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2023 Catching


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#1 dude

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:26 PM

Starter:  Tied for the easiest decision in MLB with 124.8 other players.  He'll likely get a full year of service for 2022, he's the full package and while he's not required for winning, he's a great piece.  The only question is if the Orioles can make a pitch for something into FA, but all of that is another thread.  Adley is the 2023 starter regardless of any of that.

 

Backup: This is an open question and one of the 2 most reasonable (I chose to not use the word 'obvious') places to improve the offense.  Chirinos is still on the 40 but he'll be a FA and despite some of the good clubhouse things in 2022, he'll be 39 next season and there's unlikely any upside in the bat.

 

It's a little hard to believe the Orioles have FOUR more catchers on the 40-man right now.  Seriously, none of these guys can be the answer, right?  After putting ZERO catchers on the 40 last year, we're going to have 5 (after RC FA)?? ...and none of them should be an answer to the question of who the Orioles backup catcher is going to be.

 

Cam Gallagher is ARB1, 30 and has a career OPS of .656.  He's from eastern PA, but there should probably be more requirements than that.

 

Anthony Bemboom, is TC2, 33, and recently added back to the 40 after posting a .418 OPS in a pre-Adley '22.

 

Aramis Garcia (ARB1, 30, ML OPS <.600)  and Mark Kolozsvary (TC1, 27, MiL OPS of .669) were both picked up on the waiver wire from the Reds.

 

This just can't be serious.  If none of these guys are the backup catcher in 2023, hey, I agree.  The question is, what is the purpose of adding them to the 40-man.  That actually takes intent.  There's 100s of guys that shouldn't be on a 40-man roster...why are these guys on ours.

 

I have nothing against any of these guys and if you wanted them for AAA depth or something, great, but those should be minor league contracts....and if you can't sign them...so what.  There are zero Baseball reasons to add them to the 40.  You don't have to collect guys to release.  WTH.

 

One thing to consider for the backup is that Adley struggled against LHers this season (.552 OPS).  I don't specifically think that's a concern, but when looking for a backup, I think it makes at least a little sense to pursue a RHer for the handful of days Adley may not be in the lineup (C or DH)



#2 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:32 PM

Of all the things to be concerning yourself with. 



#3 makoman

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:40 PM

It’s fair to talk about if people want to, but I see no reason to think that the 40 man in October means much of anything at all. Well, it means I don’t want to lose these guys for nothing right now, but it means nothing about March 31st. Or about December. IMO it’s meaningless until it’s set for the rule 5 draft.

#4 dude

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:45 PM

Considering guys I'd want to back up....

 

I'd prefer a RHed option, but if they wanted a LHed option for whatever reasons, I'd check in on Tucker Barnhart.  He's been a .700+ OPS bat in his career against RHers and it's weird how everyone in DET was terrible last year.  Had a good clubhouse reputation in Cincy and at 32, he might accept a platoon/help out type role with a young staff and Adley. 

 

If I could pick a RHed option.  I like James McCann from the Mets.  He'll be 33 next season and has 2 years and 24M (12M/per) left on his contract.  He has a .777 OPS vs LHers so there's some buffer there for Adley's performance vs LHers.  I don't think the Mets care about the money in terms of keeping him or moving him, but if they choose to move Francisco Alvarez (their top prospect) into the starters role, they could sign a different compliment (if they don't want Nido).  If they thought they could throw cash on McCann and get a useful prospect, then maybe he's an option.  I'd check in on it.


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#5 BSLBobPhelan

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:54 PM

Sign Austin Hedges, keep two others in AAA.

#6 dude

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 07:55 PM

It’s fair to talk about if people want to, but I see no reason to think that the 40 man in October means much of anything at all. Well, it means I don’t want to lose these guys for nothing right now, but it means nothing about March 31st. Or about December. IMO it’s meaningless until it’s set for the rule 5 draft.

 

Right, so, as I said, let's agree that none of these guys are on the 40-man come 31 MAR....and since we may be losing guys in the Rule 5 this year, it's hard to believe they even stay on the 40 for the next month+....that's 4 spots....

 

So here's the question, there has to be a reason they want these guys on the 40 for 45 days...seriously, try and answer the 'why' question.  I guess it doesn't matter...they aren't going to be on the roster long.

 

...but just because it's the offseason and there's northing to talk about...try to come up with one.  



#7 dude

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 08:04 PM

Sign Austin Hedges, keep two others in AAA.

 

Seems like he's had this emerging reputation forever.  I question whether you don't want to go after more offensive profile.  He's been solid defensively, but we talk about improving the offense and he's been under .600 OPS since 2018.  I don't see that improving in Walltimore.  Actually a little worse versus LH (.558) than RH (.586) over his 2000 career PA.

 

Maybe his market pushes him into a backup role, but I'd think he'd try to find a little more PT somewhere. 

 

Hedges would be a disappointment to me unless there was some more compelling reason to have him.

 

You don't really think they'll carry 2 of those current guys on the 40....do you?



#8 BSLBobPhelan

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Posted 20 October 2022 - 09:18 PM

Seems like he's had this emerging reputation forever. I question whether you don't want to go after more offensive profile. He's been solid defensively, but we talk about improving the offense and he's been under .600 OPS since 2018. I don't see that improving in Walltimore. Actually a little worse versus LH (.558) than RH (.586) over his 2000 career PA.

Maybe his market pushes him into a backup role, but I'd think he'd try to find a little more PT somewhere.

Hedges would be a disappointment to me unless there was some more compelling reason to have him.

You don't really think they'll carry 2 of those current guys on the 40....do you?


No I’m assuming two of them will pass through waivers and be assigned to AAA.

The problem with Chirinos wasn’t his bat, although that was obviously awful, it’s that he was a terrible framer. Backup catcher will likely play ~ twice a week, just give me someone who is going to help the pitching staff as much as possible.

#9 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 07:57 AM

The backup catcher is hardly going to be much of a offensive game changer. Whomever it is just isn't going to play that much. But they sure as heck need to be better at hitting and catching than what we had this past season.



#10 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 08:14 AM

The backup catcher is probably going to start 25% of the games, maybe more.  That's kind of a lot.  An upgrade from Cherinos is some of the lowest hanging fruit for 2023.



#11 dude

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 08:17 AM

The backup catcher is hardly going to be much of a offensive game changer. Whomever it is just isn't going to play that much. But they sure as heck need to be better at hitting and catching than what we had this past season.

 

I think it's important to have someone you can trust back there to help win.  While I think the chance of getting Gunnar to extend (if we're rounding to the nearest 1%) is 0%....I don't necessarily think that's true for Adley.  John Angelos is clearly trying to re-emerge on the scene and putting together an Adley extension could be the most promoting move he could make, so there's some Oriole incentive.

 

If Adley isn't going to be here after 4-5 years, then catch him 130 times and it doesn't really matter...but if we're trying to work an extension (or get one) I wouldn't catch him more than 90-100 games a season.  He'll DH most of the rest of the time so you don't lose the bat, but you do need a compliment that isn't an offensive hole.  Catching is hard on the body, and if you want to make the Playoffs (short term wear) and have extended life in the Majors (long term wear), having a good backup is important to that.



#12 Mackus

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 08:43 AM

Chirinos was obviously terrible at the plate in 2022 but I'd be happy with someone with a similar track record (hopefully younger to not take on as much risk of a faceplant like Chirinos suffered) heading in to 2023.  Chirinos had hit well every year except for 82 PA in 2020.  Better than league average hitter each season from 2015 thru 2021 aside from the short sprint in 2020.

 

Don't know who the best candidates are.  The importance of the position will depend on how much catching you expect from Rutschman.  You could ride him hard because he's such a stud, and then the backup loses importance.  Or like dude suggests you could take it easy on him in hopes of extending his career, and then the backup is more important as he'll play more often.  

 

If you prorate this year to a full season, he would've started 112 games at C and 31 at DH.  I like that pace, so find a catcher you're content to be starting 50 games. Pretty important.


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#13 BSLJordanKatz

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 09:51 AM

My admittedly over simple approach would be sorting everyone on a 1-year-deal by best framing to worst framing and then signing the guy with the best framing lol



#14 BSLJordanKatz

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 09:54 AM

My admittedly over simple approach would be sorting everyone on a 1-year-deal by best framing to worst framing and then signing the guy with the best framing lol

Upon a cursory glance at Baseball Savant data: welcome to Baltimore, Omar Narváez



#15 BSLBenPalmer

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Posted 21 October 2022 - 04:32 PM

Another potential backup catcher option - Jacob Nottingham

 

Not much to speak of in the batting average department but a solid fielder, has some good power, and has some good speed for a catcher. The guy had 15 HRs and 12 SBs in Triple-A last year in 89 games.

 

I could also see them snagging one of those veteran free agent catchers who's serviceable when Adley needs a day off. Both Barnhart and Hedges make sense. The great and almighty Willians Astudillo is also out there (only half kidding)


@benjpalmer

#16 dude

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Posted 22 October 2022 - 12:56 AM

..., but if they choose to move Francisco Alvarez (their top prospect) into the starters role, they could sign a different compliment (if they don't want Nido).  If they thought they could throw cash on McCann and get a useful prospect, then maybe he's an option.  I'd check in on it.

Upon a cursory glance at Baseball Savant data: welcome to Baltimore, Omar Narváez

 

...so I hadn't really looked at options to deliver my thought above (re: Mets), but I was thinking they need a LHed Venezuelan veteran on an affordable contract. 

 

...after looking him up, that is Narvaez.  

 

I don't think you have to do the country thing, but Narvaez has had a good bat (.728 career OPS) and is probably looking for more than a 1-year, part-time gig in Baltimore....but if the Mets wanted to compliment (caddy) Alvarez with Narvaez, that would make a lot of sense for them..of course, the Mets would need someone to play to take McCann.  I don't tihnk he'd be hard to move since they would be willing to eat money, but what if you did something like this...

 

Mets sign Narvaez to a 3/20 contract (2M s/b, 5M/year, 3M b/o on team options)

Mets trade McCann (+15M) and Parada to the Orioles for Kjerstad, Basallo and Leandro Arias

Orioles add a 1/6 deal to the back of McCann and flatten it to 3/30.  The Met's pay 10M in 2023 and 5M in 2024.



#17 dude

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Posted 30 October 2022 - 02:32 PM

Just in terms of tracking the obvious, Garcia waived off 40-man.    



#18 dude

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Posted 06 November 2022 - 05:20 PM

Continuing the theme of obvious moves, Bemboom was apparently waived.  The blurb noted that Bemboom had signed a split contract with the Orioles.

 

Did the Orioles run some type of development camp in October where they needed 40-man roster catchers to help out? 

 

There has to be a reason you fill out paperwork to use the 40 to fill out more paperwork to drop from the 40.



#19 dude

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Posted 06 November 2022 - 05:22 PM

Still holding Cam Gallagher (ARB1) and Mark Kolozsvary on the 40, for some reason.



#20 dude

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Posted 10 November 2022 - 12:05 AM

As we slowly grind to the predictable endstate of none of these guys being on the 40, Cam Gallagher chose MiL FA too.






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