573 replies to this topic

[weird-O]

I was looking into something and learned that Jackson Holliday was, and still is, considered a 5 tool player. Man, I remember when that was a rare find. If Holliday is a 5 tool player, who isn't?

[Mackus]

I was looking into something and learned that Jackson Holliday was, and still is, considered a 5 tool player. Man, I remember when that was a rare find. If Holliday is a 5 tool player, who isn't?

 

Well he's definitely got the two at the plate.  He's even got the 6th tool that should be on the list in plate discipline, which is his strongest offensive attribute.

 

The baserunning and defense were regarded as fine or better coming up.  Obviously both were really bad last year.  He's fast, so if you consider that tool to be speed instead of baserunning, then he has it.  But he's shown the worst instincts on the bases I've ever witnessed.  Bizarre. Defense he has not shown at the MLB level but was never really questioned by anybody at the minor league level.  Maybe some said he wouldn't be a good SS but nobody said he wouldn't be solid somewhere on the dirt.  Gotta hope the bad defense he's shown at 2B is just early struggles like he's had elsewhere.

 

He has never been regarded as having a strong arm as far as I recall. 

 

And one very big note, is that having all these tools as a prospect doesn't mean you can apply the tools and produce in the majors.

[BobPhelan]

I was looking into something and learned that Jackson Holliday was, and still is, considered a 5 tool player. Man, I remember when that was a rare find. If Holliday is a 5 tool player, who isn't?

 

I think 5 tool player can be a lazy way to say someone is a well rounded player.

[Slidemaster]

I think 5 tool player can be a lazy way to say someone is a well rounded player.

I'm not convinced he has any real major league tools.

[weird-O]

I'm not convinced he has any real major league tools.

I can be patient with his bat. I would prefer to see him focus on being a complete hitter. But he won't. Once he's acclimated to ML pitching, he'll start trying to go deep with every swing. That's just modern baseball. We know it's the Oriole way. As an infielder, speedy with no instinct for running the bases, is like pulling out of your parking space, putting on a blindfold, and flooring it. The arm and glove are what they are. And neither should qualify as a specialty for him.  

[Slidemaster]

I can be patient with his bat. I would prefer to see him focus on being a complete hitter. But he won't. Once he's acclimated to ML pitching, he'll start trying to go deep with every swing. That's just modern baseball. We know it's the Oriole way. As an infielder, speedy with no instinct for running the bases, is like pulling out of your parking space, putting on a blindfold, and flooring it. The arm and glove are what they are. And neither should qualify as a specialty for him.

It really makes me wonder what about him was worthy of being a top pick. We're all these deficiencies just a surprise?

[TwentyThirtyFive]

It really makes me wonder what about him was worthy of being a top pick. We're all these deficiencies just a surprise?

Lol. Again, its not clear why he was #1 while guys like Dru Jines and Temarr Johnson languish in the minors. While he cruised,made it to #1 and MLB by age 20. You are a goof.

[Slidemaster]

Lol. Again, its not clear why he was #1 while guys like Dru Jines and Temarr Johnson languish in the minors. While he cruised,made it to #1 and MLB by age 20. You are a goof.

He should never have been in the majors by 20. He was historically bad.

[TwentyThirtyFive]

He should never have been in the majors by 20. He was historically bad.

Lol. Hindsight. He made it to the majors at 20 because he absolutely cruised through the minors and was ranked the #1 player. Anybody at the time, or now, who says he didnt or doesnt have as high an upside as a typical #1 prospect I respect that take. I do and have always agreed with that assessment. But the facts are he cruised through the minors and was the consensus top prospect in baseball. To act like he didnt earn any of it or a promotion to MLB is such a stupid take.

[Mike B]

I still think Holliday will improve considerably if he can get healthy.

He is still very young and has plenty of time to grow.  

[weird-O]

It really makes me wonder what about him was worthy of being a top pick. We're all these deficiencies just a surprise?

From what little I know about the the draft, it seems like he was the clear #1. So far the results of the other early picks support that. Unfortunately, I think it was just a bland draft class. But again, I'm no expert. I don't think his deficiencies were a surprise. At least I hope not. What kind of scout looks at his glove and says, it's pure gold. I guess the thinking was, the bat will make up for it.

[Mackus]

From what little I know about the the draft, it seems like he was the clear #1. So far the results of the other early picks support that. Unfortunately, I think it was just a bland draft class. But again, I'm no expert. I don't think his deficiencies were a surprise. At least I hope not. What kind of scout looks at his glove and says, it's pure gold. I guess the thinking was, the bat will make up for it.

He wasn't the clear number 1 but was on the very short list. There wasn't a consensus that year. I think most here would've been happy with any of the top high school bats that year, and only unhappy with a signability college pick. Holliday has been the best of the bunch of those in real consideration. That's a strong point against tanking, in MLB the #1 pick or any high pick just isn't enough of a sure thing to be worth sacrificing MLB wins. And even if it were, one player doesn't have nearly the impact as an NBA star or an NFL QB.

[Mike B]

He wasn't the clear number 1 but was on the very short list. There wasn't a consensus that year. I think most here would've been happy with any of the top high school bats that year, and only unhappy with a signability college pick. Holliday has been the best of the bunch of those in real consideration. That's a strong point against tanking, in MLB the #1 pick or any high pick just isn't enough of a sure thing to be worth sacrificing MLB wins. And even if it were, one player doesn't have nearly the impact as an NBA star or an NFL QB.

Good post.  I am hoping that the tanking phase is starting to run its course. There have been a few situations where it has worked but seemingly more often than not, it delivers mediocre results.  These teams continue to charge major league prices while trotting out at best AAAA product.  I think it often damages the franchise.

The return the Orioles have gotten so far for 3 to 4 years of trying not to win has been disappointing.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Back at AA starting his rehab assignment.  Fingers crossed this goes better.