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2022 Game 78: 7/1 @ Minnesota 8:10PM


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#1 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 08:54 AM

Spenser Watkins vs Joe Ryan



#2 Mackus

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 09:00 AM

This will be Spenser Watkins 10th start this year.  Another 7 starts to Brian Baker, Austin Voth, Chris Ellis and Denyi Reyes.  And we're not even halfway done.  Good planning!


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#3 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 09:13 AM

Watkins has reasonably done his job. 

The rotation is missing Means, and Rodriguez.   Hard to account for that. 

Baumann, Lowther imploding sucks.  Alex Wells also hurt.  Zimmermann, that was about what you expected. 
You weren't counting on any of them, but it was reasonable to think they'd get starts. 

 

You've got Lyles doing what you'd expect.
You've got T. Wells, Kremer exceeding what you'd expect, but taking advantage of the opportunity they have.

Despite Watkins reasonably doing his job, him getting this many starts definitely is disappointing. 
So is having to utilize Voth as a starter 3x already. 
Some of us wanted a '2nd' Lyles.  That would be nice right now.  (Zach Davies was certainly available for example.)

 

They aren't going to get through the year as is.
I think there is a decent argument that even though they aren't a '22 contender, they should be looking to go trade for someone they want to be part of their '23 rotation now. 


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#4 Mackus

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 09:59 AM

The rotation is missing Means, and Rodriguez.   Hard to account for that.

 

Its very easy to anticipate injuries to SP.  You don't know who or when, but you know that you'll get some.  Especially with a very fragile guy like Means as the only real SP in your rotation.  At least one more real SP should have been here to help in case of injury or poor performance.  



#5 BaltBird 24

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 11:43 AM

You're crying, but Matt Harvey is knocking on the door.

#6 BobPhelan

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 12:32 PM

You're crying, but Matt Harvey is knocking on the door.


He’s got a guy for that.
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#7 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 12:37 PM

Its very easy to anticipate injuries to SP.  You don't know who or when, but you know that you'll get some.  Especially with a very fragile guy like Means as the only real SP in your rotation.  At least one more real SP should have been here to help in case of injury or poor performance.  

 

100% agree that you have to anticipate injuries, and have to have a stable of guys beyond your initial 5 to get through a year. 

Just stating the obvious. You lose Means and Rodriguez; there's going to be corresponding impact. 

And you're point is obvious and correct too.  You are going to lose guys, so you better have depth, and they didn't have enough.


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#8 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 12:45 PM

They didn't only not have "enough" - they didn't have any. You can't count the "depth" we do have as actual "depth". Replacement level or worse players aren't depth, they're humans with a pulse.


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#9 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 12:56 PM

They didn't only not have "enough" - they didn't have any. You can't count the "depth" we do have as actual "depth". Replacement level or worse players aren't depth, they're humans with a pulse.


Zimmermann was in the opening rotation, and Akin in the bullpen so let's not count them. 
They had Kremer, Bradish, Rodriguez, Baumann, Lowther, A. Wells, Ellis, Kevin Smith, Brnovich, Hall as possible additional starting depth. 

Now to your point, totally agree...  lots of replacement or worse. 

But not totally unreasonable at all that they wanted to make sure they gave looks to Kremer, Baumann, Lowther, A. Wells, in this season vs. signing a 2nd version of Lyles...   but...  I also thought they needed at-least one additional 'Lyles'. 

 

As I said above, good argument imo for utilizing some of the existing depth and going to target a pitcher via trade that they want to be part of the '23 rotation.   Pretty clearly not getting through the year with Watkins and Voth in the rotation. 



#10 Mackus

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 01:00 PM

But not totally unreasonable at all that they wanted to make sure they gave looks to Kremer, Baumann, Lowther, A. Wells, in this season vs. signing a 2nd version of Lyles...   but...  I also thought they needed at-least one additional 'Lyles'. 

 

I think it was totally unreasonable.  Or rather, the only reason is that they didn't want to spend the money (which I think we'll all agree is a BS reason, so still perhaps counts as unreasonable).  They could still give looks to any or all of those guys with a second Lyles or better.



#11 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 01:02 PM

I think it was totally unreasonable.  Or rather, the only reason is that they didn't want to spend the money (which I think we'll all agree is a BS reason, so still perhaps counts as unreasonable).  They could still give looks to any or all of those guys with a second Lyles or better.


It's 100% totally unreasonable if it happens again.  They've got enough of a surrounding team now...  they have to try at-least some. 

 

I should also say, I'm kind of the opinion it's not acceptable if they don't go and try and add someone now. 
With the implosion of some of their 'depth' they don't have arms to even give opportunities to. 

But yeah... like everyone else, I'm expecting Matt Harvey. 



#12 Mike B

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 01:09 PM

Matt Harvey on the active roster on July 8th.


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#13 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 02:18 PM

Harvey is fine for the rest of this year.
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#14 Mackus

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 02:23 PM

Harvey is fine for the rest of this year.

 

No he isn't.  He is exactly the same as Watkins.  Freely available sub-replacement players.  If you have to use someone like that in an emergency its understandable.  To build a roster that relies on multiple such guys in key roles is dereliction of duty.  It's a major, major red flag for me in terms of my opinion of Elias' overall judgement that he thinks this is ok.  Not caring whether you win or lose, even though you know that you can't truly compete, is a problem for someone who's job it is to win.


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#15 russsnyder

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 07:25 PM

Despite the injury to Means and the disappointing performances from Baumann, Lowther, and Zimmerman this team has been competitive. The Orioles have their "second Lyles" in Harvey. Personally, I think he should have been suspended for the entire year as a result of his involvement in the Angel's scandal. (Selfishly, I'm glad he's able to come back this season.)

I get the criticism of Elias for not signing another starter or two. However, an impact starter was not coming here this season. The team has been bad and OPACY has been historically tough on pitchers.

Elias has put together an interesting young team and I think pushing back the left field fence will make Baltimore a more attractive landing spot for free agent pitching this off season.

Anyway, hopefully Watkins can give the Orioles five good innings tomorrow night.
<p>"F IT!, Let's hit." Ted Williams

#16 Mackus

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Posted 30 June 2022 - 08:25 PM

Harvey is not a second Lyles, even though that's a really low bar. He's a second (or third or fourth) Watkins.
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#17 Mike B

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Posted 01 July 2022 - 12:13 PM

Lyles is better than Harvey, but the need from both is the same.  Eat innings, so the young arms do not get over taxed.  

 

There were a number of guys they could have signed thast would have been better than Harvey without the baggage.  That said, at this point they need him.


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#18 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 01 July 2022 - 07:31 PM

2 on, 1 out for Minnesota in the 1st.

#19 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 01 July 2022 - 07:33 PM

Bases loaded. Watkins already at 23 pitches.

#20 Mike B

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Posted 01 July 2022 - 07:35 PM

Bases loaded. Watkins already at 23 pitches.

He is about to put a heavy load on the pen.


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