167 replies to this topic

[85Knight]

What I don't get is why Hyde thought Perez v Caballero or Perez v Carlson represented a better matchup than Suarez v Rortvedt.

If you think Perez is a better option once Cash pulls the trigger on a PH, then fine. But that didn't happen.

I'm trying to see the logic to it. If Hyde didn't want Suarez to face the Rays lineup a third time through, he shouldn't have come out to start the 7th at all.

Curious.

It's not helping that our manager is in a slump too. Some of the moves he's making are head scratchers and not putting the team in the best position to succeed. The fact that we have tied for the best record in the league is a minor miracle at this point.

[mdrunning]

What I don't get is why Hyde thought Perez v Caballero or Perez v Carlson represented a better matchup than Suarez v Rortvedt. 

 

If you think Perez is a better option once Cash pulls the trigger on a PH, then fine. But that didn't happen. 

 

I'm trying to see the logic to it. If Hyde didn't want Suarez to face the Rays lineup a third time through, he shouldn't have come out to start the 7th at all. 

 

Curious. 

Chiming in late here, I realize.

 

Suarez was pretty much near his pitch limit by that time. (I believe he was at 94, just three short of his season high.) Plus, the most he had thrown on four days rest was 89, so he was already beyond that threshold. Hyde got 20 outs out of Suarez by having him throw as many pitches as he had done on four days rest. 

 

The bullpen had seven outs to get and they couldn't do it. I think Hyde used the best guys he had for that situation. But we lost because we could only muster one run for the game. And that was against a starter whose ERA was close to 5.00 going into the game.

[russsnyder]

Chiming in late here, I realize.

Suarez was pretty much near his pitch limit by that time. (I believe he was at 94, just three short of his season high.) Plus, the most he had thrown on four days rest was 89, so he was already beyond that threshold. Hyde got 20 outs out of Suarez by having him throw as many pitches as he had done on four days rest.

The bullpen had seven outs to get and they couldn't do it. I think Hyde used the best guys he had for that situation. But we lost because we could only muster one run for the game. And that was against a starter whose ERA was close to 5.00 going into the game.

Pitch count issue was absolutely a factor. Hyde even stated that they felt like they had pushed Suarez close to his limit. (Or something like that.)

That said, Suarez was literally cruising and I think he could have gone one more batter. However, Perez & Kimbrel literally shat the bed while getting four outs instead of the seven that was needed.

Hyde deserves the second guessing.

[ivanbalt]

It's fun to blame the bullpen and Hyde's decisions, but the offense scored a whopping 1 run off 9 hits and it was a solo HR.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Yesterday was more straight forward from Hyde than Sat was. He screwed the pooch worse on Sat but we won that game and lost yesterday. Yesterday was what it was. Even if Suarez gets through the 7th he is going to Kimbrel and or Perez for the 8th.

[jamesdean]

It's fun to blame the bullpen and Hyde's decisions, but the offense scored a whopping 1 run off 9 hits and it was a solo HR.

Exactly.  They aren't going to win many games scoring 1 run.  You just never know who's going to show up on any given day with the offense.  And its completely irrelevant who the opposition has on the mound.  

[BSLSteveBirrer]

I am sure that statement geeks have data on this but I way rather see a guy come in to start a fresh inning than in the middle. I would have pulled Suarez after 6 But if he said he felt good then fine send him out for the 7th. But I sure as heck then am not pulling him after he gets the first 2 guys out. No way.

[BSLMikeLowe]

It's fun to blame the bullpen and Hyde's decisions, but the offense scored a whopping 1 run off 9 hits and it was a solo HR.

This is a recurring theme. They just can’t string together good enough performances from everyone, or a game where the offense picks up the pitching or vice versa, to get on a win streak and get any kind of momentum. Since July 1 they have won 3 games in a row just once.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

This is a recurring theme. They just can’t string together good enough performances from everyone, or a game where the offense picks up the pitching or vice versa, to get on a win streak and get any kind of momentum. Since July 1 they have won 3 games in a row just once.

Yup. Things can change but right now its hard to see things not being a grind for them. But just because it may be a grind that doesnt mean they cant grid out say 94 or 95 wins to hopefully win the division. Thats only 5 games over the rest of the way to get to 94 wins.

[Hooded Viper]

As usual, I think people are making too much out of a two to one loss. Since the break, the Rays have had some of the best overall bullpen pitching in the majors. We are up on the season series 8 to 2, and we just faced some really damn good pitching on Sunday. we are tied for the best record in the majors, just let it play out.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

As usual, I think people are making too much out of a two to one loss. Since the break, the Rays have had some of the best overall bullpen pitching in the majors. We are up on the season series 8 to 2, and we just faced some really damn good pitching on Sunday. we are tied for the best record in the majors, just let it play out.

I agree with you about this game and this series. Totally cool with taking 2 of 3. However, I do agree that it doesnt feel like we are well positioned to run off 4 or 5 wins in a row right now. Which is fine but this is more what I mean when I say its gonna be a grind.

[Hooded Viper]

I agree with you about this game and this series. Totally cool with taking 2 of 3. However, I do agree that it doesnt feel like we are well positioned to run off 4 or 5 wins in a row right now. Which is fine but this is more what I mean when I say it’s gonna be a grind.

Yeah, my response was more towards other’s panic , not necessarily you.

[jamesdean]

Just keep winning series and things will take care of themselves.  That's been my mantra from the onset.  Sure, a 10-game winning streak is great and it's fun to watch as it evolves but that's just not who they are right now and haven't been for over a month.  Above all else, try to avoid 4-5 game losing streaks.  I think they have enough offense/pitching/defense to sidestep that. 

[DuffMan]

I am sure that statement geeks have data on this but I way rather see a guy come in to start a fresh inning than in the middle. I would have pulled Suarez after 6 But if he said he felt good then fine send him out for the 7th. But I sure as heck then am not pulling him after he gets the first 2 guys out. No way.

Suarez got the first two guys out in the 7th on 5 pitches.   Why does Hyde take him out there?  Gives up a 2 out hit so be it, I get that.  Just give him the chance to finish that inning.

[weird-O]

Are the announcers still referring to Kimbrel as a future Hall of Famer every 5 minutes?

I haven't heard them mention that in awhile.  

[weird-O]

Exactly.  They aren't going to win many games scoring 1 run.  You just never know who's going to show up on any given day with the offense.  And its completely irrelevant who the opposition has on the mound.  

I think the reason this is such a frustrating loss, is because despite only scoring one run, their starter still had them in a position to win. If Suarez left the game down 2-1, I don't think the loss would have stung as much.

[85Knight]

It's hard to do but we need to accept that this team just isn't as good as last year's team was. What makes it hard to accept are the errors, mental mistakes and the questionable managing.

That being said what has frustrated me the most is what others have alluded to and that's this inconsistent offense. We could easily be 5 games better if what is supposed to be the strength of the team didn't go into so many funks.

I don't want to hear how many runs we've scored this season. I've said many times before that I'd rather score 5 runs in each of two games rather than 9 in one and 1 in the other. We've been shutdown by way too many no name pitchers. More consistency on offense and some of our other warts wouldn't be as big a deal.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Id like to have kept a tally over the season of the games we could figure Hyde had a winning impact on vs a losing impact. Of course it's quite subjective cause you don't know if outcomes would have been different had different decisions have been made. But I feel comfortable in estimating that he's in the minus several games realm overall. In a close race like this year it's enough to potentially end up making a difference.

[jamesdean]

It's hard to do but we need to accept that this team just isn't as good as last year's team was. What makes it hard to accept are the errors, mental mistakes and the questionable managing.

That being said what has frustrated me the most is what others have alluded to and that's this inconsistent offense. We could easily be 5 games better if what is supposed to be the strength of the team didn't go into so many funks.

I don't want to hear how many runs we've scored this season. I've said many times before that I'd rather score 5 runs in each of two games rather than 9 in one and 1 in the other. We've been shutdown by way too many no name pitchers. More consistency on offense and some of our other warts wouldn't be as big a deal.

You're spot on with your observations.  What frustrates me is they'll string a few games together where they're being patient hitters, working the count, making pitchers throw a ton of pitches, drawing walks, manufacturing runs, etc...just looking like a well-oiled machine. Then, seemingly out of nowhere, against a statistically lousy pitcher, they fall flat on their faces.  They start swinging at everything, become very antsy at the plate, like they're being timed to a stopwatch and can't wait to get the game over with.  To me, it's all a mind set and very infuriating to watch.  But like you said, the apologists will come back with the, "they're the 2nd ranked offense in baseball" argument and honestly, it's tough to debate something like that. Unfortunately, it's only a part of the equation and will keep them from stringing any lengthy winning streak together. 

[BSLChrisStoner]

You're spot on with your observations.  What frustrates me is they'll string a few games together where they're being patient hitters, working the count, making pitchers throw a ton of pitches, drawing walks, manufacturing runs, etc...just looking like a well-oiled machine. Then, seemingly out of nowhere, against a statistically lousy pitcher, they fall flat on their faces.  They start swinging at everything, become very antsy at the plate, like they're being timed to a stopwatch and can't wait to get the game over with.  To me, it's all a mind set and very infuriating to watch.  But like you said, the apologists will come back with the, "they're the 2nd ranked offense in baseball" argument and honestly, it's tough to debate something like that. Unfortunately, it's only a part of the equation and will keep them from stringing any lengthy winning streak together. 

 

Apologist here.

The offense can be homer reliant...  but end of the day, it's tough to debate, because their 3rd overall in runs scored. 

The obp was an issue earlier in the year, but they're 11th overall now. 

 

Also 6th overall in batting average. 

 

1st in slugging. 

 

Where I agree, is that they are homer reliant, and does often feel like they leave meat on the bone. 

 

But 3rd overall in runs is 3rd overall in runs.