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#21 russsnyder

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 01:32 PM

The US is more powerful than Russia by a decent margin. However, they're certainly powerful enough to keep us from wanting to actually go to war with them.

You're certainly right about how divided we are.

The one potential silver lining with this is that it's the type of thing that generally unites us. However, I am skeptical of our ability to unite right now, and there are plenty that would rather use this to be divisive, plus even some that would actually side with Russia.


The division in our country has contributed greatly to the weakness.

( A house divided and all that.)

The ones who may side with Russia are extremists and they can't ever be counted on. More importantly, I don't think this conflict hits close enough to home to unite the country at this point.
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#22 russsnyder

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 01:42 PM

I don't think there are any sanctions that could change Putin's ways. 2014's sanctions didn't produce any results, and ever since then he's been preparing the country to weather the next round. While the west can wall Russia off, there will always be countries who will need and buy their oil and natural gas.

I hope Putin isn't brazen, or crazy, enough to eventually try the same thing with the former Soviet Baltic states, who are NATO members. I would think if he wanted those countries back under his control he'd have tried to do it while 45 was in office, when the commitment to defending other NATO countries was on shakier ground.


I think the move Putin is making on Ukraine has to give the former Soviet Baltic States reason to be concerned.

None of these countries has their own nuclear capabilities and Putin has indirectly threatened to use nukes.

His threatening to go into a NATO affiliated country brings the threat of nuclear war closer to the table. I would not put it past him at this point in time.
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#23 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 01:59 PM

The United States is not doing this alone, Biden said, adding that the 27 EU members and G7 members will participate in these sanctions.

Here are the sanctions he announced:

  1. Limit Russia's ability to do business in dollars, euros, pounds and yen to be part of the global economy.
  2. Stop the ability to finance and grow the Russian military.
  3. Impair their ability to compete in high-tech 21st century economy.
  4. US sanctioned Russian banks that together hold around $1 trillion in assets.

He added, "we're also blocking four more major banks. That means every asset they have in America will be frozen."


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#24 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:11 PM

So what would Russia have to do exactly to revoke SWIFT? 



#25 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:15 PM

So what would Russia have to do exactly to revoke SWIFT? 

 

Occupy or try and annex all of the Ukraine.... maybe.   
Invade current NATO partners and former Warsaw Pact members.

 

 

SWIFT adheres to Belgian and European law, not U.S. law, so it "doesn't actually have to listen to the United States."

 

https://www.rferl.or...n/31601868.html



#26 Old Man

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:18 PM

I suspect this is just a starting block of a series of calculated moves that Russia has planned.

 

I dont trust every country to claim to be in agreement with the sanctions, and not deal with the Russians in a back door, under the table, wink wink deal.



#27 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:19 PM

Occupy or try and annex all of the Ukraine.... maybe.   
Invade current NATO partners and former Warsaw Pact members.

So essentially, it's the nuclear option. And he knows it. SWIFT would slow Russia's economy by 5%, which on top of all the other sanctions, and attacks at his inner circle, would be devastating for Russian's. 

 

And yet polling a week ago showed 50% of Russia supported an invasion. 



#28 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:25 PM

So essentially, it's the nuclear option. And he knows it. SWIFT would slow Russia's economy by 5%, which on top of all the other sanctions, and attacks at his inner circle, would be devastating for Russian's. 

 

And yet polling a week ago showed 50% of Russia supported an invasion. 


State television telling them what to support.   Not a lot of differing view points for the Russian people to take in...  but there was some protesting today (quickly erased by the Police / Gov't).  

When the already rough Russian economy gets further impacted here....  maybe the public will begin to question what is going on. 

Of course, the public is also rightfully scared of protesting... so probably not. 



#29 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 02:29 PM


State television telling them what to support.   Not a lot of differing view points for the Russian people to take in...  but there was some protesting today (quickly erased by the Police / Gov't).  

When the already rough Russian economy gets further impacted here....  maybe the public will begin to question what is going on. 

Of course, the public is also rightfully scared of protesting... so probably not. 

Not sure how it works in other countries, but I definitely feel like social media algorithms and echo chambers can definitely be weaponized in the worst kind of way by dictators like Putin. We've already seen it here, which led to 1/6. 



#30 Mark Carver

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Posted 24 February 2022 - 05:00 PM

Lets go back to 1991 with the breakup of the Soviet Union. Ukraine inherited nearly 9,000 nuclear missiles and ranked 3rd in the world. Ukraine decided to give up the missiles with security assurances from the UK, US and Russia!

 

Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances

 

https://en.wikipedia...rity_Assurances

 

 

Ukraine's regret over nuclear disarmament as Russia 'glibly violates' agreement
 

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#31 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 07:40 AM

Hard to see Kyiv not falling in the next couple of days.

Then a guerrilla war? The biggest damage to Russian forces will be if they try and occupy.

#32 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 07:41 AM

German lawmakers calling to remove Russia from SWIFT.
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#33 DuffMan

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:14 AM

German lawmakers calling to remove Russia from SWIFT.

They were one of the one's hesitant to be on board with that, so them being in favor of it is a good sign.



#34 DuffMan

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:16 AM

A buddy of mine shared this in our group chat and I thought it was pretty good.

 

 

5k9eq9.jpg


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#35 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:24 AM

Hard to see Kyiv not falling in the next couple of days.

Then a guerrilla war? The biggest damage to Russian forces will be if they try and occupy.

Looking to split the country. Literally. They wont try to take western Ukraine.

#36 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:32 AM


Looking to split the country. Literally. They wont try to take western Ukraine.

Saw this from a tweet who said he got it from Ukraine intellegence. Makes sense. Putin wants to take Kiev, remove the leadership, set up a puppet regime and get out. At least for now.
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#37 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:35 AM

So what is all this neonazi talk out of Ukraine? I know Putin is a master liar, but where does this come from?

#38 Old Man

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 08:56 AM

So what is all this neonazi talk out of Ukraine? I know Putin is a master liar, but where does this come from?

I believe if you read enough google articles, you get a sense that Putin has paid for neonazi extremists to get into Ukraine and cause problems, probably around 2015.



#39 JeremyStrain

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 09:16 AM

So what is all this neonazi talk out of Ukraine? I know Putin is a master liar, but where does this come from?


Some serious irony considering Russia is one of the most racist countries in the world.


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#40 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 25 February 2022 - 09:39 AM

So what is all this neonazi talk out of Ukraine? I know Putin is a master liar, but where does this come from?


Just utter nonsense, that I guess he is able to sell to some. Zelenskyy is Jewish for Pete's sake. 






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