54 replies to this topic

[TwentyThirtyFive]

If his pop time is above average, but his caught stealing is below average, isn't that an indictment of his arm and throwing accuracy?

What else could be a reason that a pop time is good but not resulting in a high SB caught. I will note that I think his accuracy isnt great. Still, there is another important aspect

[Slidemaster]

What else could be a reason that a pop time is good but not resulting in a high SB caught. I will note that I think his accuracy isnt great. Still, there is another important aspect

I guess you could blame the pictures for not doing a better job of holding runners, but either way it doesn't reflect terribly well on him.

I think what concerns me so much about Adley is just how painfully average he has become. He just can't be that replaceable, considering how much the Orioles have invested into him since he was brought into the franchise. That just should not happen to a player in his physical prime, and yet here we are.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Yes its the pitchers. Some of the guys we have had gave him no chance. Little things Hyde didnt focus on. Time to the plate. Most fans arent even aware.


Adley has more talent than most C in the league. If you were doing a draft at C for the next 3-5 years hed still easily go top 5. Probably top 3.

[makoman]

If his pop time is above average, but his caught stealing is below average, isn't that an indictment of his arm and throwing accuracy?

I don't know, but savant has his arm as 4th in MLB last year (note Basallo was 2nd, so that's good). In 2024 it was 24th, 2023 14th, and 2022 9th. I don't know what they mean by that but it doesn't seem problematic.

 

If pop time and arm are fine maybe it's more the pitchers' fault. I would think they account for that too but again I don't know.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Yes its the pitchers. Some of the guys we have had gave him no chance. Little things Hyde didnt focus on. Time to the plate. Most fans arent even aware.


Adley has more talent than most C in the league. If you were doing a draft at C for the next 3-5 years hed still easily go top 5. Probably top 3.

What are you drinking? I just looked at several top 10 positional lists and Adley wasnt top 10 on any of them.

[makoman]

Yes its the pitchers. Some of the guys we have had gave him no chance. Little things Hyde didnt focus on. Time to the plate. Most fans arent even aware.


Adley has more talent than most C in the league. If you were doing a draft at C for the next 3-5 years hed still easily go top 5. Probably top 3.

The year with Kimbrel they stole 15/16 off him.

 

With Burnes it was 41/47.

 

Felix in his career has been 26/31. 

 

These aren't all Adley, but it shows that some pitchers just don't seem to care and catchers probably don't have a chance.

[RichardZ]

Pop time, blocking, and framing has always been above average. At times elite.
 
CS was negative last year, 0 in 2023, positive the other years.
 
All per savant. Defense is definitely not a problem IMO. We have also definitely had a number of pitchers past few years who didn't even try to hold runners, don't know how typical that is with other teams though.

Wouldn’t elite be like best in the league or at least top two?

[RichardZ]

I don't know, but savant has his arm as 4th in MLB last year (note Basallo was 2nd, so that's good). In 2024 it was 24th, 2023 14th, and 2022 9th. I don't know what they mean by that but it doesn't seem problematic.

If pop time and arm are fine maybe it's more the pitchers' fault. I would think they account for that too but again I don't know.

His pop times aren’t fine. Elite pop times are 1.86. Basallo was 23rd at 1.91. Rutschman was 36th at 1.94. He’s never been lower than 1.91 and was 1.96 in 2024.

[makoman]

Wouldn’t elite be like best in the league or at least top two?

I don't think anyone characterizes elite as 1 of 1. I was just eyeballing over 80% for all those. If you want to have a different opinion have at it.

 

Re your next post, his pop times have always been above average, to me that's fine. Again, feel free to have a different opinion on that.

[RichardZ]

I don't think anyone characterizes elite as 1 of 1. I was just eyeballing over 80% for all those. If you want to have a different opinion have at it.
 
Re your next post, his pop times have always been above average, to me that's fine. Again, feel free to have a different opinion on that.

36th in the league is above average? Rutschman had strong blocking and framing numbers in 2022. He’s regressed. He’s not top ten in any category to the best of my knowledge and hasn’t been the last two years. Yeah, his pop times are ok/fine but, again, his best CS percentage of 30% was in 2022. I think it was 19% in 2024 and 24% in 2025. By objective measurements, Rutschman is an average, at best, defensive catcher.

[makoman]

36th in the league is above average? Rutschman had strong blocking and framing numbers in 2022. He’s regressed. He’s not top ten in any category to the best of my knowledge and hasn’t been the last two years. Yeah, his pop times are ok/fine but, again, his best CS percentage of 30% was in 2022. I think it was 19% in 2024 and 24% in 2025. By objective measurements, Rutschman is an average, at best, defensive catcher.

When 84 people are listed, sure. 50th percentile is average to me. I could have said median if you prefer, ok. If you take it up to 10 attempts he was 28th of 70. 20 attempts he was 21st of 54. Not great at pop times, but above average. 

 

CS has been bad yeah. I think the pitchers have sucked at it. Adley hasn't been great either. But above average IMO. I mean what I said the first time that you didn't like was "fine" don't see how that isn't fine.

[Mike B]

Holliday.

He has been pretty bad thus far, especially compared to what was expected. He needs to play every day to give him a chance to acclimate to the majors, but if he continues to play poorly he could quickly become a black hole in the lineup and a liability in the field and on the bases. We are quickly getting to the point where he needs to show he's valuable or he needs to be traded before he loses his value. I worry he will just wind up being league average or worse, making his trade value marginal and his daily play a detriment to the team.

I think he was decent last year.  Forget what fans and media set as expectations.  I think he will improve this year, how much he improves is very important.

[Mike B]

Westburg. All the guys mentioned are spot on and key. But I think Westy is the under the radar guy.

The team is just way better offensively and defensively when he's in the lineup.

I think you nailed it.  He played about half the games last year.  We need him to stay healthy and if he does I think the Orioles have a legit Big 3.  I also think he will evolve into a team leader.

[RichardZ]

When 84 people are listed, sure. 50th percentile is average to me. I could have said median if you prefer, ok. If you take it up to 10 attempts he was 28th of 70. 20 attempts he was 21st of 54. Not great at pop times, but above average. 
 
CS has been bad yeah. I think the pitchers have sucked at it. Adley hasn't been great either. But above average IMO. I mean what I said the first time that you didn't like was "fine" don't see how that isn't fine.

Ok. He’s fine. As for blaming the pitchers, that’s fine too, but McCann threw out 34% in 2023, 23% in 2024, and Alex Jackson threw out 29% last year, so our backup catchers have been a little better at catching base stealers. Burnes was terrible at limiting the running game and Felix was awful at it from the pen. Not sure who else we’re trying to pin it on.

[makoman]

Ok. He’s fine. As for blaming the pitchers, that’s fine too, but McCann threw out 34% in 2023, 23% in 2024, and Alex Jackson threw out 29% last year, so our backup catchers have been a little better at catching base stealers. Burnes was terrible at limiting the running game and Felix was awful at it from the pen. Not sure who else we’re trying to pin it on.

Kimbrell like I said earlier. Haven’t really looked at anyone else. But yeah “fine” at pop time. And yeah, backups who usually aren’t expected to hit (maybe McCann was I don’t know) and need to make the majors somehow have been better. Though Adley was better at other things too. We can argue about blocks if you want.