62 replies to this topic

[russsnyder]

A lot of the answer here is that MLB is ever trying to capture more of the "casual" fan market. They know they don't have to cater to the hardcore fans that support them, cause they are borderline addicts, and are coming back no matter how many times they threaten they aren't. (Yep, I'm sure a few people here can raise their hands there)

It's the fans that AREN'T watching that they want to get to watch, and to reach them, they have to do things different, because there is some current reason why they aren't going now. The most common answer there is the length of games...so that one gets talked about pretty much every year.

I was trying to find the data on how many actual innings were played in 2019 vs how many should be played if there were no extra innings, but didn't have much luck. That would at least lend some data to the arguments about the extra wear and tear on players and the messed up roster rules.

I dunno, 162 games is a little insane to me, especially since they are double the next closest sports basically. I don't have a problem capping them at 9 if you're going to play that many.

I just don't think extra inning games are that much of an issue. Putting the runner on second to begin an inning is an extreme shift from the way that very same game was played for nine innings.

MLB has been trying to speed up games for years. It's a slow paced game that is an acquired taste. I just don't see how this rule adds any value to the game or the experience of watching it. It's a cheap shortcut IMO.

I agree that 162 games are probably too many. However, since baseball is such a numbers oriented game, I doubt this changes.

[russsnyder]

The 7 inning DHs do not induce the blood-boiling ire that the runner on 2nd rule does for me, but I still would prefer that it didn’t exist either.

Bottom line is Manfred hates baseball and is slowly killing it.

I don't see the compelling reason for seven inning DH's. Quite frankly, there are no scheduled doubleheaders because of the collective bargaining agreement. They are essentially shaving innings off of two games because of a rainout. It really makes no sense.

I don't think Manfred hates baseball, but I don't think he loves it. His legislation of baseball strategy ( three batter rule) is proof of that IMO. He may be worse than Bud Selig, and that's saying something.

[weird-O]

I just don't think extra inning games are that much of an issue. Putting the runner on second to begin an inning is an extreme shift from the way that very same game was played for nine innings.

MLB has been trying to speed up games for years. It's a slow paced game that is an acquired taste. I just don't see how this rule adds any value to the game or the experience of watching it. It's a cheap shortcut IMO.

I agree that 162 games are probably too many. However, since baseball is such a numbers oriented game, I doubt this changes.

If by "numbers oriented" you mean $$$, you're right. The owners/league aren't going to accept a shorter season, because that equals absolute lost revenue. However, if by "numbers Oriented" you mean stats, the league doesn't care about that, because that's only of value to the players. Putting a runner of 2B isn't an issue for the league, because the owners' revenue isn't determined by their ERA or OPS.  

[Mackus]

I don't see the compelling reason for seven inning DH's. Quite frankly, there are no scheduled doubleheaders because of the collective bargaining agreement. They are essentially shaving innings off of two games because of a rainout. It really makes no sense.

I don't think Manfred hates baseball, but I don't think he loves it. His legislation of baseball strategy ( three batter rule) is proof of that IMO. He may be worse than Bud Selig, and that's saying something.

 

I thought they could justify it last year.  It was a compressed season that was getting more and more compressed with so many postponements due to team outbreaks, leading to a very high number of doubleheaders for being only 2 months.

 

As a permanent mode of operation I hate it.

[russsnyder]

I thought they could justify it last year.  It was a compressed season that was getting more and more compressed with so many postponements due to team outbreaks, leading to a very high number of doubleheaders for being only 2 months.

 

As a permanent mode of operation I hate it.

 

 I'll grant you last year for the reasons you posted.

[russsnyder]

If by "numbers oriented" you mean $$$, you're right. The owners/league aren't going to accept a shorter season, because that equals absolute lost revenue. However, if by "numbers Oriented" you mean stats, the league doesn't care about that, because that's only of value to the players. Putting a runner of 2B isn't an issue for the league, because the owners' revenue isn't determined by their ERA or OPS.  

 

  I was referring to both.

 

  Excellent point about the bottom line.

[SBTarheel]

As I said, I do like the runner on second, and don't care either way abut the doubleheaders...I would have preferred the universal DH and the expanded playoffs too, not sure why they didn't go "all in" with the changes, at least until the new CBA. 

 

But I realize I'm in the minority here. 

[Russ]

I agree with everything Seth just said.

[mweb08]

Nobody in the history of baseball has ever been watching a game that has gotten to the 15th or 18th or 21st inning and thought, "man I wish they would have given each offense a free advantage so this game would've ended in the 10th".

I mean in fairness, that's because a significant amount of people didn't make it to the 15th or 18th or 21st inning.

[mweb08]

I honestly don't care much about this rule. I'm good either way.

[SBTarheel]

I honestly don't care much about this rule. I'm good either way.

 

I'll watch and love Baseball no matter what, but I'm the dorkiest of Baseball dorks there is, so.... 

[russsnyder]

I mean in fairness, that's because a significant amount of people didn't make it to the 15th or 18th or 21st inning.

 

  That's a very fair point.

 

  The fans start piling out once the game goes into extras.

 

  As an aside, the first game I ever attended in my life was an 18 inning, five hour and 27 minute affair.

 

  I was really young ( four years old), went to the game on the 22 bus with my two older brothers, and stayed 

 

  until the very end. The only three people from our neighborhood group were my two older brothers and myself at       the   end.

 

  The Orioles beat the Red Sox 3-2 on a broken bat single by Brooks in the bottom of the eighteenth.

 

  I'm not going to say that I didn't want to leave, but my oldest brother didn't want to, and he bought me some popcorn

 

  and soda to keep me going. I guess this is why I like extra inning games.

[weird-O]

As I said, I do like the runner on second, and don't care either way abut the doubleheaders...I would have preferred the universal DH and the expanded playoffs too, not sure why they didn't go "all in" with the changes, at least until the new CBA. 

 

But I realize I'm in the minority here. 

I've mentioned this before, but I'll repeat it here. I have no problem with the NL wanting to stick to not using a DH. But it's disingenuous for those teams to use a DH when playing in AL ballparks. I think they should stand by their conviction that their "purer" version of the game is the superior version, and refuse the DH all together. They have that choice. Teams are not compelled, by any rule, to use the DH. 

 

I one held a very strong opinion about limiting the number of teams that can make it to the post season. I'm softening on that now.   

[jamesdean]

  That's a very fair point.

 

  The fans start piling out once the game goes into extras.

 

  As an aside, the first game I ever attended in my life was an 18 inning, five hour and 27 minute affair.

 

  I was really young ( four years old), went to the game on the 22 bus with my two older brothers, and stayed 

 

  until the very end. The only three people from our neighborhood group were my two older brothers and myself at       the   end.

 

  The Orioles beat the Red Sox 3-2 on a broken bat single by Brooks in the bottom of the eighteenth.

 

  I'm not going to say that I didn't want to leave, but my oldest brother didn't want to, and he bought me some popcorn

 

  and soda to keep me going. I guess this is why I like extra inning games.

That was the year of the pitcher, 1968, right?  Doesn't surprise me.  Trying to hit that year was beyond futile. 

[russsnyder]

That was the year of the pitcher, 1968, right? Doesn't surprise me. Trying to hit that year was beyond futile.

It was 1968.

I remember the homer Yaz hit that day.

I remember Brooks'hit. ( Mainly because I could finally go home.)

I looked at the box score and there were 11 pitchers from both teams used that night.

The late 60's definitely favored the pitchers. Gibson's microscopic ERA, McClain winning over 30 games, etc. What really stands out in my mind is the picture ( I guess 1966) of Koufax pitching in Dodger stadium. He looks like he is throwing from the top off a mountain.

[SBTarheel]

I've mentioned this before, but I'll repeat it here. I have no problem with the NL wanting to stick to not using a DH. But it's disingenuous for those teams to use a DH when playing in AL ballparks. I think they should stand by their conviction that their "purer" version of the game is the superior version, and refuse the DH all together. They have that choice. Teams are not compelled, by any rule, to use the DH. 

 

I one held a very strong opinion about limiting the number of teams that can make it to the post season. I'm softening on that now.   

The playoffs were fun last season, plus more important games in September is never a bad thing. 

[jamesdean]

It was 1968.

I remember the homer Yaz hit that day.

I remember Brooks'hit. ( Mainly because I could finally go home.)

I looked at the box score and there were 11 pitchers from both teams used that night.

The late 60's definitely favored the pitchers. Gibson's microscopic ERA, McClain winning over 30 games, etc. What really stands out in my mind is the picture ( I guess 1966) of Koufax pitching in Dodger stadium. He looks like he is throwing from the top off a mountain.

They called 1968, "the revenge of 1930" which was the year offense was so overwhelming that the Phillies had a team E.R.A. of almost 7.00, lost 102 games, while hitting .315 and almost scoring a thousand runs. (LOL)  But it was pretty ridiculous how dominant pitching was in '68.  The Yankees didn't even hit .220 as a team and the Orioles came in at .225, despite winning 91.  They lowered the mound before the 1969 season unfolded and then with expansion, created much more offense.  Actually, I think that season was maybe the most perfectly balanced year for baseball. There still was excellent pitching throughout both leagues but some great offensive numbers too. On a side note, that's amazing you remember that much being only four years old.  

[russsnyder]

They called 1968, "the revenge of 1930" which was the year offense was so overwhelming that the Phillies had a team E.R.A. of almost 7.00, lost 102 games, while hitting .315 and almost scoring a thousand runs. (LOL) But it was pretty ridiculous how dominant pitching was in '68. The Yankees didn't even hit .220 as a team and the Orioles came in at .225, despite winning 91. They lowered the mound before the 1969 season unfolded and then with expansion, created much more offense. Actually, I think that season was maybe the most perfectly balanced year for baseball. There still was excellent pitching throughout both leagues but some great offensive numbers too. On a side note, that's amazing you remember that much being only four years old.

It's one of my first memories.

We sat in the general admission section on the first base side in the lower deck. The view was obstructed by the concrete poles.

It was a pretty exciting time because it was my first bus ride and ball game. Probably a lot of build up to it and the game was memorable. My brothers and I still talk about it from time to time.

[Mike in STL]

As I said, I do like the runner on second, and don't care either way abut the doubleheaders...I would have preferred the universal DH and the expanded playoffs too, not sure why they didn't go "all in" with the changes, at least until the new CBA.

But I realize I'm in the minority here.

Curious why you like the runner on second rule?

[BobPhelan]

Curious why you like the runner on second rule?

Adds excitement (speaking for myself). Have to admit I like it better when it’s in a game that doesn’t involve the Orioles but still.