109 replies to this topic

[St.Steveg]

It looks at this point that the Ravens are going to stand or fall based on Lamar Jackson. His grade last two years has been an incomplete. I don't believe for a moment that he held himself back in any way from this season due to his contract extension, but that's a hard perception for him to shake. I believe Lamar and the Ravens get a deal done, and it wouldn't surprise me if it is soon. What a relief that would be. I am not at all put off by his injuries; there are plenty of QBs who have missed seasons in their careers and still had many quality years.

 

No way should Harbaugh be let go. I think it was an achievement to compete the way they did with not only Lamar being out, but also Bateman and Duvernay and much of the season without Edwards and Dobbins. The talent in this offense is not far from being really good, especially with a new OC. The calls to get rid of him based on criticism of Harbs in-game coaching performance ignore all the stuff a head coach does that we don't get to see, stuff I can see he is very good at.

[cprenegade]

Well, I might be in the minority, but I'm still not excusing EDC for leaving the WR situation in such a mess.  I've been saying it for years that if the Ravens want to be the team coming out of the AFC they needed to get Lamar some upgraded weapons to throw to.  Philadelphia did it for Jalen Hurts, a very Lamar like QB, and the result was an improvement from a 9-8 team last year to a 14-3 team and #1 seed in the NFC.   

 

I know Brown wanted out.  So what.  It wasn't his decision.  Is that the process now?  So if Dobbins follows up his post game comments with a trade request does he just get traded?  And really, trading Brown wasn't the biggest part of the problem.  Not replacing him was.  Thinking Duvernay and Proche were the answer was obviously wrong.  And it's not like they didn't have opportunities to do so.  

 

Of course you can't have superstars at every position in a salary cap world.  But if that's true now, what do you think it's going to be like in a couple of years with Lamar and Roquan a year or two into their contracts?  It's only going to get harder.  The window on having a QB on a rookie contract is now over.  

 

I know he's not going anywhere, but I'm still putting a good part of blame on him for leaving the WR situation in a mess this year.  

[Mackus]

I think EDC deserves ample criticism for the WR room. I still think he's a good GM and don't wanna see a change, but that was a foreseeable problem that needed addressing and ended up being very painful.

[hallas]

No way EDC deserves much blame. 1. He didn't choose to get rid of Brown. I don't know why that keeps getting brought up. Brown wanted out. He asked to be traded. EDC took a bad situation, and he turned Brown into a second 1st rounder. He traded for Roquan, which made a huge difference down the stretch. He drafted Linderbaum and Hamilton, who both look like future studs, with elite potential. He brought in Moses, who solidified a spot on the O-line that has been questionable since Brown forced his way out. He literally fixed every hole, except WR. And hindsight is a powerful thing. Easy to sit back in your armchair and act like you knew Bateman and Duvernay would get hurt. And Proche and Wallace would regress instead of develop more from their promising showing as rookies. WR is the only hole on this team, as currently constructed. You have a good defensive line. You have a good LBer room with Roquan now. Your secondary is one of the better units in football when healthy. We have a top 10 offensive line, borderline top 5. With a healthy Dobbins and Edwards, we have a stacked backfield. We have a great TE room. And when Lamar is there, we have a top 10 QB.

Not sure how anyone can complain about EDC when he has consistently made the right moves, and has put out a top 10 roster 3 years in a row. With a salary cap, you're going to have to take risks with young players developing. You simply cannot afford to stack every position.

I want to pat myself on the back right now and say that I've complained about our WR room since the preseason, and placed blame on EDC for it pretty early on for putting us in a position where we were so lacking in depth there, and I received a fair amount of flak for it.

[Mike in STL]

Bateman flashed X receiver potential early in the season. Don’t forget this offenses top receiver is a tight end. A really good one. Duvernay is a playmaker. Our genius OC doesn’t involve these guys enough. Batemans snap share through a few weeks when he caught multiple deep touchdowns was like 61%. Lower than Ricard’s. Exhibit #26484 why Roman sucks and should have been fired by now.

Two of the season ending injuries and Andrews missed some time in the mid-season, played though some injuries.

WR was the least of this teams problems until they got hurt. Find me another receiving group who isn’t weak if you remove their top two options for the season.

[bmore_ken]

There's one guy here that said we would miss Hollywood. Wonder who it was?

[Mike in STL]

There's one guy here that said we would miss Hollywood. Wonder who it was?

You, miss Hollywood.

We, don’t.

Missing 7 games in the middle of the season is exactly what this team needed.

Of course with our rehab team it probably ends up a season ending injury like the others.

[BSLMikeLowe]

You, miss Hollywood.

We, don’t.

Missing 7 games in the middle of the season is exactly what this team needed.

Of course with our rehab team it probably ends up a season ending injury like the others.

Though Harbaugh would have said he’d probably be ready in a week….for seven straight weeks. Gotta be right at some point, no?

[hallas]

Bateman flashed X receiver potential early in the season. Don’t forget this offenses top receiver is a tight end. A really good one. Duvernay is a playmaker. Our genius OC doesn’t involve these guys enough. Batemans snap share through a few weeks when he caught multiple deep touchdowns was like 61%. Lower than Ricard’s. Exhibit #26484 why Roman sucks and should have been fired by now.

Two of the season ending injuries and Andrews missed some time in the mid-season, played though some injuries.

WR was the least of this teams problems until they got hurt. Find me another receiving group who isn’t weak if you remove their top two options for the season.

Our WR room was weak from the moment Bateman got hurt. Duvernay is a 3rd WR on a lot of teams and his loss wasn't all that consequential because he couldn't get open without Andrews and Bateman drawing attention. And behind him we had Demarcus Robinson, a WR4 that already got cut by an NFL team in the preseason, and some guys that wouldn't make any other team's roster.

We came into the season being 1 injury away from having the worst WR room in the league, and thats exactly how things transpired. You could call that cynical, because that take is assuming no growth from Proche, Duvernay, or Wallace, but frankly none of them warranted much breakout expectation in my eyes. Before his injury, we got more out of Duvernay than I expected, to be honest.

I've beaten this drum raw, but Pickens or Skyy Moore would have been great instead of Ojabo, who didn't play until like week 15. We're drafting him for 2023 but with Lamar's contract in flux I really think we have to draft to the upcoming year.

[hallas]

You, miss Hollywood.

We, don’t.

Missing 7 games in the middle of the season is exactly what this team needed.

Of course with our rehab team it probably ends up a season ending injury like the others.

He managed to outgain Demarcus Robinson by 50% despite only playing 10 games, so it would have been a net win.

I missed Hollywood too. Especially without any replacements in hand.

[Mike in STL]

He managed to outgain Demarcus Robinson by 50% despite only playing 10 games, so it would have been a net win.

I missed Hollywood too. Especially without any replacements in hand.

Factor in he would be a disgruntled player because he didn’t want to be here. He asked out, IMO because Roman misused him starting in that Miami debacle in 2021. And they don’t have Linderbaum either.

[hallas]

Factor in he would be a disgruntled player because he didn’t want to be here. He asked out, IMO because Roman misused him starting in that Miami debacle in 2021. And they don’t have Linderbaum either.

You can miss someone and still recognize that you have to part ways. I'm fine with trading him for a late 1st given that he asked out. That doesn't mean I think his contributions weren't significant, or that we needed to do something to shore up with WR room.


Would it be more accurate to say we missed his production? We missed Earl Thomas' production too after 2019 but no one was sad to see him leave given the circumstances around his departure.

[Mike in STL]

Would it be more accurate to say we missed his production? We missed Earl Thomas' production too after 2019 but no one was sad to see him leave given the circumstances around his departure.

That’s fair.

[NewMarketSean]

Fire Roman.

 

Make a decision quickly on Lamar. If he stays get a deal done. If he doesn't want to be here, doesn't want to play under franchise tag, show him the door and trade him.

 

Start planning 2023 with the mindset that we will be better by subtraction.

[Biggsy]

I want to pat myself on the back right now and say that I've complained about our WR room since the preseason, and placed blame on EDC for it pretty early on for putting us in a position where we were so lacking in depth there, and I received a fair amount of flak for it.

You caught flak because you were bashing Bateman and Duvernay. Both showed pretty good on their limited opportunities.

And Bateman more than showed he could take Browns place. His two long TD's the first two weeks should shut anyone up that wants to claim he doesn't have gamebreaking speed. He got injured. Duvernay got injured. And Roman has a terrible passing scheme.

On top of that, EDC did NOT make some random decision to trade Brown. Brown wanted out. The fact it keeps getting stated that EDC is somehow at fault for trading a guy who asked to be traded is starting to get annoying. It's a pretty simple concept to understand.

Also, we were hard against the cap, and we had limited resources available to fill holes in the WR room, the offensive line, the defensive line, and the secondary. He fixed all but one of those with very limited cap space. We have a GM that has fielded a playoff caliber, superbowl contending roster to start the season, for about 5 years straight now. But yeah, let's blame that guy. You'd think Orioles fans would be a little more appreciative of a competent front office and GM that consistently puts out a winning product, and has a roster capable of winning a Superbowl to start the season.

[Mackus]

The mistake was to not replace Brown.  Bateman as a #1 was questionable and Duvernay as a #2 was questionable.  Proche or Wallace or any camp FA (Robinson) as #3 was questionable.  If those guys are all a slot down, or at least one of them, things look a lot better and a lot more secure.

 

If you don't blame DeCosta for that room, who do you blame?  Its not like anyone else is in charge.  Its not like it was only injuries that led to the issues.  It was a giant gamble and that is without any sort of hindsight, people were calling it a mistake in the offseason.  It was an error and it hurt.  That doesn't make DeCosta a moron or a bad GM or put him on the hot seat, but it was a problem that he should've found a way to address before it became one.

[Hooded Viper]

I’m fairly certain if you cornered EDC he would say he made a mistake with the lack of depth and playmakers at the wide receiver position this season. Go get Hopkins, a new OC, and either sign Lamar, long-term, or trade him and get a Bridge QB like Carr to pair with a young drafted prospect!

[Biggsy]

The mistake was to not replace Brown. Bateman as a #1 was questionable and Duvernay as a #2 was questionable. Proche or Wallace or any camp FA (Robinson) as #3 was questionable. If those guys are all a slot down, or at least one of them, things look a lot better and a lot more secure.

If you don't blame DeCosta for that room, who do you blame? Its not like anyone else is in charge. Its not like it was only injuries that led to the issues. It was a giant gamble and that is without any sort of hindsight, people were calling it a mistake in the offseason. It was an error and it hurt. That doesn't make DeCosta a moron or a bad GM or put him on the hot seat, but it was a problem that he should've found a way to address before it became one.

Who was available that the Ravens could afford, that would have made it better?

Do we all of a sudden have unlimited cap space?

Of course it was a risk. But if you have Roman as your OC, what position on offense do you feel you can sacrifice and take a risk on ? Hint, it's not anywhere on defense, RB, TE or offensive line.

[Mackus]

Who was available that the Ravens could afford, that would have made it better?

Do we all of a sudden have unlimited cap space?

Of course it was a risk. But if you have Roman as your OC, what position on offense do you feel you can sacrifice and take a risk on ? Hint, it's not anywhere on defense, RB, TE or offensive line.

 

I don't have a specific answer to who to go get.  I forget who I would've liked to target, others have pointed to WR drafted in the 2nd or 3rd rounds and those are good examples, some other FAs were available.  

 

Its all a shell game, but you still get blame for places you leave yourself weak.  Its not ok to be desperately weak at a key spot.  You don't just handwave away a problem as being not a problem because of the cap. 

 

WR was likely to be a weakness, everyone saw it coming.  DeCosta has to carry that.  Of course he does.  Suggesting otherwise is nonsensical.  

[You Play to Win the Game]

Also, Harbaugh reports to EDC. At what point is going down with the Roman ship on EDC a little too?

I think EDC is great overall and that isn’t where I’d look to make any changes. But the criticisms are fair. Just because he’s a strong facet of the organization, doesn’t mean you can’t be critical of certain aspects of his performance.