79 replies to this topic

[BSLChrisStoner]

Shane Baz vs Dean Kremer

[NewMarketSean]

Shane Baz is just another one of these dime-a-dozen TB starters with a MiL 10.8 K/9 and 3.00 ERA in the minors.

 

We'd kill for one of these guys. TB has them lying around like spare change.

[makoman]

Shane Baz is just another one of these dime-a-dozen TB starters with a MiL 10.8 K/9 and 3.00 ERA in the minors.

 

We'd kill for one of these guys. TB has them lying around like spare change.

Don't we have two of them? If Hall just does what he's doing (and doesn't graduate) he'd be a top 10-20 prospect this time next year.

[NewMarketSean]

Don't we have two of them? If Hall just does what he's doing (and doesn't graduate) he'd be a top 10-20 prospect this time next year.

Next year. Always next year.

[Mackus]

Baz was a big-time prospect.  Early 1st round pick.  One of three huge pieces in the Chris Archer trade.  Profile continued to grow and grow.  Much like Rodriguez.  Nothing dime-a-dozen about him.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Kremer 10.9 k per 9 in the Minors. 3.72 era.

[NewMarketSean]

Kremer 10.9 k per 9 in the Minors. 3.72 era.

Baz is 23. Kremer is 26.5 and on his last chance with the Orioles.

[makoman]

Next year. Always next year.

Which year has Baz been good in the majors? Since that's all that matters apparently.

[Mackus]

Yeah with an all-time horrible season last year.

 

Using minor league stats as a primary way to identify a big prospect is a bad idea.  Bad stats exclude guys, but all the guys with any remote shot have good stats, so you have to rely more on scouting in hopes of distinguishing between guys who will be able to continue having success in MLB and those that won't.

 

Zac Lowther has a 3.26 ERA and 10.4 K/9, for example.  Baumann 3.14 and 9.  Akin 3.81 and 10.  Zimmerman 3.21 and 9.2.  

 

Age is also important.  Performing at a young age is much more impressive than similar performance at an older age.

[BSLChrisStoner]

Yeah with an all-time horrible season last year.

Yeah, that continued in the Minors... inflating that era. 

He's not a great prospect. He could possibly help. 

 

Yes, Tampa Bay has been great at developing arms and overall talent.  Great organization. 

 

In-terms of, "Next year, always next year...."    Yeah, would be great if the O's got something out of Kremer, Akin (have so far), Zimmermann, Baumann, Lowther, A. Wells, etc...  and Baumann and Lowther have particularly disappointed, and Krermer was a mess last year... but these weren't exactly key components of what you were doing. 

Rodriguez had a set-back.  Hall is on the verge of coming up.  

Other arms will be obtained via the org depth you are building, and with the additional payroll you have available....  

[NewMarketSean]

Which year has Baz been good in the majors? Since that's all that matters apparently.

3 starts last year with a 2 ERA and 12 K/9.

 

Kremer had 3 similar starts in 2020.

 

Just saying, Baz is younger. Kremer is on his last chance in Baltimore.

[NewMarketSean]

LOL at you guys getting mad because I am jealous of the Rays ability to produce pitchers. Like you guys aren't.

[Mackus]

LOL at you guys getting mad because I am jealous of the Rays ability to produce pithcers. Like you guys aren't.

 

I think we're just pointing out bad process.  Not a bad conclusion.  The Rays clearly have had a ton of success drafting, acquiring, and developing all sorts of young talent.  Very jealous.  And skeptical that the Orioles will be able to have similar success.

[BSLChrisStoner]

LOL at you guys getting mad because I am jealous of the Rays ability to produce pitchers. Like you guys aren't.

 

Not mad at you saying the obvious that TB has been great at drafting and development. They are an org to emulate and admire. 

[NewMarketSean]

Lowther may have been a COVID casualty. In 2019 he was 23 and pitching well. Since coming back in 2021 he's been awful. Missing 2020 didn't help.

[makoman]

LOL at you guys getting mad because I am jealous of the Rays ability to produce pitchers. Like you guys aren't.

Of course we all want to be like the Rays. It was just weird saying we'd kill for a guy like Baz when we have one and arguably we have two. And calling a top 10ish prospect dime a dozen, it's not like they have more than one of him. Of course they get top value out of so many of their guys...

 

I just wish Machado had been worth half as much as Archer.

[NewMarketSean]

Of course we all want to be like the Rays. It was just weird saying we'd kill for a guy like Baz when we have one and arguably we have two. And calling a top 10ish prospect dime a dozen, it's not like they have more than one of him. Of course they get top value out of so many of their guys...

 

I just wish Machado had been worth half as much as Archer.

We have two? Pitching in the majors currently? Who are they?

 

if it's GRod and Hall, that's not the same.

[BobPhelan]

Baz was a big-time prospect. Early 1st round pick. One of three huge pieces in the Chris Archer trade. Profile continued to grow and grow. Much like Rodriguez. Nothing dime-a-dozen about him.

Exactly. And every outlet had Rodriguez ahead of him.

Baz is a stud and the Rays are great at developing pitching. But it’s definitely not somebody who came out of nowhere.

[NewMarketSean]

Do I really need to go back through the last 4-5 years and compare the Orioles and Rays pitching prospects?

They have had more and probably will going forward. And sorry guys GRod doesn’t count until he makes MLB starts. Back problems are not something that tends to just go away and never come back so counting on GRod as some ace who will be here for years leading this rotation is premature. At least Baz is making starts in 2022. Somehow, some way, our best pitchers find themselves not pitching.

[makoman]

Baz is coming back from elbow surgery. Probably minor. But of course we will assume he will be just fine yet Grayson will have back issues for life.