57 replies to this topic

[mdrunning]

He said this afternoon they aren't looking for a pitcher on more than a 1 year deal, and he even said their "model" works best with 1 year deals, which indicates to me that this is how they plan to operate in the future.

To me your above quote about how they actually do have a multi-year deal out there sounds like incredibly lame justification for the incredibly lame attempts they're making to sign anyone of consequence.

Again, how do you know they were incredibly lame?

[makoman]

He said this afternoon they aren't looking for a pitcher on more than a 1 year deal, and he even said their "model" works best with 1 year deals, which indicates to me that this is how they plan to operate in the future.

To me your above quote about how they actually do have a multi-year deal out there sounds like incredibly lame justification for the incredibly lame attempts they're making to sign anyone of consequence.

I thought that was mostly established as a likely simplification/misinterpretation. That would never be the case, and even if it was they would never say it out loud.

[Slidemaster]

Again, how do you know they were incredibly lame?

Because nobody is signing here. Nobody is rumored to be close. None of the very reasonable contracts that pitchers have signed were from us, and we all kn9w that 1-3 year deals aren't getting anyone of consequence.

[Old Man]

The goal is to build a strong contending team to not just compete briefly for 1 or 2 seasons, but for a decade. At least thats the story they told the fanbase.

 

So their model is to put everybody on 1 year deals, how that help towards that strong roster for long term?

 

The only I can come up with, 1 year deals, keeps their long term debt down, and they are trying to position themselves for resale, without coming out and telling the fanbase. We tossed in the rebuild towel.

[Mackus]

So their model is to put everybody on 1 year deals, how that help towards that strong roster for long term?

 

This isn't exactly what he said, I also got it twisted upon first hearing it relayed.

 

He was talking about the dimension changes in left field helps them attract the type of pitchers who are taking 1-year "prove it" type deals.  He didn't outright say that those types of deals are all that the Orioles are interested in making.  Those type of deals are, of course, all the Orioles have made to date under his guidance including this offseason.  I think there is ample reason to fear that the Orioles won' close any deals beyond 1-year with pitchers this offseason, but that'll be because Elias didn't think each player we could point to was worth the contract they wanted (rightly or wrongly...likely wrongly in many cases) and not because they refuse to offer more than 1-year as an organizational philosophy.

[You Play to Win the Game]

If you aren’t willing to pay what multi-year deals require for the talent you want, then yes it is an organizational philosophy to only do 1 year deals. Offering Rodon 6 years at $60M doesn’t say that your organization is down for multi-year deals, it’s window dressing.

[Mackus]

If you aren’t willing to pay what multi-year deals require for the talent you want, then yes it is an organizational philosophy to only do 1 year deals. Offering Rodon 6 years at $60M doesn’t say that your organization is down for multi-year deals, it’s window dressing.

 

I agree completely with the idea that non-competitive offers don't count as having made any effort.  But I don't think that it means there is a blanket policy to not go beyond one year for starters.  I suppose its a narrow distinction, but I don't think a meaningless one.

 

Man I hope they bring in a good SP.

[You Play to Win the Game]

I agree completely with the idea that non-competitive offers don't count as having made any effort. But I don't think that it means there is a blanket policy to not go beyond one year for starters. I suppose its a narrow distinction, but I don't think a meaningless one.

Man I hope they bring in a good SP.

I mean yeah I’m sure they are willing. Just like I’m willing to bang the hottest girl at the bar.

[Mackus]

Duquette had a "no opt outs" policy, he was pretty clear about that, but I don't think Elias has a "one-year only for SP" policy.  In practice that's been what his risk/reward balancing has led to, but up until this offseason I think that made decent sense in most cases.  It clearly no longer does, and they better get someone signed (or added via trade) here soon that shows that.

[Old Man]

Duquette had a "no opt outs" policy, he was pretty clear about that, but I don't think Elias has a "one-year only for SP" policy.  In practice that's been what his risk/reward balancing has led to, but up until this offseason I think that made decent sense in most cases.  It clearly no longer does, and they better get someone signed (or added via trade) here soon that shows that.

DD did for sure, but Angelos the lawyer was even more set against opts out, as just  a way for a player to bail if they do well for themselves.

[mdrunning]

The goal is to build a strong contending team to not just compete briefly for 1 or 2 seasons, but for a decade. At least thats the story they told the fanbase.

 

So their model is to put everybody on 1 year deals, how that help towards that strong roster for long term?

 

The only I can come up with, 1 year deals, keeps their long term debt down, and they are trying to position themselves for resale, without coming out and telling the fanbase. We tossed in the rebuild towel.

I mentioned on another thread that I don't see this being the case. The Angels are exploring a sale, yet there's no indication of them attempting to shed payroll. The Marlins sold for $1.2 billion in 2018 despite having significant debt on the books.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Having the MASN issue settled is far more important to the terms of the sale than any future payroll encumbrances.

[mdrunning]

If you aren’t willing to pay what multi-year deals require for the talent you want, then yes it is an organizational philosophy to only do 1 year deals. Offering Rodon 6 years at $60M doesn’t say that your organization is down for multi-year deals, it’s window dressing.

I know you might just be using the above as an example, but I'm not aware of the Orioles even being in on Rodon. Every report we've seen suggests that the Orioles don't want to go that long and Elias himself more or less confirmed it (in so many words).

[You Play to Win the Game]

I know you might just be using the above as an example, but I'm not aware of the Orioles even being in on Rodon. Every report we've seen suggests that the Orioles don't want to go that long and Elias himself more or less confirmed it (in so many words).

Yeah, just using it as an extreme example to make my point. 

 

I'll clear this up for everyone though... zero chance they are in on Rodon. It isn't in their model/crystal ball/whatever they are using when they decided to assume they can't win the division next year. 

[TwentyThirtyFive]

Paying Rodon 200 mil is asking for trouble. Elias might not want to do it right now but there are numerous trades he can make giving up  good prospects that are better then paying Rodon all that money. Even knowing with Rodon its just money and no prospects would have to be involved.

[SouthRider]

Paying Rodon 200 mil is asking for trouble. Elias might not want to do it right now but there are numerous trades he can make giving up  good prospects that are better then paying Rodon all that money. Even knowing with Rodon its just money and no prospects would have to be involved.

I agree with this. Many on here are like the proverbial kid in the candy shop with their free agent choices. The top guys would never come here without a massive overpay. Outside of that top tier I find the rest of the free agent class a bit underwhelming. Instead of signing another Ubaldo or Cobb I would rather pursue the trade route.

[Slidemaster]

I agree with this. Many on here are like the proverbial kid in the candy shop with their free agent choices. The top guys would never come here without a massive overpay. Outside of that top tier I find the rest of the free agent class a bit underwhelming. Instead of signing another Ubaldo or Cobb I would rather pursue the trade route.

If only they cared about trading.

Hard to keep bragging on your farm system rating I'd you trade parts of it for players that actually help you win though.

[bmore_ken]

Instead of signing another Ubaldo or Cobb I would rather pursue the trade route.

Good luck with them doing that.