5723 replies to this topic

[Steve55]

Is there another Jimmy Haslem type owner in the NFL .? If Joe Burrow was available I could see several owners offering full guaranteed deals. Jackson right now isn't Burrow. Jackson also has to agree to a contract for a trade to happen. What if no team gives him the deal he wants. Does he back off his fully guaranteed contract talk .?

 

He is still under contract until the league year begins. If the Raven reach an impasse in contract talks they will then reach out to other teams for the best deal. Then its up to Jackson to reach a contract agreement. If he can't then it will go around the league about how difficult he will be to deal with. Does he really want that.

[CantonJester]

Is there another Jimmy Haslem type owner in the NFL .? If Joe Burrow was available I could see several owners offering full guaranteed deals. Jackson right now isn't Burrow. Jackson also has to agree to a contract for a trade to happen. What if no team gives him the deal he wants. Does he back off his fully guaranteed contract talk .?

 

He is still under contract until the league year begins. If the Raven reach an impasse in contract talks they will then reach out to other teams for the best deal. Then its up to Jackson to reach a contract agreement. If he can't then it will go around the league about how difficult he will be to deal with. Does he really want that.

 

Not sure I agree with that. The owners do not want to normalize guaranteed contracts. That’s a step way too far for the other 31: it should be a concession at the bargaining table. 

[Slidemaster]

Is there another Jimmy Haslem type owner in the NFL .? If Joe Burrow was available I could see several owners offering full guaranteed deals. Jackson right now isn't Burrow. Jackson also has to agree to a contract for a trade to happen. What if no team gives him the deal he wants. Does he back off his fully guaranteed contract talk .?

He is still under contract until the league year begins. If the Raven reach an impasse in contract talks they will then reach out to other teams for the best deal. Then its up to Jackson to reach a contract agreement. If he can't then it will go around the league about how difficult he will be to deal with. Does he really want that.

The Jets would literally give him whatever he wants. No doubt about it in my mind.

[Mackus]

Jackson also has to agree to a contract for a trade to happen. 

 

Doesn't have to.  The Ravens could give him permission to seek a deal and trade (that's what the Texans did with Watson) but they don't have to (the Seahawks didn't with Wilson).  

 

I don't think he's allowed to talk with other teams if he's got the exclusive tag, even before he tenders it.  I think if the Ravens allow him to talk to other teams, it'll be a strong sign that they can't sign him and are going to trade him.

[PrimeTime]

Doesn't have to.  The Ravens could give him permission to seek a deal and trade (that's what the Texans did with Watson) but they don't have to (the Seahawks didn't with Wilson).  

 

I don't think he's allowed to talk with other teams if he's got the exclusive tag, even before he tenders it.  I think if the Ravens allow him to talk to other teams, it'll be a strong sign that they can't sign him and are going to trade him.

 

Is there any kind of "legal tampering" for tagged players, like there is in free agency? 

[Mackus]

Is there any kind of "legal tampering" for tagged players, like there is in free agency? 

 

I don't know and can't find details anywhere.  Exclusive tag is used very infrequently so hard to find examples.

 

My guess would be that Lamar and other teams cannot talk once he signs the sheet.  I'm less confident in that before he actually signs the tender, but still think its more likely than not that he is not allowed to talk with other teams if the Ravens have slapped the exclusive tag on him.

[PrimeTime]

I don't know and can't find details anywhere.  Exclusive tag is used very infrequently so hard to find examples.

 

My guess would be that Lamar and other teams cannot talk once he signs the sheet.  I'm less confident in that before he actually signs the tender, but still think its more likely than not that he is not allowed to talk with other teams if the Ravens have slapped the exclusive tag on him.

 

Such a prickly situation all the way around.

 

When we've used the tag in the past, it was for lesser pair players and they were just about always able to reach a long term deal and remove the tag. I believe Chris McAllister was the only one that played a season on the tag. 

[SouthRider]

What if the best trade offer comes from the Texans but Lamar doesn't want to go there?  What if Lamar tells the Ravens privately, "I only want to be traded to the Jets."?  Could the Jets then get wind of this and offer less in trade?  Seems to me that Lamar must be onboard with whatever team he gets traded to giving him a de-facto no-trade clause.  Am I missing something?    

[Mackus]

What if the best trade offer comes from the Texans but Lamar doesn't want to go there?  What if Lamar tells the Ravens privately, "I only want to be traded to the Jets."?  Could the Jets then get wind of this and offer less in trade?  Seems to me that Lamar must be onboard with whatever team he gets traded to giving him a de-facto no-trade clause.  Am I missing something?    

 

The Ravens can approach a trade two ways, either allowing him to seek a deal beforehand or telling teams that they won't allow that and it'll be on them to work out a deal after a trade is commenced.  There are plusses and minuses to each approach.

 

Allowing Lamar to seek a deal could entice a team to be willing to give up more since they know they're then locking him in.  On the other hand, it could reduce the overall return by effectively reducing the number of suitors from all the teams that want Lamar down to only the teams that Lamar wants to go to.

 

I think they would just deal him for the package they like best and let the new team work out the deal, but they could go either way. 

[Mackus]

Such a prickly situation all the way around.

 

When we've used the tag in the past, it was for lesser pair players and they were just about always able to reach a long term deal and remove the tag. I believe Chris McAllister was the only one that played a season on the tag. 

 

Wally Williams and Suggs also played on the tag.  Ngata, Rice, and Tucker all signed extensions after being tagged.

[bmore_ken]

What if the best trade offer comes from the Texans but Lamar doesn't want to go there?  What if Lamar tells the Ravens privately, "I only want to be traded to the Jets."?  Could the Jets then get wind of this and offer less in trade?  Seems to me that Lamar must be onboard with whatever team he gets traded to giving him a de-facto no-trade clause.  Am I missing something?    

The bottom line is all comes down to his contract. No team is trading for  him without a deal in place. Lamar is his own agent. 

[Mackus]

The bottom line is all comes down to his contract. No team is trading for him without a deal in place. Lamar is his own agent.

I think he can be traded without a deal in place beforehand. I'd rank that as slightly more likely than the alternative option of a deal being agreed upon before a trade is commenced.

[Steve55]

Doesn't have to.  The Ravens could give him permission to seek a deal and trade (that's what the Texans did with Watson) but they don't have to (the Seahawks didn't with Wilson).  

 

I don't think he's allowed to talk with other teams if he's got the exclusive tag, even before he tenders it.  I think if the Ravens allow him to talk to other teams, it'll be a strong sign that they can't sign him and are going to trade him.

 

 

Wilson had a contract, Jacson doesn't when the new league year starts.

[Steve55]

I think he can be traded without a deal in place beforehand. I'd rank that as slightly more likely than the alternative option of a deal being agreed upon before a trade is commenced.

 

 

He has to sign the tag 1st. 

[PrimeTime]

Wally Williams and Suggs also played on the tag.  Ngata, Rice, and Tucker all signed extensions after being tagged.

 

Nice pull. I forgot about Wally Williams. That was back in the infancy of the franchise tag. 

 

With Suggs, I remember that we tagged him prior to the 2009 season but then agreed to a long term deal. However, that was the 2nd season in which we tagged him. 

[Mackus]

He has to sign the tag 1st. 

 

Right, Lamar has to sign the tag in order to be traded.  I suppose he could refuse to sign it as some sort of leverage play to try and force the Ravens to trade him.

 

I'm unsure of if he's allowed to talk with other teams about potential contracts at the point when he's been tagged but hasn't signed it. I doubt he is, but not certain of that.

[Ravens2006]

Pretty sure you can't (technically / legally) negotiate anything with anyone else once tagged.  He doesn't have to sign it, but he won't get any money that way either.  Leveon Bell missed a whole year refusing to sign the franchise tag, so he made zero dollars that season.  It's rare but possible.  For a QB, I think the exclusive tag number is looking like 45 million.  That's a lot of money to leave on the table.

[Mashed Potatoes]

This whole thread makes me sad 😢. I want it to be over one way or the other, hopefully with the Lamar staying way.

[cprenegade]

I think if I were the Ravens, I would be working very, very hard to gauge how serious the interest is out there in Lamar Jackson.  If I was a GM for another team, there are three red flags that pop up to me:

 

  1.  By almost every standard he is a slightly above average passer, not an elite one.  His career completion pct. is 63.7%.  In today's NFL that is not great.  His downfield accuracy is inconsistent.  He is a bit slow by comparison to read through his progressions.   

 

  2.  Two years in a row his season has ended early because of injury.  One year might be a fluke, two years starts to look more like a trend.  He has missed 25% of time over the last 2 years.  

 

  3.  He has only played in a custom system built intentionally for him.  There is no proof he can be as dynamic in a system that is not built for him.  There is no data to analyze on that since every snap he has taken has been in his own unique custom system.

 

Obviously the upside is a guy who is a wildly dynamic playmaker, especially when he runs around in the pocket or takes off and gets into the secondary.  

 

So, the point is, there may not be a huge market of teams willing to not only spend $50 million per year, but also give up 3 #1 picks and perhaps multiple 2's or 3's.  If I pay Lamar, now I have to re-design my team to customize my offense for him, without any top draft picks, and a QB with a top salary, or I have to take a leap of faith on whether he can be successful in another type of system.  And I have to hope he can stay healthy and he doesn't lose a step.  

 

The Ravens are the only team that can get away with having to spend the $50 million per year and still have their picks intact.  I'm just not sure it's worth the price for any team to trade away their draft future and have to pony up a potential record breaking contract as well.  But, P.T. Barnum had a famous saying that might apply.  If the Raven's can find that team, I would do it and move on.  It might mean a year or two of re-tooling the offense, and finding the next QB, but with the cap space and extra high draft picks, a good GM should be able to build a pretty good contender.  

[Steve55]

Will Lamar negotiate now that the Ravens season is over or will he drag it out and wait for the new league year. Any coordinator hire is hingeing on him being on the team or not. Which may force them into promoting from within. Who's going to want to sign up here not knowing if you are creating an offense for Lamar Jackson or Tyler Huntley.