signs of becoming a very good OFer last season, just never put it all together.

 

Oliver (my favorite of the projection systems) had him w/ a .262/.327/.404 projected line for the season. That gave him a higher projected fWAR than any O's OFer besides Jones.

[FlavaDave10]

De Aza = what we (reasonably) expected from David Lough.

[JefffrO]

Is De Aza a luxury the Orioles can pay for? They do have Lough who seems to be about the same type of player at a much less price. De Aza will cost close to 6 mil next year. Lough a little more then 500,000. De Aza is a much more proven player and a veteran presence that seemed to fit right into this teams chemistry last year. I guess the real question is do the Orioles feel Lough can be counted on to fill the role that De Aza did so well the last month of the year and playoffs.

 

I really think they could both stay. I would really like to see the Orioles keep what they had on the offensive side. Minus Cruz. Plus get Weiters, Machado and Davis back. Orioles really need to fill out the bullpen and keep that the biggest team strength and keep Miller at almost any cost and yes that means losing Cruz.

 

Here is the lineup

VS Right handers

De Aza

Markakis

Machado

Jones

Davis

Weiters

Pearce (DH)

Hardy

Schoop

 

VS Left handers

Markakis

Machado

Jones

Young (DH)

Weiters

Davis

Pearce 

Hardy

Schoop.

 

Do we really need Cruz?

 

[BSLChrisStoner]

As you said, I expect both - Lough and De Aza - to stay.   Lough was actually productive after the Break (of course with highly limited ab's). Like his defense and speed. Think he is capable of hitting for more average like he did in '13... but the lack of real pop, and ability to walk limits him.  Like him a lot as a bench option though.

Right now, I would think De Aza platoons with Pearce in LF as you showed. Plenty of ab's available for him.

He's a bit of luxury I guess, but the type that should be retained with the goals the O's will have for '15.

 

Regarding Cruz... think pretty much everyone would love to have him back for '15... It's how much after '15 do you want to be paying for him? I can see a 3 year deal.. I think the O's would rightfully not cross that line.

[SportsGuy]

De Aza/Pearce is a fine platoon but as I said last week, can you get similar production for less money? That's possible. Duq should explore that.

[mweb08]

De Aza/Pearce is a fine platoon but as I said last week, can you get similar production for less money? That's possible. Duq should explore that.

Maybe, but if I'm looking at similar production for less money, I think I'd look more at Nick. I think Pearce/De Aza bring as much or more production to the table than Nick for a similar cost. And I'm just talking about as a platoon duo, while Pearce can contribute vs righties and at first too.

[mweb08]

For 26 or so million on next years payroll, what would you rather have?

 

1. De Aza, Pearce, Cruz

2. Nick, Cruz

3. Nick, De Aza, and Pearce plus 5 or so million

 

Without really thinking about length of contracts, etc, I'll take the first option. 

[You Play to Win the Game]

Man just would hate to say bye to Nick. Option 3 heart... option 1 head.

[SportsGuy]

For 26 or so million on next years payroll, what would you rather have?
 
1. De Aza, Pearce, Cruz
2. Nick, Cruz
3. Nick, De Aza, and Pearce plus 5 or so million
 
Without really thinking about length of contracts, etc, I'll take the first option. 

2....I'm not sold that Pearce can be much more than a good platoon guy and not sure what we have in De Aza yet.

But, we can have all of them.

[JefffrO]

Really think the Orioles lineup needs De Aza's speed and not another station to station guy. To me Cruz just does not make any sense for the money it will take. This team needs BULLPEN to be among the strongest in the league. Use that money you save on Cruz and get Miller or other options on the market. Markakis is coming back period. The guy is underrated and is a cornerstone of this franchise. People act like this guy can't play anymore and that he was not a big reason for the Orioles success last season. 

[mweb08]

For 26 or so million on next years payroll, what would you rather have?

 

1. De Aza, Pearce, Cruz

2. Nick, Cruz

3. Nick, De Aza, and Pearce plus 5 or so million

 

Without really thinking about length of contracts, etc, I'll take the first option. 

2....I'm not sold that Pearce can be much more than a good platoon guy and not sure what we have in De Aza yet.


But, we can have all of them.

Even if Pearce just becomes solid depth against righties and a good hitter vs lefties, I think he and De Aza produce more than Nick. And yes, they should be able to afford all 3, but if we're talking about allocating some of this money for improvements elsewhere, I'd part with Nick.

[JefffrO]

For 26 or so million on next years payroll, what would you rather have?

 

1. De Aza, Pearce, Cruz

2. Nick, Cruz

3. Nick, De Aza, and Pearce plus 5 or so million

 

Without really thinking about length of contracts, etc, I'll take the first option. 

Nick AT 10-12 PER

Pearce at 2 per

De Aza at 6 per

 I would love to add Miller at say 7-9 per to #3 option or another top reliever on the market.

That is by far the best option and makes the team stronger then any other option. 

To me Miller is more important then Cruz with this teams construction.

[SportsGuy]

I would also prefer option 3.

And really, if Cruz is getting the 4th year, I don't want him at all.

[mweb08]

I would also prefer option 3.


And really, if Cruz is getting the 4th year, I don't want him at all.

You'd prefer option #3 for next year? I also don't want Nick for a 4th year.

[SportsGuy]

You'd prefer option #3 for next year? I also don't want Nick for a 4th year.

For one year...I would want Cruz and Nick.

Don't want to guarantee Nick the 4th year either.

[mweb08]

Do you see Nick being more productive with the bat next year?

[mweb08]

Really think the Orioles lineup needs De Aza's speed and not another station to station guy. To me Cruz just does not make any sense for the money it will take. This team needs BULLPEN to be among the strongest in the league. Use that money you save on Cruz and get Miller or other options on the market. Markakis is coming back period. The guy is underrated and is a cornerstone of this franchise. People act like this guy can't play anymore and that he was not a big reason for the Orioles success last season. 

 

I'd rather bring back Miller than Nick. 

 

As for Nick being underrated, well he's just an OK hitter for his position, his D is great when something is hit within his range, but since that is poor, his overall D is just alright IMO. So he's a decent player that is entering his age 31 season. Nothing to be that excited about IMO. Now it would be nice to have him back, but 4/44 or so is steep for what I think he'll bring to the table over that time. 

[SportsGuy]

Do you see Nick being more productive with the bat next year?

Yea I think so...but part of that is I think he basically played most of the last 6 weeks of the season hurt. If he didn't, then I'm a little less enthusiastic about that.

[JefffrO]

I'd rather bring back Miller than Nick. 

 

As for Nick being underrated, well he's just an OK hitter for his position, his D is great when something is hit within his range, but since that is poor, his overall D is just alright IMO. So he's a decent player that is entering his age 31 season. Nothing to be that excited about IMO. Now it would be nice to have him back, but 4/44 or so is steep for what I think he'll bring to the table over that time. 

I can agree somewhat with this. There is no outfielder that plays right field in Camden Yards better then Nick. 4 years is steep but 4 years for Cruz at much more money is just as steep if not more. Considering the guy is really just a DH that just had his career year. That is what you are paying for with Cruz while Markakis you are pretty much paying for what you are going to get. Markakis is one of the better patient hitters the Orioles have and he does not shrink in the moment when it is big like lets be real Adam Jones seems to in the playoffs. Now I am not hating on Jones but just saying Nick is very valuable and let's be real he should not be leading off. That is not where he should be in a lineup. He is kinda taking one for the team there. I would love a 3 year deal for him and maybe that will be what the markets bares for him. I mean the O's are not just gonna give him a 4th year just because they feel he deserves it for what he has done in an Orioles uniform.

 

I would want Miller over either Markakis or Cruz but we all know 2 of them are coming back we are just not sure which ones or maybe just one is coming back who knows. If the O's lose Markakis he will be missed kinda like an under appreciated girlfriend. You will miss him when he is gone. Just a solid ass professional.