Quite frankly forcing the Dodgers to move to rural Iowa would stop them being from being a contender far more than any salary rule. Guys are always going to find a huge market with nice weather (when there aren't uhh fires at least) and a winning culture appealing even if it's not offering them the most money.

BaltimoreBaseball.com: Orioles owner David Rubenstein favors a salary cap
#41
Posted 26 January 2025 - 11:54 AM
#42
Posted 26 January 2025 - 11:55 AM
Found something put out by a tax firm.
Bonuses are taxed in your home state, not the team's state. So anyone living outside of California would benefit from converting salary to bonus. MLB doesn't do this too much, so not a major consideration.
Deferred money also taxed in your home state at the time of the payment, so again advantages for making that not taxed at California rates or the combined rates of a California team's schedule since it breaks down by where every game is played. Another advantage of deferred payments is that it's not reported via W-2 and therefore isn't subject to Social Security and Medicare taxes, so that's like an 8% savings.
Still don't think all those tax implications come close to making up the lost earning power of the money deferred but it does offset it a bit. Would need to do some math to see how much.
Social security tax is capped at $176k income so the savings is far less than that. Medicare is uncapped but that's only 1.45%. For a 10M salary the FICA would be like 1.56% total.
I don't understand the rationale of not having to pay it on deferred salary though.
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#43
Posted 26 January 2025 - 12:32 PM
Quite frankly forcing the Dodgers to move to rural Iowa would stop them being from being a contender far more than any salary rule. Guys are always going to find a huge market with nice weather (when there aren't uhh fires at least) and a winning culture appealing even if it's not offering them the most money.
So related to this....salary caps [or whatever] don't prevent the Dodgers from operating as well as they do in all aspects of the Game, they are going to have a certain appeal, but every Organization can have an appeal. You don't have one type of player and everyone wants the exact same thing. Whatever rules you put in place, smart organizations are going to figure out how to hang out over the line and create any competitive advantage they can. They don't stop doing it when you move the line, they just orient on hanging out over the new line.
Baltimore doesn't have to attract Asian players to be successful.
Baltimore has a ton of advantages that I typically liken to what the Cardinals have. Figure out how to lean into those things. Find the players that value that and want to be part of [whatever]. Some guys aren't going to - and that's fine - leverage them until it doesn't make sense and figure out the next wave.
I'll keep saying this. Rubenstein has the notion of "opportunity to sign" correct. Build and sell the strengths of the Orioles.
#44
Posted 26 January 2025 - 12:48 PM
Hes the gift that keeps on giving
I disagree with a lot of what dude says but I generally lay off because he seems like a nice guy who just wants to talk baseball. Rarely makes it personal. Sorta like Trea back in the day
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There is baseball, and occasionally there are other things of note
"Now OPS sucks. Got it."
"Making his own olive brine is peak Mackus."
"I'm too hungover to watch a loss." - McNulty
@bopper33
#45
Posted 26 January 2025 - 04:05 PM
You are looking at the contract value and then assessing the deferrals against taxes, etc. Those deferrals are baked into the initial contract.
Ohtani didn't sign a "700M contract", he signed a 465M contract that his Team made look like 700M because they wanted the narrative of "largest professional sports contract" (that didn't last long). They're manipulating the narrative in the development of the contract intentionally on the front side.
Ohtani isn't Boras, but Boras does this a lot. We see it in the Chris Davis contract, you see it in Scherzer's first contract (Nats), you see it in Snell's contract this year. You see him using years of contract to get to totals more recently (that's both NPV and Lux Tax).
For all of these Dodgers contracts (Edman, Snell, Teoscar) the SB and deferrals are (likely) balanced for the Team in terms of NPV, but the player is contributing much less to CA State Tax. Teams do make a chunk of money for Playoffs and WS so it's a little easier to do this for the Dodgers.
You are the one who took the Passan reasoning of why the players deferred money. He opined that it was to save on tax. Ohtani signed a 700M contract. The reason it only has a present day value of $460M is because of the way the payments are deferred. He’s still getting $700M before taxes when all is said and done.
You said it was smart to defer the money to pay less tax in the long run. I would agree if the savings on tax was more than the devaluation of the contract. Seems simple to me.
#46
Posted 26 January 2025 - 06:29 PM
You said it was smart to defer the money to pay less tax in the long run. I would agree if the savings on tax was more than the devaluation of the contract. Seems simple to me.
We aren't evaluating tax savings to the NPV of money. Ohtani's contract was about something different although Passan notes that CA may be looking for ways to get their [90M].
The current contracts are getting both SB and deferrals. They're playing math games with the contracts and the only likely loser is CA treasury.
#47
Posted 27 January 2025 - 11:44 AM
So you think the Dodgers are the only Team that has Talent on it? Do you think they'll win 160 games next year? That's the over-whelming Talent model. What Team has cornered Talent? Are there 15 great players in MLB?
They've got 3 Asian kids because they have all the advantages in the World with getting those guys and they actively work for it.
You are so good at making monumental leaps from statements. Of course other teams than the Dodgers have talent. Their are only 26 roster spots on an MLB roster so obviously no one team can have ALL the talent. But that wasn't the point and you know it. The Dodgers are for sure buying the best roster they can get and to disagree with that is just silly. They are predicted on every site to have more wins than any other team. Does that mean they win the WS? No of course not. But tell me this. Which opening day roster would you rather have? The Dodgers or the O's?
#48
Posted 27 January 2025 - 07:42 PM
You are so good at making monumental leaps from statements. Of course other teams than the Dodgers have talent. There are only 26 roster spots on an MLB roster so obviously no one team can have ALL the talent. But that wasn't the point and you know it.
Wait, you just agreed with my statement that you said is "utter BS". That WAS the point. There's lots of Talent in MLB. There are players that are getting kicked out of MLB that still want to play (and can) but there isn't enough spots.
Would you trade Westburg for Max Muncy straight up right now?
Would you trade Kjerstad for Conforto? If you wanted Conforto, he'd have taken O'Neills contract.
I love Freeman, but ATL pushed him out....should he have retired versus joining the Dodgers? Would you trade mayo for Freeman?
Would you trade Adley for Smith?
Every team in MLB could have traded for Tommy Edman. Cards gave him away. Did/do you want to replace Holliday with Edman?
Bullpens are a wash. They'd love to have Bautista, over any RP they have.
Do I like their SP better, sure, but they have no guarantees and the Orioles could (should) have done more than they did.
#49
Posted 27 January 2025 - 07:43 PM
Which opening day roster would you rather have? The Dodgers or the O's?
In an absolute value world that lacks context, probably the Dodgers. That answer means nothing.
#50
Posted 27 January 2025 - 07:45 PM
In an absolute value world that lacks context, probably the Dodgers. That answer means nothing.
Pedro.......... the gift that keeps on giving
#51
Posted 27 January 2025 - 07:47 PM
Pedro.......... the gift that keeps on giving
Wile E, I thought you weren't responding.
#52
Posted 28 January 2025 - 10:28 AM
Leads me to believe he won't extend anybody till the new agreement is ironed out.
#53
Posted 28 January 2025 - 06:00 PM
In an absolute value world that lacks context, probably the Dodgers. That answer means nothing.
WTH. The context is simple. To win a WS. Which roster has a better shot. I'll give you a hint. It aint the O's.
#54
Posted 28 January 2025 - 06:05 PM
What have we been saying about his intellectual dishonesty. He makes it so easy
WTH. The context is simple. To win a WS. Which roster has a better shot. I'll give you a hint. It aint the O's.
#55
Posted 28 January 2025 - 08:42 PM
WTH. The context is simple. To win a WS. Which roster has a better shot. I'll give you a hint. It aint the O's.
Well, the context of both LA and BAL are very different. The things that go into results are different.
Are you asking me who I'd bet on? Again, the Dodgers. I don't know what that has to do with anything.
You have to make a bet, Dodgers or the Field? I'll take the Field.
I'd actually rather bet on the Dodgers to not make the Playoffs.
#56
Posted 29 January 2025 - 03:08 PM
Well, the context of both LA and BAL are very different. The things that go into results are different.
Are you asking me who I'd bet on? Again, the Dodgers. I don't know what that has to do with anything.
You have to make a bet, Dodgers or the Field? I'll take the Field.
I'd actually rather bet on the Dodgers to not make the Playoffs.
Currently +1800 at Fanduel
https://sportsbook.f...lb?tab=playoffs
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#57
Posted Yesterday, 06:57 PM
Welp, he'll have a little more free time now to lobby for a cap in the next CBA.
#58
Posted Today, 11:24 AM
Quite frankly forcing the Dodgers to move to rural Iowa would stop them being from being a contender far more than any salary rule. Guys are always going to find a huge market with nice weather (when there aren't uhh fires at least) and a winning culture appealing even if it's not offering them the most money.
Right now the NFL team with the longest playoff drought is from New York, while the current dynasty is from Kansas City. I'm not sure such a scenario would even be possible in MLB.
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#59
Posted Today, 11:25 AM
#60
Posted Today, 11:34 AM
Pretty sure Rubenstein just got canned at his other job. Wasn’t he chair of the Kennedy Center?
Yes.
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