328 replies to this topic

[mweb08]

I think the solution (if there is one) is less equipment instead of more. Take away the feeling of invincibility with all the padding and players will be more conscious of where their head is going. I did some quick research on concussions in the NFL vs. Rugby (meaning I typed it in google) and the majority of what I read stated that the concussion problem isn't as prevalent in rugby. The rugby people could be in denial, that's possible, but it think the psychological effect of wearing a suit of armor is something that should be investigated.

I've heard this argued before, and I tend to agree overall. I'd really be interested in them exploring this in some study or something. I think there's something to it. For all we know, the helmet could cause more jarring around in the head.

I don't think it causes more jarring, but I think there's way more contact to the head because players are emboldened by their helmets.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I don't think it causes more jarring, but I think there's may more contact to the head because players are emboldened by their helmets.

But think about it if a helmet isn't properly fitted (and given how often they fall off, I really don't think many of them are)... You get the impact of your head hitting the helmet upon initial contact, and then any additional reverb that takes place as your head jars around in the helmet. Unless it's precisely fit, I think it's possible the helmet itself could be causing more physical damage, in addition to the psychological damage done by what you are describing.

 

Just a theory, obviously - Not claiming this to be fact at all.

[bnickle]

DJ is right. Kids are going to be pushed away from football. Elite athletes are going to be playing other sports. Interesting that Dilfer was talking the other day about the NFL product sucking because of all the rule changes. Right now people are still buying it. That will change over time. It'll be a slow process but between people just not liking the product because of the rules but knowing they aren't seeing nearly as many elite athletes play the game anymore. Granted, there is never just one reason why a league fails, but look at CFL, XFL, USFL, NFL Europe,etc. The best players were not playing the game. Bottom line.

 

 

I'm absolutely convinced the NFL will be shell of its former self in 25-30 years.

[You Play to Win the Game]

DJ is right. Kids are going to be pushed away from football. Elite athletes are going to be playing other sports. Interesting that Dilfer was talking the other day about the NFL product sucking because of all the rule changes. Right now people are still buying it. That will change over time. It'll be a slow process but between people just not liking the product because of the rules but knowing they aren't seeing nearly as many elite athletes play the game anymore. Granted, there is never just one reason why a league fails, but look at CFL, XFL, USFL, NFL Europe,etc. The best players were not playing the game. Bottom line.

 

 

I'm absolutely convinced the NFL will be shell of its former self in 25-30 years.

 

The difference in those other leagues failing, and the NFL potentially failing (which it won't), is that there WAS superior talent playing the sport elsewhere, which drew the attention of spectators. The NFL will always have the best talent in the sport, and will always have it's fans. People LOVE football. Miller posted a few weeks ago that after this documentary he made up his mind that his son was done with football. Does that mean he's done watching the Ravens? No, of course not. As long as the money is there, and it will be, it will draw plenty of talented players to the league. And while I do agree that as a whole, the talent level will probably decrease, it's all relative. If the fastest guy on the field is running a 4.75, but in general players are running 5.15's, it'll seem like he's running a 4.2.

[DJ MC]

The difference in those other leagues failing, and the NFL potentially failing (which it won't), is that there WAS superior talent playing the sport elsewhere, which drew the attention of spectators. The NFL will always have the best talent in the sport, and will always have it's fans. People LOVE football. Miller posted a few weeks ago that after this documentary he made up his mind that his son was done with football. Does that mean he's done watching the Ravens? No, of course not. As long as the money is there, and it will be, it will draw plenty of talented players to the league. And while I do agree that as a whole, the talent level will probably decrease, it's all relative. If the fastest guy on the field is running a 4.75, but in general players are running 5.15's, it'll seem like he's running a 4.2.

 

This is true. However, there is the other part: how many people will direct their kids away from football not just as players but as fans?

 

As more of the better athletes go into other sports they will start moving up the popularity ranks at the NFL's expense, too.

 

It isn't just talent, either. You need a place to develop talent, and more and more high schools and colleges could look to cut out football programs. That would cut off the only way the NFL has to acquire talent, since they hitched their wagon to the NCAA eighty years ago instead of making serious domestic attempts to create a separate developmental stream.

[bnickle]

The difference in those other leagues failing, and the NFL potentially failing (which it won't), is that there WAS superior talent playing the sport elsewhere, which drew the attention of spectators. The NFL will always have the best talent in the sport, and will always have it's fans. People LOVE football. Miller posted a few weeks ago that after this documentary he made up his mind that his son was done with football. Does that mean he's done watching the Ravens? No, of course not. As long as the money is there, and it will be, it will draw plenty of talented players to the league. And while I do agree that as a whole, the talent level will probably decrease, it's all relative. If the fastest guy on the field is running a 4.75, but in general players are running 5.15's, it'll seem like he's running a 4.2.

I think you are wrong there. I really do. Again, way more than 1 reason but you want to know one of the reasons baseball is now falling way behind basketball and football in this country. It's because they have by far the inferior athletes. There will always be an entertainment factor but eventually people are going to catch on in this country to the stale and watered down product that is the NFL.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I think you are wrong there. I really do. Again, way more than 1 reason but you want to know one of the reasons baseball is now falling way behind basketball and football in this country. It's because they have by far the inferior athletes. There will always be an entertainment factor but eventually people are going to catch on in this country to the stale and watered down product that is the NFL.

 

I disagree - I think it's because some people prefer more sports to others. I've never once heard someone say they don't watch baseball because the catcher doesn't run a 4.2 and can't dunk a basketball. What does that matter? They don't watch baseball because it's boring, simply put. The degree of athleticism of the participants doesn't make it more or less boring, IMO.

[bnickle]

Soccer needs a big kick in the ass in tis country anyway. Their chance will never be better then it will be over the next 25 years to really make soccer go in this country.

 

 

 

Here we go Ricker, interesting to ponder. When we are 70yrs old sitting in our rocking chairs I think it's at least a 50/50 proposition that when we say "football" in this country it will be the same as it is in the rest of the world.

[bnickle]

I disagree - I think it's because some people prefer more sports to others. I've never once heard someone say they don't watch baseball because the catcher doesn't run a 4.2 and can't dunk a basketball. What does that matter? They don't watch baseball because it's boring, simply put. The degree of athleticism of the participants doesn't make it more or less boring, IMO.

Can't disagree more. Sure, I understand the game itself isn't as exciting as others, but it's also because the athletes aren't making it as exciting. Any sport can be exciting when you are seeing world class talent/athletes play the game.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Soccer needs a big kick in the ass in tis country anyway. There chance will never be better than it will be over the next 25 years to really make soccer go in this country.

 

Here we go Ricker, interesting to ponder. When we are 70yrs old sitting in our rocking chairs I think it's at least a 50/50 proposition that when we say "football" in this country it will be the same as it is in the rest of the world.

 

I'm hoping to make it to 70, need to pump the brakes on all the brews, and big mac's. Anywho, I would definitely take the bet. I really think there is less than a 10% chance this turns out to be the case. But I just added a calendar reminder for 11/21/2055 on my google calendar to re-visit this conversation with you.

[You Play to Win the Game]

Can't disagree more. Sure, I understand the game itself isn't as exciting as others, but it's also because the athletes aren't making it as exciting. Any sport can be exciting when you are seeing world class talent/athletes play the game.

 

But what are better athletes going to do to make baseball more exciting? I just don't see it that way. And BTW, baseball is doing just fine, mind you - but I do think general interest in baseball has declined only because the attention span of our society has dramatically declined.

 

The "eventful" nature of the NFL, one game a week, 16 games a year, one win or one loss account for 1/16th of your schedule, only 8 home games a year, etc. will mean that the NFL will always be incredibly exciting, regardless.

 

Maybe some hard core fans only watch certain sports or teams because of certain "athletes", but I don't think most people care about that too much. JMO, could be wrong, we can agree to disagree.

[mweb08]

I disagree - I think it's because some people prefer more sports to others. I've never once heard someone say they don't watch baseball because the catcher doesn't run a 4.2 and can't dunk a basketball. What does that matter? They don't watch baseball because it's boring, simply put. The degree of athleticism of the participants doesn't make it more or less boring, IMO.

 

Very much agree here. What Nickle is saying may play a small role in the slight decline in some people not liking baseball much, but that's never been a reason I've heard given and I think it's much more about the pace of the game and the lack of consistently exciting plays.

[mweb08]

Soccer needs a big kick in the ass in tis country anyway. There chance will never be better than it will be over the next 25 years to really make soccer go in this country.

 

 

 

Here we go Ricker, interesting to ponder. When we are 70yrs old sitting in our rocking chairs I think it's at least a 50/50 proposition that when we say "football" in this country it will be the same as it is in the rest of the world.

 

I'll definitely take that bet and I do think football will decline a lot by then and wouldn't be shocked if it's a fringe sport by then or is totally gone.

[bnickle]

I'll definitely take that bet and I do think football will decline a lot by then and wouldn't be shocked if it's a fringe sport by then or is totally gone.

I mean technically your probably right. Even if it's a fringe sport and soccer has boomed soccer will probably still be soccer and football football.

 

 

Let me restate and change the odds and say I think there is better than a 50/50 chance that soccer is more popular than football in 30 years.

[bnickle]

Im not saying the sport itself doesn't matter but I think you guys underrate people coming to watch the athlete and not the sport.

 

 

If Djokovic and Nadal are playing any tennis match at any tourney in the world I would watch that before I would watch the Jets play the Titans and I think more people would than you think.

 

 

 

Football has all the casual fans right now. that is the key to all of this and Im convinced that eventually erodes. When it does, your going to see the true sports fans and they appreciate the athlete more than the sport itself.

[mweb08]

But in baseball, it's more about how skilled a player is than his pure athleticism. Miguel Cabrera isn't a great pure athlete other than his hand/eye coordination. Most pitchers aren't great pure athletes.

[Oriole85]

President Obama: I wouldn't let my son play pro football (CBS Sports)

 

"I have a 4-month old, almost 5-month old son, Jack Harbaugh, and if President Obama feels that way, then there will be a little bit less competition for Jack Harbaugh when he gets old," Harbaugh said before last year's Super Bowl. "Jack is only 5 months old. He is a really big kid. He has an enormous head. We don't have a 40-time on him yet, but his wingspan is plus one, and as soon as he grows into that head he is going to be something. It's early, but expectations are high for young Jack."

[Oriole85]

NBC News: Poll: Forty percent would steer kids away from football

 

http://firstread.nbc...m-football?lite

 

There is a striking split when it comes to how those at different income levels see the issue. Forty seven percent of respondents making the highest incomes (more than $75,000 per year) say don’t want their children playing football due to these concerns while just 28 percent of those with the lowest incomes (less than $30,000) say the same.

 

Still, 57 percent of Americans in the survey say they would have no problem if their child wanted to play organized football.

[Oriole85]

Davis tackles tough subject with Goodell (ESPN)

 

Davis: “Roger, we play one of America’s most dangerous and most lucrative games. But, still, we have to fight for health benefits. We have to jump through (hoops) for it. Why doesn’t the NFL offer free health care for life, especially for those suffering from brain injury?”

Goodell: “Vernon, first off, we had lots of discussions about that in the collective bargaining process. We went back and improved a lot of our health benefits, both for former players and for current players, to the point where I think the health benefits that are provided to current NFL players are the best in the world. And so I’m proud of what we’ve been able to do with the union in approving those benefits. We all still have a lot of work to do for former players. The cost of trying to provide health care for every player that’s ever played in the league was discussed with the union. It was determined that these changes were the best changes. And that’s what we negotiated. But we’re all proud of the efforts that we made. We will continue to make more efforts and do a better job, particularly with our former players, in providing them opportunities and to give them the proper health care. And our programs, as an example, the ‘88 Plan’ for anyone who has dementia or any other kind of neurological disorder, that’s there for the players and their families for lifetime. So we have programs that are addressing those issues that we have created, or the owners have created, on their own. And we also have several of them that were created with the union.”

[BSLMikeLowe]

Vox: Will Smith's new movie "Concussion" terrifies the NFL. Here's the trailer.