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O's Declining Lyles 2023 Option


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#21 bmore_ken

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:23 AM

We also have to realize that we all believe we overpaid a bit on Lyles last year at 7 mil. He did his job and what we were expecting but that price now jumps to 10 mil. Nah, too rich. The fangraphs predictions could be wrong but you have some SPs that are clearly in a tier or two above Lyles that are going to get  14-16 mil a yr over 2 or 3 years. Much better to use the money for that.

I never believed that. He was paid in the right neighborhood imo for what he is. 



#22 Old Man

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:26 AM

I never believed that. He was paid in the right neighborhood imo for what he is. 

Nobody is worth the money they get paid, to play a game.

 

Truth is, there is so much money in this game, that they can pay those salaries.



#23 JeremyStrain

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:27 AM

So if they dont extend Means, and dont sign anybody in that caliber, then what?


If a meteor fell and destroyed Camden then what?

 

Can't play the pessimistic what if game all the time. And believe me, I'm a pessimist. But if we are going to talk about this stuff online, the people that people start dismissing their views and ignoring are the ones that are just all woe is me all the time.

 

It's definitely possible it doesn't happen, but I think it's really unlikely. First reason, the timing is right. People were crying about not spending last year, but we hadn't taken a single step forward developmentally yet. This past year, we took like 3. You don't advance prospects and start making them ML contributors and then go, oh we aren't there yet. Second, I think people will see them as an up and coming team with a farm system behind them and that makes them a destination, as long as they are willing to spend. Normally you just get the hitters interested, because they could sign shorter, put up superhuman numbers and then really cash in. With the small sample size of moving the fence, I think it makes pitching here a little more appealing, it's not necessarily going to crush a pitchers value and hurt future earnings, but hitters were still doing fairly well. Especially LHH, cause that short porch hasn't changed in RF.

 

You have to have players WILLING to sign some place, and most of the past few years people complaining about it, those players were never going to sign here anyway. Now I think there's a bit of a selling point, it's just a matter of the team being willing to pay market price vs trying to be cheap...that we don't know yet...but I'm choosing to be optimistic until proven otherwise. We will know soon enough.


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#24 bmore_ken

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:32 AM

Nobody is worth the money they get paid, to play a game.

Truth is, there is so much money in this game, that they can pay those salaries.

I'm just saying relative to the MLB economy. That dude was bargain basement shopping which is where the Orioles always shop for starting pitching. 7 million is nothing


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#25 Old Man

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 10:40 AM


If a meteor fell and destroyed Camden then what?

 

Can't play the pessimistic what if game all the time. And believe me, I'm a pessimist. But if we are going to talk about this stuff online, the people that people start dismissing their views and ignoring are the ones that are just all woe is me all the time.

...

Fair enough, I think the older I get, the less patience that I have, and this team gave us a glimpse of what good baseball was and how more watchable and enjoyable it is. Going to the stadium was a good experience.

 

Its not Elias skillset that concerns me, but the ruleset in place that he has to follow.


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#26 weird-O

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 11:25 AM

Fair enough, I think the older I get, the less patience that I have, and this team gave us a glimpse of what good baseball was and how more watchable and enjoyable it is. Going to the stadium was a good experience.

 

Its not Elias skillset that concerns me, but the ruleset in place that he has to follow.

I try to stay stave off my negativity, by reminding myself that Elias didn't have to take this job. Another one would have opened up pretty quickly, and he would have been sought after. I want to believe that the Brothers set parameters that a good GM would be comfortable working within. I like to think they'll run the team like good owners do. They'll set a budget, and get out of his way. And they'll only need to get involved, if he wants to go after a really big fish.  

 

We'll see. 


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Good news! I saw a dog today.


#27 makoman

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 11:56 AM

I try to stay stave off my negativity, by reminding myself that Elias didn't have to take this job. Another one would have opened up pretty quickly, and he would have been sought after. I want to believe that the Brothers set parameters that a good GM would be comfortable working within. I like to think they'll run the team like good owners do. They'll set a budget, and get out of his way. And they'll only need to get involved, if he wants to go after a really big fish.  

 

We'll see. 

If the lawsuit is accurate, and it may not be, my impression is that John wants to hire good people and let them do their thing, and Lou wants to be hands on like his dad. John is the one in control. Time will tell...


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#28 JeremyStrain

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 11:56 AM

Fair enough, I think the older I get, the less patience that I have, and this team gave us a glimpse of what good baseball was and how more watchable and enjoyable it is. Going to the stadium was a good experience.

Its not Elias skillset that concerns me, but the ruleset in place that he has to follow.


Yep I understand completely. I think all of us are staring at the situation and wondering what the word on high is going to do. It’s put up or shut up time now. It wasn’t before when everyone wanted it to be. But now they’ve hit .500, were in the playoff hunt down the stretch, and brought their big pieces up to play.
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#29 bmore_ken

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 12:44 PM

Yep I understand completely. I think all of us are staring at the situation and wondering what the word on high is going to do. It’s put up or shut up time now. It wasn’t before when everyone wanted it to be. But now they’ve hit .500, were in the playoff hunt down the stretch, and brought their big pieces up to play.

There's definitely no excuse now.



#30 Old Man

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 01:32 PM

There's definitely no excuse now.

there will always be excuses, but maybe, by now, no longer "acceptable" excuses. :)


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#31 bmore_ken

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 01:35 PM

there will always be excuses, but maybe, by now, no longer "acceptable" excuses. :)

Good point :)


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#32 JeremyStrain

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 04:30 PM

there will always be excuses, but maybe, by now, no longer "acceptable" excuses. :)


The difference between an excuse and a reason is whether or not you believe in it.

 

But yeah, if they were to try to pull the same old crap NOW, it doesn't fly. I'll agree with them up til last year, they weren't there yet. They easily could have been a top 5 draft pick again this year with how the season started. Still questions and holes, and then lost Means for the year. But the way this year went? You are already competing. It's a matter of do you want to REALLY compete or rely on miracle seasons to do it. OAK finds themselves in the running every few years. Doesn't mean they are trying to compete.


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#33 Old Man

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Posted 11 November 2022 - 06:36 AM


The difference between an excuse and a reason is whether or not you believe in it.

 

But yeah, if they were to try to pull the same old crap NOW, it doesn't fly. I'll agree with them up til last year, they weren't there yet. They easily could have been a top 5 draft pick again this year with how the season started. Still questions and holes, and then lost Means for the year. But the way this year went? You are already competing. It's a matter of do you want to REALLY compete or rely on miracle seasons to do it. OAK finds themselves in the running every few years. Doesn't mean they are trying to compete.

I dont think not dumping people and trying to add a player or two, makes this a miracle season. This is a contender for the long haul, right, thats what they keep saying.






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