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Adley Rutschman


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#761 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 08:24 AM

He's got to be playing hurt, right?  A hitting slump is one thing, but not being able to throw the ball all the way to second is kind of concerning.



#762 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 09:04 AM

He's got to be playing hurt, right?  A hitting slump is one thing, but not being able to throw the ball all the way to second is kind of concerning.


The throwing is not new.  It's not a matter of arm strength (he's got a plus arm), but errant throws (short hop, offline) are something he's done regularly since coming up.

If he was hurting, but could physically bat...  I think they'd be limiting his time behind the plate even more than they are.

All catchers are definitely banged up by this time in the year though, so I'm sure he isn't feeling great.
We also heard about the sore back not to long ago.



#763 BaltBird 24

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 09:09 AM

Yeah, this isn't a new issue with Adley. Maybe it's mechanical? We were speculating an injury last year when he was spiking his throws into the dirt.

#764 dude

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 10:01 AM

I think he’s probably banged up and will quietly have some kind of minor surgery in the offseason, or just plain old rest, and be fine next year.

 

We aren't going to really know because I'm sure there's layers to it, but your physical and mental components are related (I'm not talking about actual physical injury).  Was going to put this in Chris's article/thread because I think all of these things (the other challenges of performance across this team) are probably related.

 

The 2023 team had a Leadership dynamic that was clearly working.  My main concern for this season wasn't the Talent, but the changing culture/leadership of the team as we make a number of Player decisions.  Everyone can't play and when you're changing out players or it's clear you are changing out players you're going to change the dynamics of what's going on.  

 

Specifically for Adley, I'd guess this is stress. Since he arrived in May of 2022, he was viewed as the leader-type player...but he's doing that in the framework of an existing culture.  That culture is changing and he's likely being looked at in a bigger role that could certainly be manifesting it's self in the symptoms we see today.

 

Ultimately, this is on Elias because you do this with contracts.  They basically continue to push players decisions down the road and let rules of MLB kind of force their hand.  It's passive management of the roster, not active management of it.  We're kind of out of the window where you can be active (that passed with the trade deadline) so this is now an offseason discussion, although there are a couple things you could do now (contractually).

 

And it's not like we're talking 10/250M right now, we're talking a couple FA years at 25M.

 

I think you are if you want to sign him.   He's not going short on length right now.  I've suggested several structures in the past and would be ok with any of them today.  If you wanted to try and do one longer contract, something like 10/225 or 12/250 is probably the right number.  It's a 200+M guarantee for a catcher, it's likely short of some max career earnings perspective but you can structure it in some easy ways that would make it feel better.



#765 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 10:08 AM

As I said earlier in this thread. I'd like to see how he fares catching 50% or less of the time. Clearly his value diminishes if he's not catching. Like to see if there's a sweet spot for him.

#766 dude

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 10:12 AM

As I said earlier in this thread. I'd like to see how he fares catching 50% or less of the time. Clearly his value diminishes if he's not catching. Like to see if there's a sweet spot for him.

 

I think the real value of having quality offense at catcher is in the Playoffs.  Regardless of how much he catches in the regular season, he can catch every day in the Playoffs and that's where is value is maxed.

 

This is like investing...do you want to chase a stock with good fundamentals when it's highest or lower?



#767 Mackus

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 10:12 AM

Only reason I'd catch him less than he caught last season is if Basallo is also capable. I have zero interest in McCann or another backup quality catcher starting 60+ games. But I'm super excited about he and Basallo splitting C and DH between them. That'd be an insane duo for catcher and still really good for DH. Don't know if Basallo can handle even 60-80 games at catcher, though. He's an enormous kid.
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#768 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 10:43 AM


Only reason I'd catch him less than he caught last season is if Basallo is also capable. I have zero interest in McCann or another backup quality catcher starting 60+ games. But I'm super excited about he and Basallo splitting C and DH between them. That'd be an insane duo for catcher and still really good for DH. Don't know if Basallo can handle even 60-80 games at catcher, though. He's an enormous kid.


This would be ideal IF it's doable.

#769 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:38 PM

I still think Adley F'd up his swing trying to max out on HRs. Get him back to a better approach. 15 bombs a year but a higher BA and more walks
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#770 You Play to Win the Game

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:41 PM

I still think Adley F'd up his swing trying to max out on HRs. Get him back to a better approach. 15 bombs a year but a higher BA and more walks

Agreed. These hitting coaches can go IMO. They've fumbled this whole thing pretty badly across the board. We can point to runs scored and excuse it because of how well we've done in the grand scheme - but we're super talented and should be better. The approach is god awful, and the lack of adjustments in the 2nd half has ben even worst. They need to take a deep look at their operations in this department in the off-season. 



#771 BaltBird 24

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:43 PM

Adley isn't a huge power guy. Get on base, hit a ton of 2B's to the gap, pop 15-20 HRs a year.

#772 TwentyThirtyFive

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:49 PM

Agreed. These hitting coaches can go IMO. They've fumbled this whole thing pretty badly across the board. We can point to runs scored and excuse it because of how well we've done in the grand scheme - but we're super talented and should be better. The approach is god awful, and the lack of adjustments in the 2nd half has ben even worst. They need to take a deep look at their operations in this department in the off-season. 

It will be interesting to see how they approach all of their coaches at the higher levels. Ive wondered recently if Holt are  Ramsey are still held in such high regard. They may be, but Norfolk has mostly fell flat with its pitching.



#773 BaltBird 24

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:53 PM

Not a ton of talent in Norfolk. A lot of AAAA arms. The guys there viewed as actual prospects (Povich, McDermott, Young) have all performed well.

#774 Mackus

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 12:58 PM

I still think Adley F'd up his swing trying to max out on HRs. Get him back to a better approach. 15 bombs a year but a higher BA and more walks

He was hitting for both average and power through June, he just saw his walk rate cut in half (though still around league average).

The swing plane is part of the change, but the general approach to swing more often is an equal contributor to the differences we see.

#775 CantonJester

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 02:26 PM

My guess is he’s been playing with a mild hernia for much of the season. It’s affected his swing and yeah, you see the look on his face. The guy’s playing hurt. 



#776 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 02:42 PM

I still think Adley F'd up his swing trying to max out on HRs. Get him back to a better approach. 15 bombs a year but a higher BA and more walks

 

Said the same thing a few weeks ago.
Know I sound like an old man complaining about launch angle, but more line drives please. 
Several times a week he pops out with his bat path. 
He's talented enough to hit for a high average imo.  And I think if he had more doubles in the gap, he'd make up for any corresponding drop in homers with his slugging %.


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#777 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 02:44 PM

My guess is he’s been playing with a mild hernia for much of the season. It’s affected his swing and yeah, you see the look on his face. The guy’s playing hurt. 


If he's hurt, he gets credit for playing through it... I admire the desire of wanting to post up. 

But just like people have said in past years with Hays, if he's hurt enough that it's significantly hurting his play...then he is ultimately not doing the team any favors... team also isn't doing him any favors either.


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#778 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 02:55 PM

Agree totally with your last 2 posts Chris.

#779 Mackus

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 03:15 PM

Said the same thing a few weeks ago.
Know I sound like an old man complaining about launch angle, but more line drives please.
Several times a week he pops out with his bat path.
He's talented enough to hit for a high average imo. And I think if he had more doubles in the gap, he'd make up for any corresponding drop in homers with his slugging %.

Only counter to this is that with this changed swing plane, he was hitting for high average and power through June. It came at the cost of his walk rate (presumably...).

Maybe the July and August struggles are the swing, pitchers didn't figure out how to exploit it until July maybe and now everyone can? Or maybe it's unrelated.

If he could do damage like he did for the first 3 months plus get the walk rate back up, that's the ideal. I'd rather have '22-23 Adley to what we've seen in aggregate in '24, but not sure the equation is that simple.

#780 Mackus

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Posted 30 August 2024 - 03:19 PM


If he's hurt, he gets credit for playing through it... I admire the desire of wanting to post up.
But just like people have said in past years with Hays, if he's hurt enough that it's significantly hurting his play...then he is ultimately not doing the team any favors... team also isn't doing him any favors either.

The point and comparison to Hays is very apt (although this isn't a trend yet like it was for Hays), but if he's still better than McCann while banged up, then he is still helping the team. Sub-500 OPS in July would've been worse than McCann. 650ish or whatever it is in August is still better.

Unknowable question is could he have hit the IL for 2 weeks and be back near 100% after? Might be better off with that path in the long haul even if banged up Adley is still better than the backup.
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